Does the disinformation AMAZE you??

[lavgrunt]

There has always been a certain degree of disinformation spread around the various forums on 'CalGuns' vis-a-vis contacts and dealings with LE Officers, especially over the last few months. You know what I'm talking about; what to say/what not to say on car stops, especially if you have guns in the car; when we can search/when we can't; can you lie to a cop/can you not; the 12031 checks; 'officer safety' trumps constitutional rights; etc. etc.

.......and the usual disclaimers, "........I'm not anti-LEO.....But......"

Do you usually respond to these types of posts? Are you concerned about giving up 'trade secrets' ? Do you ever discuss certain tactical considerations? Whats your threshold ??

The way I see it, we are all in this together and as fellow gun owners, we share a common love for a passionate hobby. If we can help someone to stay out of trouble, based on our own experiences and 'reality based application of the law,' we should share it and if someone chooses to ignore you or tells you how 'wrong you are and you don't know s**t.......' then that's on them.......you tried..........

I dunno.......I'm not saying we should give 'legal advice'......that's already been covered.....but maybe a simple, "........Dude, that's a bad idea....and here's why" or "......Yea, that's what the law says, but here's the reality......."

I would never, under any circumstances give up tactics or any other trade-craft.........

I just think we have a responsibilty to help people out, that's all..................

[yzErnie]

I'll post occasionally in those types of threads but not very often. Some people have their opinions and no amount of reasoning will educate them. That's ok though, I know my men and I do the right things and that is all that matters to me.

When I do post, I'm very careful about how I word things. I never talk about officer safety or what our protocols are on those topics. It is my opinion that we want to educate the public but some give out to much info.

[r3dn3ck]

What people want is to know how to generally maintain their rights without irking the enforcement team into using exigence or some other gray area catchall to have you delete their rights. How to live their lives without having to know by rote every single idiotic ordinance that various levels of lawmakers craft up. I have a few opinions on the matter but suffice it to say: it's not your fault individually as cops, people will always break the law and try to get away with it because it's natural, all they really want is a simple answer to an impossibly complicated question. A bit like the grand unified theory of law evasion, something simple they can put on a postage stamp, remember, use and never go to jail or get a ticket.

People want their cake and they want to eat it too.

I personally don't dig on a good lot of the cadre that came on after 9/11. It's too full of hotheads. I won't say even half are that way but it takes so few to really screw up an image and it takes even fewer ignoring that intrusive iron-fisted bully-ish temperament to legitimize it as widespread in the eyes of the citizenry. Equally, the people and LEA's that expect cops to "protect" people are half the problem. The job description was hard enough before someone doubled it with that one word.

EDIT: My advice to cops would be to keep the above in mind about those posts. If someone is asking how to not run afoul of you, be specific and correct on what's legal. Don't bother with procedures, nobody cares. They care what stops the detain/search/ticket/arrest/etc..

[DaveInOroValley]

Personally I tend to stay away from posting anything in regard to that. I'll read them but that's about it.

[IrishJoe3]

I usually sit back and just LMAO

[Mongoblack23]

What people want is to know how to generally maintain their rights without irking the enforcement team into using exigence or some other gray area catchall to have you delete their rights. How to live their lives without having to know by rote every single idiotic ordinance that various levels of lawmakers craft up...

^^^ this ^^^

i dont want to get away with breaking the law, i simply dont want to break the law in the first place.....

[cacop]

I'll post to fullfill my "officer friendly" side if it isn't too of whack but a lot of times I can't even muster the energy to finish reading more than a few posts.

I work in hippieville so I am used to that sort of thing. I'll educate to try to save myself from extra work but if they don't like the answer they hear then it is Plan B. Plan B around here is to ignore them.

[Ron-Solo]

I usually end up hitting the "report" button because all of those threads devolve into an anti-LE slam fest.

[SVT-40]

I like to poke em with a stick.

But seriously, a honest question deserves an honest answer.

The rest don't deserve squat.

Because no matter how reasonable you are they will never be able to escape from their narrow mindset and actually try and understand what it's like to walk in our shoes.

I'm not saying any LEO is superman, because were are not. We are (or were ) just good guys trying to make sense of situations where there can be no sense or reason.

It's just such a different type of job than anything most folks could really comprehend without having been there.

[BigDogatPlay]

I like to poke em with a stick.

But seriously, a honest question deserves an honest answer.

The rest don't deserve squat.

Because no matter how reasonable you are they will never be able to escape from their narrow mindset and actually try and understand what it's like to walk in our shoes.

I'm not saying any LEO is superman, because were are not. We are (or were ) just good guys trying to make sense on situations where there can be no sense or reason.

It's just such a different type of job than anything most folks could really comprehend without having been there.

+1... and well said.

[1911su16b870]

At first I was trying to post some helpfully info...then the thread takes a dump and now I open, read and ignore.

My perception of late is there is a general anti LEO vibe in many of the "LE advice" posts.

The 11357 and DUI threads come to mind. It also appears that anonymous posting somehow relieves folks of personal responsibility.

[oddjob]

I find my self responding less and less to those inquiries/threads. Some of these folks are just "Francis types" (from the movie "Stripes") and get all wound up. Some of the responses are nothing more than a cheap shot. It seems as though "Francis" can't respond in a logical (legal) manner.

Rarely during an issue LEO is asked asked "how" law enforcement arrives to their conclusion. What is asked is the conclusion itself. Answer is given and the comments start. In court its objected to and referred to as a "conclusionary statement without basis of facts." Now I suppose LEO (including me) could start educating these folks by setting a foundation prior to the final answer, but I've come to the conclusion its simply not worth it. If I feel like responding I will give what I think is the proper response and leave it at that.

The other issue here is most Cal Gun people don't realize that LEO's might spend maybe 1% to 3% percent of their time looking at gun violations (an educated guess). Bureau of Firearms LEO's are dedicated to firearms cases, but overall in California I'm probably close. For a local police department or sheriff's department there are far more pressing issues that need to be dealt with especially in today's financial climate. What I mean by gun violations is not the drug dealer who has guns....but the gun violation itself.

Quite honestly the legal responses I have read here on this forum from LEO's have been pretty much correct. It would benefit this forum for LEO's to honestly answer inquiries, but I'm afraid honesty is not whats wanted. Its "assurance" whats wanted.

I remember working with a high ranking Director/Chief and all he wanted was "yes" people under him. He felt good for awhile and then the walls came in on him. He eventually had to leave. His secretary later told me he thought the "yes" people were correct, but they were not. The management folks just gave him the answers he wanted to hear.

As in the words of Sgt Hulka...... "Lighten up Francis!" We are all 2nd Amendment supporters here.

[TRICKSTER]

I try to educate people and give them the honest truth, but after dealing with one of these threads last night, and watching the OP ignore parts of my answer to his question and rapidly turn it into a thread bashing LEO's, I have given up. I have come to the conclusion that many people here don't want to hear the truth, they just want an excuse to bash law enforcement.

[Notorious]

I try to educate people and give them the honest truth, but after dealing with one of these threads last night, and watching the OP ignore parts of my answer to his question and rapidly turn it into a thread bashing LEO's, I have given up. I have come to the conclusion that many people here don't want to hear the truth, they just want an excuse to bash law enforcement.

I try to add to the misinformation by blowing up the misinformation even more out of proportion to anything resembling the truth.

[Trigger Finger]

The results you get in a forum like this is not surprising, considering most of the responders are not LEO's.

What really amazes me is all the disinformation on U.F.O.s. That's the bigger question.

Also "disinformation" implies that the poster is knowingly posting wrong or deceiving information!! I don't know if much of that is occurring or it's just uninformed wanabees trying to sound like a know it all cop.