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  • #31
    Sunday
    Calguns Addict
    • Jan 2010
    • 5574

    Originally posted by CaliforniaLiberal
    Is this a one sided conversation or do you hear God's voice in reply?

    How shall I participate in a relationship when I am the only one talking?
    Maybe you should be quiet enough to hear.
    California's politicians and unionized government employees are a crime gang that makes the Mexican drug cartels look like a Girl Scout Troop in comparison.

    Comment

    • #32
      California44
      Senior Member
      • Nov 2012
      • 1092

      You seem pretty smart. First believe, then surrender. Everything else just falls in place. Its not complicated.

      Comment

      • #33
        Barang
        CGN Contributor
        • Aug 2013
        • 13319

        Originally posted by CaliforniaLiberal
        One part of Christian belief that has always puzzled me is the concept of Prayer. If you please, could you enlighten me?

        Prayer is communiction between God and you. It's like having conversation with your earthly father.


        In times past I have prayed when feeling in despair and grief. It seemed to have no effect that I could detect.
        How does it work? Is there one correct way to perform prayer? How is an all powerful God swayed by prayer?

        To know God and how He answers sometimes requires bible reading. You will find a lot about God and know His plan and will for you.

        Have I been praying incorrectly?

        Make sure it's not a selfish one.

        If you are in a life and death situation and you plead with every atom or your being for protection and assistance but forget to add "In Jesus Name, Amen" at the end of your prayer is it less effective?

        Now, this is interesting. If you pray everyday, praying in Jesus name comes naturally without even thinking about it. This goes to show how much time one spend praying to the Father ending in Jesus name of course.

        If, in your terror, you promise to lead a lifetime of piety and strict observance but forget your promise after surviving, will you punished?

        Yes! better not to vow and not do it. There was a story about this situation in old testament.... just can't remember the book and chapter.

        If God already knows everything you think and feel, everything about your circumstances, does he still wait to be asked to give you what you need?

        Would you like your child not to ask you for anything?

        How do requests from humans change God's course of action that he would have followed without having heard the prayer?

        N/A.

        I guess the big question is - If God is Omniscient, Omnipotent, and Omnibenevolent, wouldn't he already be doing everything for you that he can?
        That's the same as spoiling a child. Not good!

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        • #34
          bigmike82
          Bit Pusher
          CGN Contributor
          • Jan 2008
          • 3876

          From a less doctrinal standpoint, prayer can be spiritually calming. Not because you hear voices or anything, but because it allows you to pour out your fears and hurts into a sympathetic audience. It can also be similar to meditation or deep thought in a sense.
          -- 09 F9 11 02 9D 74 E3 5B D8 41 56 C5 63 56 88 C0

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          • #35
            bigmike82
            Bit Pusher
            CGN Contributor
            • Jan 2008
            • 3876

            To be more doctrinal about it, see here:



            Prayer is not about getting what you want. It's not about asking for a thing, or for something to happen. It's simply...talking (or communing, as the Catechism states).
            -- 09 F9 11 02 9D 74 E3 5B D8 41 56 C5 63 56 88 C0

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            • #36
              pbsmind
              Senior Member
              • Jun 2011
              • 527

              Ask Pastor John just did a post about prayer:

              Pray because God tells us to. Pray because it increases our joy. Pray because the sovereign ruler of the universe makes things happen through prayer.
              "He is no fool who gives what he cannot keep to gain that which he cannot lose." - Jim Elliot

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              • #37
                mattymatt
                Member
                • Mar 2009
                • 490

                As far as I can tell this is the cover all bases religion does with it's doctrine. If things go your way, God answered your prayers and if it doesn't, well, that's Gods will. You can tell me all day prayer makes a difference but if it did, you wouldn't need a "cover all bases" type of rule.

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                • #38
                  sonofeugene
                  Veteran Member
                  • Oct 2013
                  • 4653

                  Originally posted by Aces and 8s
                  Short answer...

                  It doesn't.
                  This. Or it only works if you believe it does. But keep in mind that belief does not make something true.
                  Let us not pray to be sheltered from dangers but to be fearless when facing them. - Rabindranath Tagore

                  A mind all logic is like a knife all blade. It makes the hand bleed that uses it. - Rabindranath Tagore

                  Talent hits a target no one else can hit. Genius hits a target no one else can see. - Arthur Schopenhaur

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                  • #39
                  • #40
                    spectre-9
                    Member
                    • Oct 2010
                    • 384

                    Originally posted by Lineman101
                    God has provided a way for mankind, including you, to know Him. He hasn't forced Himself on you. While He desires for you to have relationship, He doesn't force it. We believe as Christians that all things work for our good. Nothing happens to us without it passing through Him; good or bad.

                    You have the choice to reject. Good luck with that decision.
                    He offers you a choice, then tells you that if you make the wrong choice you'll spend eternity in conscious torment. It's extortion.

                    Comment

                    • #41
                      RAMCLAP
                      Veteran Member
                      • Nov 2012
                      • 2954

                      It's only extortion if you're not guilty. Since we are all rebels against the Most High, it is justice.
                      Last edited by RAMCLAP; 10-08-2014, 6:57 PM. Reason: sp
                      Psalm 103
                      Mojave Lever Crew

                      Comment

                      • #42
                        mossy
                        Calguns Addict
                        • Dec 2007
                        • 7423

                        Originally posted by spectre-9
                        He offers you a choice, then tells you that if you make the wrong choice you'll spend eternity in conscious torment. It's extortion.
                        extortion would be the correct word for it in any other situation but because its "god"................
                        best troll thread in calguns history
                        http://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/s...d.php?t=406739



                        burn the circus down cuz the world is full of clowns

                        Comment

                        • #43
                          Not a Cook
                          Senior Member
                          • Mar 2013
                          • 1684

                          Originally posted by spectre-9
                          He offers you a choice, then tells you that if you make the wrong choice you'll spend eternity in conscious torment. It's extortion.
                          Hmm... more like this: "The Scriptures tell us that we're condemned already because of our sins and that we deserve to be destroyed. They also tell us that God graciously offers us salvation through Christ, through Whom we can be forgiven and receive eternal life and spend eternity with Him in His kingdom. He tells us to choose salvation, life, and blessing, but allows us to foolishly choose death, curses, and destruction instead."

                          God isn't extorting anyone. He's warned us that we're heading toward destruction and He's graciously offering us to save us. If you choose to continue toward the destruction He's already warned you about, and you are then ultimately destroyed, then that's your choice - but it isn't some form of extortion by God.

                          Here's what God told the Israelites in Deuteronomy 30:15-20 (NKJV),
                          See, I have set before you today life and good, death and evil, in that I command you today to love the Lord your God, to walk in His ways, and to keep His commandments, His statutes, and His judgments, that you may live and multiply; and the Lord your God will bless you in the land which you go to possess. But if your heart turns away so that you do not hear, and are drawn away, and worship other gods and serve them, I announce to you today that you shall surely perish; you shall not prolong your days in the land which you cross over the Jordan to go in and possess. I call heaven and earth as witnesses today against you, that I have set before you life and death, blessing and cursing; therefore choose life, that both you and your descendants may live; that you may love the Lord your God, that you may obey His voice, and that you may cling to Him, for He is your life and the length of your days; and that you may dwell in the land which the Lord swore to your fathers, to Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob, to give them.”

                          BTW, this may throw you for a loop: where in the Scriptures do you see "conscious torment"?
                          Regarding the 2nd Amendment:
                          "...to disarm the people ― that was the best and most effectual way to enslave them." George Mason ("The Father of the Bill of Rights")

                          Regarding Life and Death:
                          "Do not fear those who kill the body but are unable to kill the soul; but rather fear Him who is able to destroy both soul and body in hell." Matthew 10:28

                          The BIG question: "What shall I do then with Jesus which is called Christ?" Matthew 27:22b

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                          • #44
                            spectre-9
                            Member
                            • Oct 2010
                            • 384

                            Originally posted by RAMCLAP
                            It's only extortion if you're not guilty. Since we are all rebels against the Most High, it is justice.
                            Right, so infinite punishment for simply believing the wrong thing for a finite period of time is just.

                            And what exactly are we guilty of? How are we rebels?

                            Comment

                            • #45
                              RAMCLAP
                              Veteran Member
                              • Nov 2012
                              • 2954

                              3 “You shall have no other gods before[a] me.

                              4 “You shall not make for yourself an image in the form of anything in heaven above or on the earth beneath or in the waters below. 5 You shall not bow down to them or worship them; for I, the Lord your God, am a jealous God, punishing the children for the sin of the parents to the third and fourth generation of those who hate me, 6 but showing love to a thousand generations of those who love me and keep my commandments.

                              7 “You shall not misuse the name of the Lord your God, for the Lord will not hold anyone guiltless who misuses his name.

                              8 “Remember the Sabbath day by keeping it holy. 9 Six days you shall labor and do all your work, 10 but the seventh day is a sabbath to the Lord your God. On it you shall not do any work, neither you, nor your son or daughter, nor your male or female servant, nor your animals, nor any foreigner residing in your towns. 11 For in six days the Lord made the heavens and the earth, the sea, and all that is in them, but he rested on the seventh day. Therefore the Lord blessed the Sabbath day and made it holy.

                              12 “Honor your father and your mother, so that you may live long in the land the Lord your God is giving you.

                              13 “You shall not murder.

                              14 “You shall not commit adultery.

                              15 “You shall not steal.

                              16 “You shall not give false testimony against your neighbor.

                              17 “You shall not covet your neighbor’s house. You shall not covet your neighbor’s wife, or his male or female servant, his ox or donkey, or anything that belongs to your neighbor.”

                              Violated any of these? Then you are a rebel.
                              Psalm 103
                              Mojave Lever Crew

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