OPEN THAT LOCKED CONTAINER!

[paul0660]

I thought so too, but it applies to verifying unloaded with a few exceptions with regard to location. Read the statue.

(e) In order to determine whether or not a firearm is loaded for
the purpose of enforcing this section, peace officers are authorized
to examine any firearm carried by anyone on his or her person or in a
vehicle while in any public place or on any public street in an
incorporated city or prohibited area of an unincorporated territory.
Refusal to allow a peace officer to inspect a firearm pursuant to
this section constitutes probable cause for arrest for violation of
this section.

Not sure what I am missing. It seems to me if you tell the cops what and where it is, you have to present it for inspection, and maybe not even where it is.

But it's been a long weekend...............

[G-forceJunkie]

So, if an officer asks do you have a firearm in your locked case, is it legal to say "NO" ??? Even if it is obviously a weapons style or marked case?

[skeptik]

you guys are awesome, quick too! so as long as the pistols are unloaded with an empty magazine i am good to go? what if i have loaded magazines locked in the container but not in the gun?

[skeptik]

curious about this too...

So, if an officer asks do you have a firearm in your locked case, is it legal to say "NO" ??? Even if it is obviously a weapons style or marked case?

[dantodd]

you guys are awesome, quick too! so as long as the pistols are unloaded with an empty magazine i am good to go? what if i have loaded magazines locked in the container but not in the gun?

Not a problem. As long as the rounds are not inside the magazine inserted in the mag well they can be in the same bag. I usually carry mine in the magazine pouches on the outside of the bag, there is no requirement that the ammunition be locked up and I don't want the gun and magazines to be banging against each other.

[dantodd]

So, if an officer asks do you have a firearm in your locked case, is it legal to say "NO" ??? Even if it is obviously a weapons style or marked case?

Sure. You can lie to any non-federal cop all you want.

[I open carry]

Just say, I have nothing illegal in the car, and STFU

[Cokebottle]

I understand completely. I was just wondering exactly what CGF would "love" to have. I am sure there are more than a few folks who would be willing to deny a locked case 12031(e) search request but the standing orders HAD been to not violate statute specifically to be a test case.

"Test case" would imply that one is carrying loaded illegally.

In this case, the only charges that could likely be leveled would be 148PC, which would be flimsy at best (but is often abused by LAPD).

For this to work, the person stopped would need to assert 100% of their 4A/5A... refusal to answer any questions. Don't lie to the cop, don't admit to having firearms in the vehicle, and don't consent to a search.
If that is followed, the officer does not have PC for a search or an e-check.

[The Shadow]

The problem with that is the most likely reason one would be compelled to open a locked case is because you've already admitted to being in possession of a gun and 12031(e) is pretty clear that you are compelled to permit a search.

That's not necessarily true. Some cops are just nosy and they will try and Buit their way into a case. If they ask, and you want to be polite, just tell them it's personal property. If you don't care, tell them it's none of their business.

[Cokebottle]

Even more fun?

Carry a pistol case... visible... in your vehicle 24/7.
Carry a couple of shot-up targets, ammo can, NRA sticker, Gasden flag, and other "paraphernalia" that a cop could claim to use for PC.

Empty ammo can, and nothing in the locked pistol case but a couple of dildoes... with the batteries in the case but separate so they are not loaded.

Make video and audio records.

What's in the case?
Personal items.

[dantodd]

"Test case" would imply that one is carrying loaded illegally.

No, it wouldn't.

12031(e) .. Refusal to allow a peace officer to inspect a firearm pursuant to
this section constitutes probable cause for arrest for violation of
this section.

It doesn't say, refusal to allow inspection of loaded firearms, just ANY firearm. That is why I suggested a Open Carry along with an obvious gun case of a similar weight but not containing a firearm. Then your refusal would not be a violation but a mere refusal of a search. The fact that they "used" 12031(e) to effect the search is handy for killing it but since there is no handgun there is no actual violation in your refusal.

[bussda]

Not sure what I am missing. It seems to me if you tell the cops what and where it is, you have to present it for inspection, and maybe not even where it is.

But it's been a long weekend...............

Except 12031(e) only applies when vehicle in public place, on public street in incorporated area or proibited area of unincorporated area.

[The Shadow]

Even more fun?

Carry a pistol case... visible... in your vehicle 24/7.
Carry a couple of shot-up targets, ammo can, NRA sticker, Gasden flag, and other "paraphernalia" that a cop could claim to use for PC.

Empty ammo can, and nothing in the locked pistol case but a couple of dildoes... with the batteries in the case but separate so they are not loaded.

Make video and audio records.

What's in the case?
Personal items.

I'd use air soft guns just to make it more interesting.

[Tripper]

CGF would really, really love a situation where a Calgunner who was doing nothing wrong required an officer to damage a case to get access. We'll even buy you a new case!

-Gene

Can you refuse the 12031e based on the locked container? I can't imagine a claim of officer safety due to a locked container

But the 148 would glare I'm sure

[socal2310]

So, if an officer asks do you have a firearm in your locked case, is it legal to say "NO" ??? Even if it is obviously a weapons style or marked case?

It is perfectly legal to lie to the officer unless you are thereby impeding an investigation. Whether it would be wise to do so... I'm undecided. On the other hand, a flat out lie would be far preferable to an obvious evasion. The fact that the case is marked does nothing to establish that there is in fact a weapon in said case.

Ryan