Should I apply for the FFL 01 or 07?

[RudyCakes]

I don't feel I need the 07 in all it's glory.
I realistically would only assemble some AR's to customer specs and then sell them. Do I need an 07 to do that? Or is that covered under the 01's general gunsmithing? Or should I just transfer the lower to myself and PPT the assembled AR to the customer?
My brain is in a knot.

[CS Sports]

If you are going to be buying lowers, assembling them , then offering for sale, you need an 07.

[BigMac]

And you have to register for IITAR.

[RudyCakes]

Sounds pretty cut and dry. So if I get an FFL I can never sell any of my assembled AR's?

[Ebola1282]

My ATF investigator told me anything that you transfer to your self you must keep on your books for 1 year before you can PPT it out. She also had said something to the extent of you need an 07 to assemble them and then sell however, if you sell your customer a stripped lower and parts kit, they leave your business and come back asking for "gunsmithing" then you can get away with an 01. Like CS Sports said if your going to be doing a lot of them, just get your 07. Regardless, make sure to double check everything (I'm new at the FFL game only having my 01 for a month now, so I could be wrong with my information...)

[RudyCakes]

Thanks guys. 07 it is then.

[efillc]

And you have to register for IITAR.

Pssst, there's only one I in ITAR.
PMDDTC ITAR Registration

[kemasa]

My ATF investigator told me anything that you transfer to your self you must keep on your books for 1 year before you can PPT it out.

A PPT is a state thing, not Federal, which is why each should not comment on the other.

If you transfer a firearm to yourself without filling out a 4473, then you have to run it through your bound book if you sell it before a year (and you still have to log it if you sell it after a year). Since a PPT is run through your bound book, you can do it as a PPT, but you can not do a PPT elsewhere since it would not be running it through your bound book.

[novalondon]

do the 01FFL unless your indepentantly wealthy.
Libility insurance to cover the gun that blows up and injures the shooter that you built(only takes one to really hurt the pocketbook for the rest of your life),
the ITAR annual fees,
the shop needs,
the insurance for the shop,
the rent for the shop as it is probably going to be a commerical setup not home stuff in Cali.
As a 01FFL you can do all the gunsmith work and building for customers with their parts brought to you.

[RudyCakes]

do the 01FFL unless your indepentantly wealthy.
Libility insurance to cover the gun that blows up and injures the shooter that you built(only takes one to really hurt the pocketbook for the rest of your life),
the ITAR annual fees,
the shop needs,
the insurance for the shop,
the rent for the shop as it is probably going to be a commerical setup not home stuff in Cali.
As a 01FFL you can do all the gunsmith work and building for customers with their parts brought to you.

I spoke to the ATF today. I was painstakingly clear about the following: If I assemble an AR from a stripped lower THEN offer it for sale, I need an 07. If I SELL a stripped lower and the customer returns the next day for me to assemble it for him for $ then I'm cover under the general gunsmithing of the 01. If I do ANY kind of Duracoat/Cerakote or refinishing on any firearm other than my own, I need an 07. (That surprised me.) And finally, the ITAR is only needed if I'm going to be exporting internationally.
So I'll be getting the 07 mostly to be able to offer the Cerakote. And my assets are protected by an LLC, owned by a Corp, owned by me.

[RudyCakes]

Dept of State wants as many people to pay that fee as possible. That being said,the only fines or charges that can be brought are for EXPORTING without registration. The ATF could care less because thats someone else's department. The Dept of State has no one to enforce the ITAR except Customs. And Customs only works at borders, ports and points of entry. I've emailed all this to my lawyer friends. They'll take a look at it for us. I have some friend that manufacture ammo in NJ and they have never paid the ITAR. They know what it is but are sure they are exempt because they don't export.
Oh yeah, I forgot to mention there are exemptions.

[efillc]

If I do ANY kind of Duracoat/Cerakote or refinishing on any firearm other than my own, I need an 07.(That surprised me.)

It's also in direct conflict with ATF Ruling 2009-1:

http://www.atf.gov/regulations-rulings/rulings/atf-rulings/atf-ruling-2009-1.pdf

And finally, the ITAR is only needed if I'm going to be exporting internationally.

False. ATF has no jurisdiction over ITAR and often gives out incorrect information about it as the regulations are written by the Department of State. Violations are investigated by the Department of Homeland Security (specifically ICE), not by Customs. Customs only handles imports.

http://www.ice.gov/firearms-explosives-smuggling/

[RudyCakes]

It's also in direct conflict with ATF Ruling 2009-1:

http://www.atf.gov/regulations-rulings/rulings/atf-rulings/atf-ruling-2009-1.pdf

False. ATF has no jurisdiction over ITAR and often gives out incorrect information about it as the regulations are written by the Department of State. Violations are investigated by the Department of Homeland Security (specifically ICE), not by Customs. Customs only handles imports.
http://www.ice.gov/firearms-explosives-smuggling/

I was under the impression that ICE was Customs.
And I agree that the ATF link you provided is completely opposite what the ATF agent told me. I asked him the same question in multiple ways to be clear on what he was saying. I frustrated the hell out of him.
So I take it you are an 07. So maybe you can answer my original question. Also, do you pay the ITAR reg? I've been scouring the net and you would be the first I've come across that actually pays it. Theres guy that have been operating 15+ years without it and nobody's made a peep.
Which makes sense because the I in ITAR is for International.

[dctex99]

well I seee now people get away with alot of different stuff;;;waaaaaaay to many fingers in this pot!! I will stick to something simple like selling dynamite to kids....lol

[efillc]

I was under the impression that ICE was Customs.
And I agree that the ATF link you provided is completely opposite what the ATF agent told me. I asked him the same question in multiple ways to be clear on what he was saying. I frustrated the hell out of him.
So I take it you are an 07. So maybe you can answer my original question. Also, do you pay the ITAR reg? I've been scouring the net and you would be the first I've come across that actually pays it. Theres guy that have been operating 15+ years without it and nobody's made a peep.
Which makes sense because the I in ITAR is for International.

ICE is under DHS, usually what people refer to as "Customs" is CBP. They are both sub-agencies under DHS. One investigates export violations, the other import violations.

Unfortunately as a DoD contractor we can't avoid paying ITAR. Also, failure to register is "only" a $100k fine, where the fines for playing fast and loose with the export laws are in the seven-figure range.