Has Jesus's material message been misinterpreted?

[justMike]

Leaving the salvation of our souls to another discussion, this fellow believes so Jesus message had a more material aspect also. :

https://www.nakedcapitalism.com/2017/12/michael-hudson-died-debt-not-sins.html

[billvau]

If his Jesus can get financial debts forgiven, there'd be a lot more worshippers of him.

He starts with a dictionary approach to interpretation (take a word, ignore the context, and pick the meaning you want it to be), then puts on his debt-colored glasses and interprets the whole Bible from his debt-forgiveness perspective. Just a little biased.

Jesus Christ paid my real debt.

[Just Dave]

There's so much wrong with that article I don't know where to begin

[WASR10]

It is very common for people to confuse spiritual matters with physical matters. It creates oh so many problems.

[TrailerparkTrash]

[colossians323]

I feel like I was saved from wasting my time. Thanks for treading the water guys

[damon1272]

So much fail in that article. Really? Jesus was a socialist? Amazing how they contort Christ message to fit their own.

[justMike]

It is very common for people to confuse spiritual matters with physical matters. It creates oh so many problems.

I suppose yes. If only we were disembodied spirit beings "physical matters" would not be relevant and make for those 'so many problems'. The fact is we must deal with physical existence.
Interesting how the only facts cared about are the 'facts' presented in the Bible. Much of the Bible seems to be confirmed by academic and archeological investigations, but to reflexively decide that
it is the complete factual picture is just y'alls exercising of 'faith'. More went on in those times than was recorded in the Bible, but you don't care about much of any of that unless it confirms your preexisting beliefs.
Would the spiritual message of Jesus be changed if he were in fact a proponent of (as we know it today) Socialism? Your collective (apparently) conservative cultural biases seem to reflexively judge collective living
as somehow un-compatible with Christ's message.

As it turns out, the economic scene of thr Roman Empire at the time of Christ was very surprisingly much like our own.
(If you care for an overview, see here: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Roman_economy )
So yes, being in / having large debts was a likely on the minds of people then.

Jesus is / was easily seen as a radical progressive in those days. Can be seen as one now except for the aforementioned co-opting / corrupting of his message to conveniently de-emphasis on material / 'physical matters'.
This piece says it better than I could, challenge to your biases and comprehension skills and check it out. Or, continue to let others decide how you are supposed to think, its so much easier.

https://www.theodysseyonline.com/christians-progressive?utm_expid=.oW2L-b3SQF-m5a-dPEU77g.0&utm_referrer=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.google.com%2F

[WASR10]

I suppose yes. If only we were disembodied spirit beings "physical matters" would not be relevant and make for those 'so many problems'. The fact is we must deal with physical existence.
Interesting how the only facts cared about are the 'facts' presented in the Bible. Much of the Bible seems to be confirmed by academic and archeological investigations, but to reflexively decide that
it is the complete factual picture is just y'alls exercising of 'faith'. More went on in those times than was recorded in the Bible, but you don't care about much of any of that unless it confirms your preexisting beliefs.
Would the spiritual message of Jesus be changed if he were in fact a proponent of (as we know it today) Socialism? Your collective (apparently) conservative cultural biases seem to reflexively judge collective living
as somehow un-compatible with Christ's message.

As it turns out, the economic scene of thr Roman Empire at the time of Christ was very surprisingly much like our own.
(If you care for an overview, see here: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Roman_economy )
So yes, being in / having large debts was a likely on the minds of people then.

Jesus is / was easily seen as a radical progressive in those days. Can be seen as one now except for the aforementioned co-opting / corrupting of his message to conveniently de-emphasis on material / 'physical matters'.
This piece says it better than I could, challenge to your biases and comprehension skills and check it out. Or, continue to let others decide how you are supposed to think, its so much easier.

https://www.theodysseyonline.com/chr....google.com%2F

You assume way too much about me and my comment. It seems you have an axe to grind with someone.

My comment does not discount the real social, political, and economical climate of the New Testament period.

But it is clear and evident that Jesus concerned himself with matters of the soul and of the heart, not so much matters of the body and the wallet. He was not a social justice warrior, no matter how much some people today would hope. Please consider the following passages:

- John 18:36

- Matthew 6:25-33

[justMike]

Wasr10,
While I used your comment as a point to start from, the 'your' pronoun was used in reference to all the commenters in this thread. If the shoe doesn't fit no need to wear it.

Still no one addresses the underlined question. If Jesus had been a Socialist, would it have made any difference? Adherents seem to want it both ways. If I say Jesus was not about here, but the hereafter, this gets an argument otherwise. But by Jesus's own words you quote, it could be read that even if your life is misery and pain, as long as you trust in Jesus all will be well with your spirit (possibly not mattering if your life of misery led you into sin) as long as Jesus is in your last thoughts as you pass this mortal coil. Is that Matthew 6:25-33 part of the currently fashionable Prosperity preaching? Seemed to work that way for the Calvanists too. So many wars and shedding of blood, burning of heretics etc. took place in the name of differing Christian denominations in the 16th century Reformation. Physical matters seemed to be at the forefront of all that, No? Of course we are all better than that now, right?

[Alan Block]

In Judaism it was tradition to forgive debts after 7 years. The practice was called Shemittah.

[Sailormilan2]

In Judaism it was tradition to forgive debts after 7 years. The practice was called Shemittah.

Not to mention the Jubilee Year. Debts forgiven, slaves freed, and land returned to original owners.
There are a couple of points I agree with in the article, but on the whole, I am not sure about it.

[WASR10]

Wasr10,
While I used your comment as a point to start from, the 'your' pronoun was used in reference to all the commenters in this thread. If the shoe doesn't fit no need to wear it.

Still no one addresses the underlined question. If Jesus had been a Socialist, would it have made any difference? Adherents seem to want it both ways. If I say Jesus was not about here, but the hereafter, this gets an argument otherwise. But by Jesus's own words you quote, it could be read that even if your life is misery and pain, as long as you trust in Jesus all will be well with your spirit (possibly not mattering if your life of misery led you into sin) as long as Jesus is in your last thoughts as you pass this mortal coil. Is that Matthew 6:25-33 part of the currently fashionable Prosperity preaching? Seemed to work that way for the Calvanists too. So many wars and shedding of blood, burning of heretics etc. took place in the name of differing Christian denominations in the 16th century Reformation. Physical matters seemed to be at the forefront of all that, No? Of course we are all better than that now, right?

[Not a Cook]

Still no one addresses the underlined question. If Jesus had been a Socialist, would it have made any difference?

Since we're speaking hypothetically, I have a question for you: what if there were no hypothetical questions?

[theLBC]

Wasr10,
While I used your comment as a point to start from, the 'your' pronoun was used in reference to all the commenters in this thread. If the shoe doesn't fit no need to wear it.

Still no one addresses the underlined question. If Jesus had been a Socialist, would it have made any difference? Adherents seem to want it both ways. If I say Jesus was not about here, but the hereafter, this gets an argument otherwise. But by Jesus's own words you quote, it could be read that even if your life is misery and pain, as long as you trust in Jesus all will be well with your spirit (possibly not mattering if your life of misery led you into sin) as long as Jesus is in your last thoughts as you pass this mortal coil. Is that Matthew 6:25-33 part of the currently fashionable Prosperity preaching? Seemed to work that way for the Calvanists too. So many wars and shedding of blood, burning of heretics etc. took place in the name of differing Christian denominations in the 16th century Reformation. Physical matters seemed to be at the forefront of all that, No? Of course we are all better than that now, right?

remember people used to pay for absolution

i would prefer to think of the idea of absolution as a ruse to fool sinners into repenting and reforming.

why? child molesters and rapists and murderers should burn in hell, if there is such a thing, no matter what pleas they make as they see the lights dimming.
of course, if there is a god, i don't think he's be fooled by them trying to sneak into heaven anyway.