Cal-gunners Militia

[dwightlooi]

Why shouldn't we organize a Militia -- the Cal-gunners Militia?

It provides a framework for:-

• Firearms safety and owner training
• Practice of defensive tactics employment of firearms
• Disaster relief mobilization
• Social Outreach
• Group purchase of firearms and defensive supplies

The Militia does not engage in or condone illegal activities. The Militia is sworn to uphold and defend the constitution of the United States. It is not under the direct control or chain of command of State or Federal government. However, it regards the US Military and National guard as allies.

[taperxz]

..

[spdtiger]

Militia

We should organize one for Oakland

[RP1911]

Look up the California penal code for forming a militia.

From 2009:

http://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/archive/index.php/t-146592.html

[whlgun]

This again.......

[dwightlooi]

Well, nobody is promoting sabotage, disorder or civil unrest. The Militia, whether you like the name or not, is a group of individuals practicing the employment of firearms in legal self-defense and defense of others as every individual is entitled to do.

If you want to say that this is illegal, then so is IDPA or the NRA

If they want a lawsuit over this, good. We should be willing take up that fight.

[The Gleam]

Why shouldn't we organize a Militia -- the Cal-gunners Militia?

The Militia does not engage in or condone illegal activities. The Militia is sworn to uphold and defend the constitution of the United States. It is not under the direct control or chain of command of State or Federal government. However, it regards the US Military and National guard as allies.

And you know, them militia guys get all the high-profile chicks.

[whlgun]

I cannot afford a lawyer. But I like the idea.

[dustoff31]

The Militia is sworn to uphold and defend the constitution of the United States. It is not under the direct control or chain of command of State or Federal government.

According to the Constitution, those two things are mutually exclusive. If your militia supports the Constitution, it can't not be under the control of the State or Federal government. So which is it?

U.S. Constitution - Article 1 Section 8

To provide for calling forth the Militia to execute the Laws of the Union, suppress Insurrections and repel Invasions;

To provide for organizing, arming, and disciplining, the Militia, and for governing such Part of them as may be employed in the Service of the United States, reserving to the States respectively, the Appointment of the Officers, and the Authority of training the Militia according to the discipline prescribed by Congress;

U.S. Constitution - Article 2 Section 2

The President shall be Commander in Chief of the Army and Navy of the United States, and of the Militia of the several States, when called into the actual Service of the United States;

[whlgun]

Just start a group of preppers.

[dwightlooi]

"As used in this subdivision, "paramilitary organization" means an organization which is not an agency of the United States government or of the State of California, or which is not a private school meeting the requirements set forth in Section 12154 of the Education Code, but which engages in instruction or training in guerilla warfare or sabotage, or which, as an organization, engages in rioting or the violent disruption of, or the violent interference with, school activities."

• The Militia does not teach or promote guerilla warfare or sabotage.
• The Militia does not engage in or encourage rioting or violent disruption of school activities, or any activity
• The Militia does not preach or suggest the any illegal employment of firearms

As such the Militia is not a paramilitary organization from a legal standpoint, in the same manner that the Salvation Army is not an Army from a military standpoint.

[The Gleam]

The first rule of Cal-gunners Militia is: you do not talk about Cal-gunners Militia.

The second rule of Cal-gunners Militia is: you DO NOT talk about Cal-gunners Militia!

[dwightlooi]

According to the Constitution, those two things are mutually exclusive. If your militia supports the Constitution, it can't not be under the control of the State or Federal government. So which is it?

It's very simple.

• The Militia is made up of Individual Citizens.
• The Individual Citizens are individually sworn to defend the constitution of the United States.
• The Individual members are bound by Federal and State Laws in the same manner that civilians are -- no more, no less

[taperxz]

From the California Constitution.

11460. (a) Any two or more persons who assemble as a paramilitary
organization for the purpose of practicing with weapons shall be
punished by imprisonment in a county jail for not more than one year
or by a fine of not more than one thousand dollars ($1,000), or by
both that fine and imprisonment.
As used in this subdivision, "paramilitary organization" means an
organization which is not an agency of the United States government
or of the State of California, or which is not a private school
meeting the requirements set forth in Section 48222 of the Education
Code, but which engages in instruction or training in guerrilla
warfare or sabotage, or which, as an organization, engages in rioting
or the violent disruption of, or the violent interference with,
school activities.
(b) (1) Any person who teaches or demonstrates to any other person
the use, application, or making of any firearm, explosive, or
destructive device, or technique capable of causing injury or death
to persons, knowing or having reason to know or intending that these
objects or techniques will be unlawfully employed for use in, or in
the furtherance of a civil disorder, or any person who assembles with
one or more other persons for the purpose of training with,
practicing with, or being instructed in the use of any firearm,
explosive, or destructive device, or technique capable of causing
injury or death to persons, with the intent to cause or further a
civil disorder, shall be punished by imprisonment in the county jail
for not more than one year or by a fine of not more than one thousand
dollars ($1,000), or by both that fine and imprisonment.
Nothing in this subdivision shall make unlawful any act of any
peace officer or a member of the military forces of this state or of
the United States, performed in the lawful course of his or her
official duties.
(2) As used in this section:
(A) "Civil disorder" means any disturbance involving acts of
violence which cause an immediate danger of or results in damage or
injury to the property or person of any other individual.
(B) "Destructive device" has the same meaning as in Section 12301.
(C) "Explosive" has the same meaning as in Section 12000 of the
Health and Safety Code.
(D) "Firearm" means any device designed to be used as a weapon, or
which may readily be converted to a weapon, from which is expelled a
projectile by the force of any explosion or other form of
combustion, or the frame or receiver of this weapon.
(E) "Peace officer" means any peace officer or other officer
having the powers of arrest of a peace officer, specified in Chapter
4.5 (commencing with Section 830) of Title 3 of Part 2.

/thread

[dustoff31]

It's very simple.

• The Militia is made up of Individual Citizens.
• The Individual Citizens are individually sworn to depend the constitution of the United States.
• The Individual members are bound by Federal and State Laws in the same manner that civilians are -- no more, no less

So then your militia would be under the direct control or chain of command of State or Federal government.

Your organization, training, and equipment would be as prescribed by congress. Your officers would be appointed by the State. When you are actually called forth you would be under the command of State or Federal government as appropriate.