Open Carry? (in forests, parks, campsites - see Outdoor Forum sticky)

[stockranger]

So now that the open carry ban went into effect jan 1st for handguns what does that mean to me?

I just want to know if it changed my right to open carry in NF, desert areas, and in a campsite. Or does this only apply to city areas? I was pretty familiar with the law before.

I usually open carry a loaded pistol while hunting and fishing in places like the owens valley and high sierra. However, I sometimes open carry loaded while hiking in these areas or lounging around my backcountry camp.

I know hunting and fishing license allow you to conceal but my g20 is huge... Been thinking about switching to the 29 and concealing it.

Shouldn't we all go and apply for CCW now just to make a point? There would be no reason to open carry if we could get CCW.

what does this mean for the national parks in CA too?

[Quiet]

Open carry was banned in CA in 1967.

The ban that went into effect on 01-01-2012 was the ban on the open carrying of an unloaded handgun in a non-prohibited public place. [PC 26350]
The ban does not affect the open carrying of unloaded long guns in non-prohibited public places and does not affect the open carrying of unloaded handguns in non-prohibited non-public places and does not affect the carrying of loaded firearms in areas where it is legal to discharge a firearm.

The hunting/fishing exemption, allows a person with a valid hunting/fishing license to conceal carry an unloaded handgun while traveling to and from their fishing/hunting site and to conceal carry a loaded handgun while they are actively fishing/hunting. [PC 25640]
Not all CA LEOs know about this exemption.



Penal Code 26350
(a)(1) A person is guilty of openly carrying an unloaded handgun when that person carries upon his or her person an exposed and unloaded handgun outside a vehicle while in or on any of the following:
(A) A public place or public street in an incorporated city or city and county.
(B) A public street in a prohibited area of an unincorporated area of a county or city and county.
(C) A public place in a prohibited area of a county or city and county.
(2) A person is guilty of openly carrying an unloaded handgun when that person carries an exposed and unloaded handgun inside or on a vehicle, whether or not on his or her person, while in or on any of the following:
(A) A public place or public street in an incorporated city or city and county.
(B) A public street in a prohibited area of an unincorporated area of a county or city and county.
(C) A public place in a prohibited area of a county or city and county.

Penal Code 25640
Section 25400 does not apply to, or affect, licensed hunters or fishermen carrying pistols, revolvers, or other firearms capable of being concealed upon the person while engaged in hunting or fishing, or transporting those firearms unloaded when going to or returning from the hunting or fishing expedition.

[CitaDeL]

So now that the open carry ban went into effect jan 1st for handguns what does that mean to me?

Open carry was banned in CA in 1967.

Ugh. Open carry is not 'banned'. It is statutorily restricted to silence a minority of gun owners. It was not 'banned' in 1967 either- that would refer to the Mulford Act which prohibits 'loaded weapons' regardless of whether they were carried openly or concealled.

What this means to you, is that you will have to do extra research on where and when you can openly carry a firearm. For the most part, little has changed in those areas where it is legal to carry a loaded weapon. the trouble comes when you try to ferret out where it is legal in populated areas.

[jonc]

new laws suck...

at this rate we wont be able to even own guns soon!!

[CitaDeL]

at this rate we wont be able to even own guns soon!!

Oh sure you will. But they will have to be kept in a California state approved safe when you are not cleaning them.

[emptybottle151]

The hunting/fishing exemption, allows a person with a valid hunting/fishing license to conceal carry an unloaded handgun while traveling to and from their fishing/hunting site and to conceal carry a loaded handgun while they are actively fishing/hunting. [PC 25640]

So If I get a fishing license and toss a poll in the back of my truck I can unloaded conceal carry anywhere?

[stockranger]

So basicaly nothing has changed for me. I am not crazy enough to walk around the city with a gun anyways. I do however thank and respect all those who risk harassment to fight for our rights.

what about in the national parks in CA. You can't discharge the gun but can you carry it unloaded? State and Federal law seem to be in conflict?

Wish I could get a CCW. I was on the 22fwy two weeks ago when the passenger in the vehicle infornt of me pulls out a SA handgun and fires at the vehicle next to it. I chased the POS down for miles while one the phone with the police who never arrived. THey got away from me before the cops came but then I was giving a statement to the police and they said they got the guy. They had ditched the weapon and the victim car got away so they said there was no crime and did nothing. They said the guy lives on GGBLVD and Palm. I will likely see him on the 22 again as he lives right there and I travel it daily. My truck is very distinct and i'm afraid he'll try and shoot me if he sees me. Not to mention I go to school in Santa Ana every day.

[a1c]

So If I get a fishing license and toss a poll in the back of my truck I can unloaded conceal carry anywhere?

You can carry concealed loaded directly on your way to and from hunting. I wouldn't chance it if you're not actually on your way or coming back from that trip.

[stockranger]

So If I get a fishing license and toss a poll in the back of my truck I can unloaded conceal carry anywhere?

Lets not push the luck on this one! If we all start concealing in the city with a fishing pole in our hand you can kiss that right goodbye. Like I go fishing in Long Beach and El Dorado Park but I'm not thinking I'm going to CCW! I think this is intended for the wilderness where there is risk of predator attack, pot growers, and tweakers. I think its intention was also so that hunters will not have a problem transporting their firearms to and from the field. IMHO this is about the only law that is on the side of sportsmen in this state. Man, ca blows. I have been to a bunch of CCW states and i have never seen or heard of any problems because of it.

[Kauf]

http://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/showthread.php?t=186457

Best thread about this issue. Answers all questions.

[chknlyps2]

http://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/s...d.php?t=186457

Best thread about this issue. Answers all questions.

+1, I was just on my way to get that link and you beat me to it

[stockranger]

That topic was excellent. So yeah, I have nothing to worry about.

I can tell you the shooting on the forest roads I only worry about the main roads. A fish and game warden watched me shoot a rabbit while standing on a secondary forest road and kill the rabbit in the road. He stopped me and checked my game bag, mag plug, and wanted to know about my 1940 Ithica 37. This was in the cajon pass.

I have one more question I didn't see the answer to.

I'm in the condore zone hunting upland game with a shotgun and lead shot. Or hunting predators with lead free centerfire rifle. I have a Glock G20 with WFNGC which is lead and also non expanding for self defense from bears. Do I have to have a lead free expanding projectile or a lead expanding projectile or am I legal with this setup? Not exactly alot of lead free 10mm out there and its only 155 grains and expanding, sounds like it would just anger a bear or mountain lion. Thinking of a 44mag with lead free for the condor zone.

[Wrangler John]

That topic was excellent. So yeah, I have nothing to worry about.

I can tell you the shooting on the forest roads I only worry about the main roads. A fish and game warden watched me shoot a rabbit while standing on a secondary forest road and kill the rabbit in the road. He stopped me and checked my game bag, mag plug, and wanted to know about my 1940 Ithica 37. This was in the cajon pass.

I have one more question I didn't see the answer to.

I'm in the condore zone hunting upland game with a shotgun and lead shot. Or hunting predators with lead free centerfire rifle. I have a Glock G20 with WFNGC which is lead and also non expanding for self defense from bears. Do I have to have a lead free expanding projectile or a lead expanding projectile or am I legal with this setup? Not exactly alot of lead free 10mm out there and its only 155 grains and expanding, sounds like it would just anger a bear or mountain lion. Thinking of a 44mag with lead free for the condor zone.

In the condor lead free zone you can use the Barnes lead free ammo here:
http://www.barnesbullets.com/product...tx-ammunition/ scroll down to the bottom of the page.

If you load your own use these XPB bullets: http://www.barnesbullets.com/products/pistol/ They ain't cheap, not suitable for plinking.

Federal also offers Barnes Expander all copper bullets in loaded ammo: http://www.federalpremium.com/products/handgun.aspx also available in .357 Magnum, .41 Rem. Magnum, .454 Casull, .480 Ruger, .460 S&W, .500 S&W. Use the drop down list and look for the Barnes Expander bullet offerings.

Just be aware that these are real magnum loads, the Federal .480 Ruger load is downright painful to shoot, and I shot IHMSA silhouette for over a decade with magnums. The damn things will shoot through a bison, no kidding.

[stockranger]

In the condor lead free zone you can use the Barnes lead free ammo here:
http://www.barnesbullets.com/product...tx-ammunition/ scroll down to the bottom of the page.

If you load your own use these XPB bullets: http://www.barnesbullets.com/products/pistol/ They ain't cheap, not suitable for plinking.

Federal also offers Barnes Expander all copper bullets in loaded ammo: http://www.federalpremium.com/products/handgun.aspx also available in .357 Magnum, .41 Rem. Magnum, .454 Casull, .480 Ruger, .460 S&W, .500 S&W. Use the drop down list and look for the Barnes Expander bullet offerings.

Just be aware that these are real magnum loads, the Federal .480 Ruger load is downright painful to shoot, and I shot IHMSA silhouette for over a decade with magnums. The damn things will shoot through a bison, no kidding.

Yeah I only own a 10mm. I would have to buy another gun! check out underwoodammo if you into these big bore guns, they have 454 casull for 22 bucks per 50 and some other great deals!

[MudCamper]

I've answered the OP's question in the Firearms in Forests and Parks thread that he referred to.

The new law, 26350, restricts UOC using very similar language as the long standing loading restrictions. So no UOC in incorporated territory nor in "prohibited areas" of unincorporated territory. So anywhere you can LOC in the NF/BLM you certainly can still UOC.

But the new law also includes 26388, which exempts public lands like the NF/BLM, so IMO one could still UOC even in "prohibited areas" of NF/BLM. But some people (including Liberty1, a LEO), disagree with me. I have since gotten an email from the BLM that would support my position, but nothing is set in stone at this point. And I am still trying to get similar clarifying statements from the Forest Service.

Now with regard to the National Parks, IMO UOC of handguns in NPs in CA is now illegal, at least according to the Park Service. This topic has recently been argued to death in the thread I linked.