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  • #46
    SkyHawk
    I need a LIFE!!
    • Sep 2012
    • 23525

    Straw purchase. LEOs have gone to jail for it. The form 4473 makes it clear. If you are not the actual transferee or buying it as a gift, you have made a false statement. If they can establish that you bought with the intent of selling it to a named person, it is a straw purchase. And they can also get you for dealing without a license if you had intentions to sell it when you bought it even if you didn't have a named buyer. LEOs in jail for this too.

    So to recap: straw purchase/making a false statement on the 4473, and dealing without a license - two very strong laws that keep the underground market you describe from happening. 10 years in Club Fed, loss of your 2A rights forever, loss of job and maybe family, is powerful motivation. Some people have tried it, they lost.

    And so you don't think this is just theoretical, here is one recent example:


    4:39 PM PDT Jun 11, 2015

    A former Sacramento County sheriff's deputy has been convicted of selling illegal guns.

    A federal jury on Thursday convicted Ryan McGowan of dealing firearms without a license and conspiracy to make a false statement in federal firearms records

    The U.S. Attorney's Office said the 33-year-old former deputy from Elk Grove was selling guns that can be obtained by law enforcement officers but are not on California's list of handguns approved for sale to the general public..
    Read the US Supreme Court decision on Abramski from last year regarding straw purchases if you want to know where things stand now on that topic - another former LEO turned felon, for doing everything on the up and up, all transfers through FFL etc: http://www.supremecourt.gov/opinions...-1493_5468.pdf

    All because he wanted to save his uncle a little money by getting the pistol at Blue Label price

    He lost on a split decision 5-4. That means 4 justices thought he was innocent, which sadly was one short.

    Cliff notes here: http://www.breitbart.com/big-governm...abiding-uncle/

    In 2009, Bruce Abramski went to a gun store at his home in Virginia and purchased a firearm. He filled out all the required federal paperwork providing his own name and identifying information and passing a federal background check. He then traveled to his uncle’s home in Pennsylvania and delivered the firearm to a licensed gun dealer there. Abramski’s uncle then filled out the same federal paperwork and passed his own background check before he could take possession.

    As part of that paperwork, Question 11a on Form 4473–created by the Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms, and Explosives (ATF)–asked whether you are the actual purchaser of the firearm (versus buying for another person). Abramski spoke to more than one gun dealer who said he could say he was the actual buyer.

    ...

    Nonetheless, the U.S. Court of Appeals for the Fourth Circuit in Richmond (with jurisdiction over the Mid-Atlantic states) agreed with two other federal appeals courts in holding that when Abramski checked the box affirming he was the purchaser, he committed a federal felony.
    Any more questions?
    Last edited by SkyHawk; 08-16-2015, 9:39 AM.
    Click here for my iTrader Feedback thread: https://www.calguns.net/forum/market...r-feedback-100

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    • #47
      StuckInTheP.R.O.Ca
      Veteran Member
      • Feb 2013
      • 2995

      Originally posted by uhlan1
      Hi, yea, me again. The LE exemption is not a loophole, something left to be exploited due to sloppy legislation. It was purposefully designed to allow LE exemptions as a political favor for your agencies and unions support of these laws, including the roster. It probably would not have passed without that support.

      I understand the chiefs who serve at the discretion of city leadership and sheriffs in liberal counties who rely on the electorate to keep their jobs. But I do not respect your unions who continually support these laws in return for favoritism. It was a conscious decision that benefited you at the expense of others, not something that just dropped into your lap. It's payola, pure and simple.

      Every time DeLeon gets on stage he's surrounded by supporting "I got mine" LE. Citizens in uniform with no skin in the fight.

      Yes, inequality drives me to distraction. It should drive you towards it as well. It is a class structure in the enjoyment of rights. But then, "you got yours".

      Why don't you LEO's start talking to your union leadership about withdrawing support for gun control laws? Again, yea, "you got yours", all you are concerned with.
      __________________________________________________ _____________




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      • #48
        FireCloud9
        Senior Member
        • Jun 2015
        • 792

        Thanks SkyHawk, yes, I do have other follow up questions, but I'll ask it in the other thread.

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        U.S. Army SGT 3ID 1st BN 30th IN Veteran DAV '84-'88 (Germany) | G43, P99C, PPS / PPQ M1 (Classic), HK P2000

        War Is a Racket by Two-time Medal of Honor recipient, USMC MG Smedley Butler

        Best Place to Retire

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