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After finding out it was legal to open carry my unloaded handgun last night I decided to go ahead and do it.
Went out last night after confirming with the watch commander from Manteca PD that there were no city law/rules against open carry.
Went to the gas station in town, no problems, everyone nice... I also went to pack n save, same thing no problems... then off to In n Out. No problems.
Today I went off to Target to get some stuff, on my way out an off duty police officer called 911 and I was met by a very nice Manteca PD officer as I was about to get into my truck.
He asked if I had a badge and I told him no Im a paramedic.
I spoke with him and advised him that my gun was unloaded but my magazines weren't. The off duty officer came buy and told me that I was carrying a loaded weapon and I told him no I wasn't. He said a gun and ammo within close proximity ie arms reach was considered loaded. He said that if the on duty officer wouldnt arrest me that he would.
I advised / showed him the 12031 (g) law that states a firearm is considered loaded with bullet in chamber or magazine attached to gun etc etc... he stated that case law is superior to the PC. I then told him about People V Clark and he said that their was newer case law that said just having it on your person or in vicinity constitues loaded. He couldnt tell me when it was exactly or the case. That he knew more about the law than I did, that he wouldnt tell me how to do my job not to tell him how to do his. So I just kept quiet and didnt argue.
Showed the initial officer the Open Carry flyer http://www.paul.net/guns/CaliforniaOpenCarry.pdf that had the PC in it.
By then two more senior officers showed up saying that they should arrest me and said the same stuff about magazines in the vicinity or arms reach and that he should just arrest me and let the DA decide etc.
One of them was really pissed said this isnt the old west, that I was just looking to get killed or a fight. That the only people that should have guns were cops and that he didnt even want to have his. I was told to get a taser. etc etc... None of them in up to 20yrs of police work ever had this happen.
The off duty officer explained to me that he knows I have a right to defend myself but that I was just asking for trouble.
What if a rookie cop came up to me drew down on me or killed me. I didnt really respond to that because I am not trying to antagonistic
I told all of them that I went through Manteca PD CCW process and SJCo Sherrifs and was denied for lack of good cause. That I just found out yesterday that it was legal to open carry unloaded up until last night I carried my X26c taser. They said they would rather use that than a firearm.
Eventually the old timers calmed down... the initial officer called his Sgt and the Sgt told him it wasnt illegal for me to carry like I did or have my ammunition like I did.
The initial officer said he was going to file an incident report just saying that he talked with me about it.
Returned my firearm and I went about my buisness.
Might just go back to my taser. Not sure.
Funny how the only person/people in two days and 100 people seeing me open carry that had a problem was an off duty police officer and the old timers that showed up after the iniital officer contacted me.
If anyone passes this info along to Manteca PD and it reaches the initial on duty officer please thank him for me for his professionalism and good attitude.
Went out last night after confirming with the watch commander from Manteca PD that there were no city law/rules against open carry.
Went to the gas station in town, no problems, everyone nice... I also went to pack n save, same thing no problems... then off to In n Out. No problems.
Today I went off to Target to get some stuff, on my way out an off duty police officer called 911 and I was met by a very nice Manteca PD officer as I was about to get into my truck.
He asked if I had a badge and I told him no Im a paramedic.
I spoke with him and advised him that my gun was unloaded but my magazines weren't. The off duty officer came buy and told me that I was carrying a loaded weapon and I told him no I wasn't. He said a gun and ammo within close proximity ie arms reach was considered loaded. He said that if the on duty officer wouldnt arrest me that he would.
I advised / showed him the 12031 (g) law that states a firearm is considered loaded with bullet in chamber or magazine attached to gun etc etc... he stated that case law is superior to the PC. I then told him about People V Clark and he said that their was newer case law that said just having it on your person or in vicinity constitues loaded. He couldnt tell me when it was exactly or the case. That he knew more about the law than I did, that he wouldnt tell me how to do my job not to tell him how to do his. So I just kept quiet and didnt argue.
Showed the initial officer the Open Carry flyer http://www.paul.net/guns/CaliforniaOpenCarry.pdf that had the PC in it.
By then two more senior officers showed up saying that they should arrest me and said the same stuff about magazines in the vicinity or arms reach and that he should just arrest me and let the DA decide etc.
One of them was really pissed said this isnt the old west, that I was just looking to get killed or a fight. That the only people that should have guns were cops and that he didnt even want to have his. I was told to get a taser. etc etc... None of them in up to 20yrs of police work ever had this happen.
The off duty officer explained to me that he knows I have a right to defend myself but that I was just asking for trouble.
What if a rookie cop came up to me drew down on me or killed me. I didnt really respond to that because I am not trying to antagonistic
I told all of them that I went through Manteca PD CCW process and SJCo Sherrifs and was denied for lack of good cause. That I just found out yesterday that it was legal to open carry unloaded up until last night I carried my X26c taser. They said they would rather use that than a firearm.
Eventually the old timers calmed down... the initial officer called his Sgt and the Sgt told him it wasnt illegal for me to carry like I did or have my ammunition like I did.
The initial officer said he was going to file an incident report just saying that he talked with me about it.
Returned my firearm and I went about my buisness.
Might just go back to my taser. Not sure.
Funny how the only person/people in two days and 100 people seeing me open carry that had a problem was an off duty police officer and the old timers that showed up after the iniital officer contacted me.
If anyone passes this info along to Manteca PD and it reaches the initial on duty officer please thank him for me for his professionalism and good attitude.
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