LEOSA v. CCW

[Rogue187]

Can anyone shed some light on this topic?

I recently retired and am still waiting for my LEOSA card.

In the meantime, while I wait, would it be good thing to apply for a CCW?

I know that with the LEOSA I can carry pretty much anywhere.

But would a CCW be a better thing to have in my pocket since CA has a CCW that covers California?

The LEOSA is good for covering the rest of the states.

Any guidance is appreciated. Thanks in advance.

You can PM me or post your replies.

[SVT-40]

What's the hold up with your old agency issuing you a LEOSA card?

Have you shot the required LEOSA qualifications course yet?

Find out from other retirees at your department what they did, and follow their instructions.

A CCW issued by the PD or SO where you live will take many months..

[FootPursuit]

Definitely just wait for your LEOSA card. What?s the hold up with that? Some agency?s ?retired? card acts as the LEOSA ID. You just need to qual

The LEOSA card gives you more freedom in what you can carry/where you can carry

Plus on a t-stop, I?d like to know if you were retired, rather than just a regular CCW holder.


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[mossy]

Go with LEOSA. Valid in all 50 states and doesn't limit you on what you can carry/ limit the guns you can carry to ones listed on the CCW.

[Rustlin’ Jack]

As others said, LEOSA best for interstate travel. Having a CCW from your former department has several California benefits that LEOSA does not have. Two that are good to have are access to Federal parks in California, and the other covers in and around schools in the Gun Free Safe School Zones. LEOSA does not help with those.

If you can, keep both current.

[TrailerparkTrash]

My agency just gives you a retired ID card that states something like “CCW approved” or something to that effect. I don’t recall because I’m not retired just yet.

What validates the “retired LE I.D.” as LEOSA, is passing the cheesy-easy annual “10-round hit the PAPER at 15 yards, no time limit” qualification. That’s it, total joke. If you pass, they give a little card to carry with your Id, showing that your qualification is current, per the LEOSA law and that you’re good for another year of ccw.

[Rogue187]

My agency is a Federal one.

I retired and prior to retiring, I submitted my retirement package to DC.
The person handling the LEOSA called and said they don't process till you retire.

I retired at the end of the year.

The person handling the retirement LEOSA also retired. So they had a new person take over that function.

I got an email from the person at the end of January and asked for passport pics again. I sent them electronically. So now I'm just waiting for the card.

My retired creds and badge and LEOSA should be coming soon.

I also reached out to a local department and they told me once my LEOSA arrives when they do retired quals and to show up.

[SDDAVE56]

My agency just gives you a retired ID card that states something like ?CCW approved? or something to that effect. I don?t recall because I?m not retired just yet.

What validates the ?retired LE I.D.? as LEOSA, is passing the cheesy-easy annual ?10-round hit the PAPER at 15 yards, no time limit? qualification. That?s it, total joke. If you pass, they give a little card to carry with your Id, showing that your qualification is current, per the LEOSA law and that you?re good for another year of ccw.

My ID has the following on it. "CCW Qualified per 18 USC Sec. 926 C".

[P5Ret]

As others said, LEOSA best for interstate travel. Having a CCW from your former department has several California benefits that LEOSA does not have. Two that are good to have are access to Federal parks in California, and the other covers in and around schools in the Gun Free Safe School Zones. LEOSA does not help with those.

If you can, keep both current.

Citation for federal parks.

Also I'm fairly confident that 626.9 (o) covers retirees for GFSZ.

(o) This section does not apply to an honorably retired peace officer authorized to carry a concealed or loaded firearm pursuant to any of the following:
(1) Article 2 (commencing with Section 25450) of Chapter 2 of Division 5 of Title 4 of Part 6.

(2) Section 25650.

(3) Sections 25900 to 25910, inclusive.

(4) Section 26020.

(5) Paragraph (2) of subdivision (c) of Section 26300.

[Rustlin’ Jack]

You can ccw in a National Park if the park is in the same state as the one where the ccw has been issued, or honors reciprocity. If the ccw is from California, then Yosemite is good to go. Crater Lake in Oregon is not, as Oregon does not recognize a California ccw license.

https://www.nps.gov/articles/firearms-in-national-parks.htm

Firearms in National Parks
Possession of Firearms in National Park Units

In areas administered by the National Park Service, an individual can possess a firearm if that individual is not otherwise prohibited by law from possessing the firearm and if the possession of the firearm complies with the laws of the state where the park area is located. 54 U.S.C. 104906.

It is the responsibility of visitors to understand and comply with all applicable Federal, state and local firearms laws and regulations, including laws authorizing or prohibiting concealed carry, before entering a national park. Some parks are located in more than one state or locality which means that the applicable laws may change depending upon where you are located within a park area.

If a park is located in a jurisdiction where the applicable state and local laws grant reciprocity to non-resident firearm owners, then consistent with the applicable law, the park will equally recognize the reciprocity. For information on state and local laws, please contact the state and locality where the park is located.

https://le.nra.org/understanding-leosa/off-limit-areas/

The exemptions for these areas (36 C.F.R. ?? 2.4(e) & (h), 18 U.S.C. ? 922(q)) allow for individuals carrying concealed in accordance with the laws of the state in which the federal park or GFSZ is located to carry concealed in them*; however, an individual carrying under LEOSA is carrying under FEDERAL LAW and not in accordance with the laws of the state they are in. What this means is that you are NOT exempted from carrying a concealed firearm in these areas UNLESS you are on official duty or possess a valid and qualifying state issued concealed carry permit.

Citation for federal parks.

Also I'm fairly confident that 626.9 (o) covers retirees for GFSZ.

(o) This section does not apply to an honorably retired peace officer authorized to carry a concealed or loaded firearm pursuant to any of the following:
(1) Article 2 (commencing with Section 25450) of Chapter 2 of Division 5 of Title 4 of Part 6.

(2) Section 25650.

(3) Sections 25900 to 25910, inclusive.

(4) Section 26020.

(5) Paragraph (2) of subdivision (c) of Section 26300.

If I understood the request correctly, does this cover it.

[P5Ret]

You can ccw in a National Park if the park is in the same state as the one where the ccw has been issued, or honors reciprocity. If the ccw is from California, then Yosemite is good to go. Crater Lake in Oregon is not, as Oregon does not recognize a California ccw license.

https://www.nps.gov/articles/firearms-in-national-parks.htm

https://le.nra.org/understanding-leosa/off-limit-areas/

If I understood the request correctly, does this cover it.

Yes that covers it However my retired ID, authorizes carry in Ca under state law, not LEOSA. So the benefit of having both a state issued CCW, and a retired ID with an LEOSA endorsement doesn't seem to provide any real benefit beyond national parks out of state. I'm not going on to school campus' out of state. I may drive through one, not going to be an issue unless I do something stupid, which for the most part I've grown out of.

Now for the OP it may be beneficial, since he states he is retired out of a federal agency.

[rusty goose]

I received my LEOSA card in 2013. I contacted CA DOJ about what I needed and the response was that CA does not recognize LEOSA and that I would have to get a CA CCW if I needed to conceal carry.

I went ahead and got my CCW.

Does CA recognize it now?

[RickD427]

I received my LEOSA card in 2013. I contacted CA DOJ about what I needed and the response was that CA does not recognize LEOSA and that I would have to get a CA CCW if I needed to conceal carry.

I went ahead and got my CCW.

Does CA recognize it now?

California has always recognized LEOSA. LEOSA is a federal statute and the states do not have the option of not recognizing it.

Having said that, at least two states (Hawaii and Rhode Island) have attempted to do an "end run" around the LEOSA.

When you say that "Contacted CA DOJ", who exactly did you speak with? The folks who answer the phones are not qualified to render legal opinions, and the folks at DOJ who are qualified to render opinions will not provide them to members of the general public.

[rusty goose]

It was a phone call, so you are spot on. It was no legal expert. I have a call in to my former Agency Res Office to ask about quals, two days and no return call. Doesn't surprise me in the least.

[RickD427]

It was a phone call, so you are spot on. It was no legal expert. I have a call in to my former Agency Res Office to ask about quals, two days and no return call. Doesn't surprise me in the least.

Thanks much for the update.

Please check out the narrative contained on your retired ID card to ensure that all information required by 18 USC 926C is contained on the card. Here is an excerpt of the pertinent part:

"The identification required by this subsection is?
(1)a photographic identification issued by the agency from which the individual separated from service as a law enforcement officer that identifies the person as having been employed as a police officer or law enforcement officer and indicates that the individual has, not less recently than one year before the date the individual is carrying the concealed firearm, been tested or otherwise found by the agency to meet the active duty standards for qualification in firearms training as established by the agency to carry a firearm of the same type as the concealed firearm; or
(2)
(A)a photographic identification issued by the agency from which the individual separated from service as a law enforcement officer that identifies the person as having been employed as a police officer or law enforcement officer; and
(B)a certification issued by the State in which the individual resides or by a certified firearms instructor that is qualified to conduct a firearms qualification test for active duty officers within that State that indicates that the individual has, not less than 1 year before the date the individual is carrying the concealed firearm, been tested or otherwise found by the State or a certified firearms instructor that is qualified to conduct a firearms qualification test for active duty officers within that State to have met?
(I)the active duty standards for qualification in firearms training, as established by the State, to carry a firearm of the same type as the concealed firearm; or
(II)if the State has not established such standards, standards set by any law enforcement agency within that State to carry a firearm of the same type as the concealed firearm."

Please note that the above provides two different methods of showing your current qualification, it can be shown either on your ID card or as a separate document.

So long as you retired card shows that your former position qualifies, you really don't need anything more from your agency, all you need is to complete a qualification in your state of residence.