Ffl transfer with "high cap" magazine

[Tree Cutter]

Deputy What? Makes a huge difference. A Deputy US Marshal would qualify.

DHS? Department of Homeland Security? Department of Hospital Services (a state agency)

Abbreviations and acronyms mean different things to different people and agencies.

Something's not clear here....

Correct me if I'm wrong, but the only position with the title Deputy in federal law enforcement is Deputy US Marshal.

[Ron-Solo]

Correct me if I'm wrong, but the only position with the title Deputy in federal law enforcement is Deputy US Marshal.

Who knows these days.....that's why I asked.

[ranch41]

Most Fed LEOs are of the series 1811, Criminal investigator. This includes FBI, DEA, and IRS to name a few. They are referred to as Agent or Investigator. Most agents work "for" an agency but a deputized Task Force Officer, who is a state or local LEO, working under the jurisdiction of the federal agency would say they work "under" a particular agency.

But maybe the guy is newly hired. Anyway my observation.

[mike415stone]

Don't understand why the OP does just not ask his department about what high cap rules apply to him.

[rvr350]

Sorry, been gone a bit. Dept of homeland security, federal flight deck officer.

[sdsu619]

Sorry, been gone a bit. Dept of homeland security, federal flight deck officer.

FFDO's are a special case. The scope of authority is very narrow, primarily protection of your aircraft in lieu of a FAM.

Sure your deputized. Depending on what your Creds say, it's possible, but Title 49 doesn't really spell out any authority beyond possession of a firearm.

Is the FFDO program still run out of Artesia? I chatted up a few pilots at the bar many years ago. They said it was a volunteer no additional pay deal. Hopefully that has changed for the better.


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[rvr350]

It is voluntary, close to shutdown under the last prez. But i think they are trying to evolve the program to something more universal. Besides going to recurrect every 6 mo., i hardly know anything in law enforcement.

[Cb671]

The Glock blue label program includes Fire, EMS, TSA (99% of whom have zero LE status/authority), security guards and various others who are not LEO. So just because you can buy a blue label Glock doesn't mean you are LEO. The criteria to participate in the blue label program itself is set by Glock, not the state. Now which model you as a resident of California can buy IS dictated by CA DOJ depending on whether the particular model (including country of manufacture) is on the roster or off roster.

Not too long ago the issue of a Federal Flight Deck Officer (aka FFDO) attempting to purchase an off roster gun came up and CA DOJ firmly said they do not qualify. All FFDO's are employees of private companies and are not LEO's. It makes sense that no high caps came with your gun, especially if Glock shipped it to California knowing it was for a FFDO. Now the dealer may have incorrectly sold you an off roster Gen4 Glock (or a Gen3 made in the USA, which also is considered off roster) and the DROS approval slipped through the cracks without CA DOJ realizing it if the dealer noted X32 in the exemption code and did not add to the notes section specifying that you are a FFDO. I recall a thread on here or a similar internet forum thread that involved a FFDO attempting to purchase an off roster gun. It was flagged by CA DOJ when the dealer listed in the notes section of the DROS paperwork that the guy was an FFDO and they rejected it. I'm guessing that guy is now flagged for future purchases to make sure he doesn't claim Federal LE status (X32) in an attempt to purchase off roster guns.

If the dealer did indeed sell you a Gen4 (or Gen3 made in the USA) Glock brand new (i.e. not a PPT or interfamilial transfer, rather brand new off the shelf gun) they will get dinged if it is caught in an audit by CA DOJ and the state could request you return the gun to the dealer. On the other hand, if the dealer sold you an Austrian made Gen3 Glock listed on the roster with 10 round mags, it sounds like they treated you like any other non-LEO eligible under Glock's blue label program such as TSA screeners, security guards, GSSF member, etc.

As for high capacity mags, you are not eligible to buy them and after July 1st of this year, you may only possess a magazine which can hold over ten rounds that was issued to you by the government (i.e. no personally owned ones) and have no authority to possess it in California once you're no longer in the FFDO program. If you were a FAM, an 1811 series Special Agent, Border Patrol Agent, Customs and Border Protection Officer, Forest Service LEO, Veterans Affairs Police Officer, National Park Service protection ranger, to name a few, who are all actual Federal LEO's, then yes you could purchase and possess high capacity mags no different than a local deputy sheriff, police officer, probation officer, etc. even after July 1st (CA Penal Code Section 32405 referenced in an earlier post by ArtSki).

I realize the gun you are issued by the federal government could theoretically have high capacity mags, but that does not confer you the ability or authority to buy them as an individual in California. FFDO's do not have law enforcement authority, rather are issued a handgun under narrow Federal regulations which allow commercial pilots to carry a firearm in an aircraft strictly to defend the cockpit area if necessary. Just like a federal security guard or even a city/county/special district/state employee (non-LEO) may be issued an off roster firearm (which may include high cap mags) for work purposes by the government to protect themselves/patrons/employees in a non LE role while on duty, this doesn't mean they are exempt from the roster or high cap mag laws. Even folks like University of Southern California Public Safety Officers who have attended a full police academy and have arrest authority on-duty through a MOU with LAPD, can't CCW off duty or buy off roster guns or high cap mags (although some are reserve police officers elsewhere which gives them the ability to CCW and buy off roster guns and high cap mags). And in the case of you as a FFDO, the Federal regulation that allows you to have a gun in the cockpit does not convey the authority to CCW outside of a commercial aircraft in California (or elsewhere under LEOSA) or extend any exemptions to the roster/high cap mag laws or FSC requirement.

Trying to buy high capacity magazines or an off roster gun claiming the Federal LE exemption here in California as an FFDO is only asking for trouble in my opinion and a recipe for disaster, especially if CA DOJ contacts your company or DHS (who could pull your FFDO status) or worse decides to refer it to a DA or city prosecutor to charge you criminally. Botach got criminally charged for that (selling high cap Glock mags to a LASD security officer who are issued guns, but have no LE authority), which probably impacted their decision to leave Los Angeles and move to Las Vegas. The LASD security officer may have been charged too although it is unclear from news articles when I did a basic google search.

Enjoy the perks that some gun manufacturers provide to FFDO's, but within the CA DOJ guidelines to prevent future headaches down the road that could impact your position as a pilot or FFDO status.

[Nefarious]

Federal used to be exempt from the 10 round limit. When I would buy my blue label glocks there was no issue with keeping the mags it came with (10+). Then for a short period of time we were NOT exempt. We could still buy off roster but had to stick with 10 round magazines.

It appears again, however, we are exempt? I purchased some lipseys exclusives (started DROS) at the glockstore just a couple days ago and my buddies there stated Federal was once again able to keep the 10+ round mags?

EDIT: I just saw/read the whole "Badged Deputy..." part. What exactly is your title?

[Cb671]

You are correct sir. Actual Federal LEO's such as youself being a CBP Officer are able to purchase and possess high capacity magazines just like state and local peace officers. No secret handshake required.

The OP (badged deputy) on the other hand is a Federal Flight Deck Officer and not eligible to purchase off roster guns or high capacity magazines.

Federal used to be exempt from the 10 round limit. When I would buy my blue label glocks there was no issue with keeping the mags it came with (10+). Then for a short period of time we were NOT exempt. We could still buy off roster but had to stick with 10 round magazines.

It appears again, however, we are exempt? I purchased some lipseys exclusives at the glockstore just a couple days ago and my buddies there stated Federal was once again able to keep the 10+ round mags

EDIT: I just saw/read the whole "Badged Deputy..." part. What exactly is your title?

[Nefarious]

You are correct sir. Actual Federal LEO's such as you being a CBP Officer are able to purchase and possess high capacity magazines just like state and local peace officers. No secret handshake required.

The OP on the other hand is not eligible to purchase off roster guns or high capacity magazines as a Federal Flight Deck Officer (aka badged deputy).

I totally missed the FFDO reply. I seriously missed a HUGE part of the thread lol

[Ron-Solo]

Sorry, been gone a bit. Dept of homeland security, federal flight deck officer.

Makes more sense now. Like others have said, very limited authority so I'm thinking, but not positive, that you are not roster exempt or able to purchase hicap magazines.

Should be in my opinion......

[Tree Cutter]

OP should had from the start said FFDO instead of keeping us guessing (what is a badged Deputy for DHS?) People calling themselves a "Deputy" but is not kinda irritates me.

Just my opinion. I'll get over it.