Liberals and Progressives.

[nicki]

The other day "Ashton Kutcher" delivered a speech at a youth award, key points of his speech was.

1. Hard work
2. Being Smart is what it takes to be really sexy.
3. Dream big, don't let others define your life, instead design your life.

Glen Beck made a point that Ashton is a "Liberal", yet he could agree with everything he said in this speech.

Which lead him to the next point here.

Liberals want less government where Progressives want more government.
The Progressives have basically stolen the term Liberal.

Many people identify as Liberal in this state not because they want more government, rather they want the government out of their personal lives, especially in personal matters.

The politicians we have elected in many parts of California may claim to be Liberal, but they are big government progressives.

Liberals can be peeled away from the big government agenda, the Liberals are the ones who are most upset about Drones, the whole NSA thing, Obama's backstabbing policies on state medical marijuana laws.

I believe that there are enough differences between Liberals and Progressives that a schism between the two groups may already be developing under the radar.

We should fuel that schism because it is the progressives who want us disarmed, dependent and ultimately enslaved.

It is highly unlikely that Liberals will become Conservatives, however there is a good chance to shift them so they drift closer to Libertarianism.

Glenn Beck advocates that we change how we deal with Liberals because there is a difference between Liberals and Progressives.

Keeping this kind of open mind on our parts perhaps could help us shift more Liberals to recognizing the without the 2nd amendment, the other rights are government revocable privileges.

Nicki

[AregularGuy]

Liberals want less government where Progressives want more government.
The Progressives have basically stolen the term Liberal.

Many people identify as Liberal in this state not because they want more government, rather they want the government out of their personal lives, especially in personal matters.

I'm not so sure about that. Political figures often refer to California as a "liberal state". It seems people in this state want the government to regulate and impose their ideas of freedom on everyone in the state, usually under the guise of political correctness. I think that for people that understand the technical differences between the groups your points may be valid. Unfortunately, most people do not identify with the historic meaning and spirit of the title "liberal". It has come to be synonymous with the left wing Dems so the liberal vs progressive argument will likely be lost on most folks.

Oh yeah, Ashton Kutcher is a DB! His points may be valid but far from inspirational. Hw many times can you work the word "Job" into a speech? I think the "Jobs" movie went to his head.

[Vin63]

I tend to agree...most of my frustration and disdain of our current political process is a result of the progressives and their extreme left agendas. I have no tolerance for extremism.

[jdouglas]

It's too bad the vast majority of the "liberals" here are only after drugs, gay rights, abortion rights, and freedom from even the slightest mention of Christianity. They want big government and political correctness in almost every other situation.

Obviously there are a few that break the mold, ones that we can persuade to full libertarianism, but those are few and far between.

[a1fabweld]

Liberals & Progressives, I avoid both of them.

[Cnynrat]

Once upon a time liberal carried a different meaning vs. the common use today. In that bygone era liberal was a term used to describe someone with much more of a small government view. Not so much anymore.

Progressive is a term has always been used to describe those who consistently turn to government as the solution to all of society's woes. They mistakenly believe they can engineer a better society thru a more invasive and powerful government.

[cmichini]

Similar situation to the use of communism / socialism.

Or when it's stated that the US is a democracy when we're actually a Constitutional Republic (with democratically elected representatives).

When people ignore the true meaning of words and dumb it down to the equally ignorant masses, communication will falter horribly and everyone's message will be lost.

my $0.02

[SDDAVE56]

I thought a "progressive" was just a "liberal" who was too ashamed to admit it.

[AceGirlsHusband]

I think Nicki's definition of "liberal" is more "Libertarian." They are very different animals.

I have no problem with liberals. If someone wants to make it legal to marry their goat and and have bisexual bathrooms, I don't care. If a group wants to force the "Affordable Health Care Act," okay - then make it work for everybody, equitably.

All I ask is that they leave my gun rights alone. Don't attack and make a villain of me for the actions of a small, criminal element.

[SilverTauron]

The root of the problem is that governments pander to the needs of who has the votes. It used to be in our nation's culture that enough people valued the RKBA to make it a losing game in DC to vote against it . This was true no matter what letter existed before the rep's name. Older politicians could no more vote against gun rights then they could against gravity.

Today, the culture is being shifted literally before our eyes. Between the media beating the drum for more "common sense" regulations and the school system indoctrinating future voters to reject individualism and gun rights , in short order even the GOP and Libertarian members of the future will be hoplophobes. Not because of a political choice, but because that's the one cultural trait everyone of the next generation will share. Note that in Australia their national disarmament program was initiated by a CONSERVATIVE government.

[Intimid8tor]

The liberal definition of today has been hijacked and is not the liberal definition of decades past.

[SemperFi1775]

progressives are much closer to commies... I believe Beck often compared progressives to commies on his TV shows...

[Mr. P]

People should identify this type of mindset as "regressive" NOT "progressive".

[Paladin]

Liberals want less government where Progressives want more government.
The Progressives have basically stolen the term Liberal.

Many people identify as Liberal in this state not because they want more government, rather they want the government out of their personal lives, especially in personal matters.

The politicians we have elected in many parts of California may claim to be Liberal, but they are big government progressives.

Liberals can be peeled away from the big government agenda, the Liberals are the ones who are most upset about Drones, the whole NSA thing, Obama's backstabbing policies on state medical marijuana laws.

I believe that there are enough differences between Liberals and Progressives that a schism between the two groups may already be developing under the radar.

We should fuel that schism because it is the progressives who want us disarmed, dependent and ultimately enslaved.

It is highly unlikely that Liberals will become Conservatives, however there is a good chance to shift them so they drift closer to Libertarianism.

Glenn Beck advocates that we change how we deal with Liberals because there is a difference between Liberals and Progressives.

While this sounds good, historically, I believe it is inaccurate.

Sure, waaaay back in the founding era, being a "liberal" meant something more akin to being a lower case "l" libertarian nowadays.

Then, in the late 1800s we had "the Progressive Movement," where government was to protect people from their own foolishness via the administrative regulatory state.

But from FDR onward, but esp after Johnson, to the early 1990s, "liberals" were "bleeding heart liberals" who believed in the state ("statists"), and for big government and big government spending ("tax and spend liberals"), whether for domestic or foreign issues (support the foreign aid, UN, IMF, World Bank, etc.).

It was only after the success of Reagan and, IIRC, the Fall of the Berlln Wall (and Churchill's "Iron Curtain" w/the collapse of the Soviet Union), that a politician saying he was a "Liberal," became anathema. Then the term and title "Progressive" slowly came back into vogue. (Who's against progress? That's like being against "reasonable and common sense" gun control laws.)

IMO, it was only after the web took off w/middle America (let's say early 2000s), that the liberals (as you use the term), of the Left and the Libertarians (mostly) of the Right started talking, debating, reading each others' works and seeing that they share some common political beliefs and goals despite coming from two different political perspectives.

Ironically, the key figure in developing this potential rift between Liberals and Progressives, as you use the terms, was a very "conservative" Christian Republican politician during his 2 quixotic bids for the White House -- Ron Paul. He was able to avoid the hot rhetoric that often closed the Left's new liberals ears to what they discovered they agreed w/re. smaller government as advocated by Reagan Republicans (vs Rockefeller/Bush statists Republicans) of the Right. (Yes, I know that the Left vs Right political spectrum is BS from revolutionary France.) Ron Paul got them interested in money, banking, and the Fed, among other issues.

But your bottom line I agree with: just because some folk are pro-gay, quasi anarchists w/tattoos, and smoking weed w/their LTR "significant other" who practices "topfreedom" does NOT mean that they are anti-individual RKBA. The best folks to reach out to them might not be the stereotypical NRA member and maybe not even the NRA (they probably distrust ALL large organizations, not just "organized religions" and big governments).

[chris]

Liberals want less government where Progressives want more government.
The Progressives have basically stolen the term Liberal.


The politicians we have elected in many parts of California may claim to be Liberal, but they are big government progressives.


Nicki

I listen to Mark Levin from time to time and what you have described here are not progressives but they are STATISTS. we do not have progressives running this state they are STATISTS and should referred to as such.