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Legality of making a rifle from scratch

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  • shepric
    Junior Member
    • Apr 2010
    • 3

    Legality of making a rifle from scratch

    Deleted
    Last edited by shepric; 12-15-2023, 2:36 PM.
  • #2
    G-forceJunkie
    Calguns Addict
    • Jul 2010
    • 6182

    As long as it does not fall under any of the illegal (or need a permit) classes of firearms (machine gun, California assult weapon,zip gun, SBR, etc.) it is legal to make your own firearms.

    Comment

    • #3
      Barabas
      Veteran Member
      • Oct 2009
      • 3370

      Specifically, don't fall afoul of PC 12020a(1) as defined by PC 102020a(10)A-D:

      (10) As used in this section, a "zip gun" means any weapon or
      device which meets all of the following criteria:
      (A) It was not imported as a firearm by an importer licensed
      pursuant to Chapter 44 (commencing with Section 921) of Title 18 of
      the United States Code and the regulations issued pursuant thereto.
      (B) It was not originally designed to be a firearm by a
      manufacturer licensed pursuant to Chapter 44 (commencing with Section
      921) of Title 18 of the United States Code and the regulations
      issued pursuant thereto.
      (C) No tax was paid on the weapon or device nor was an exemption
      from paying tax on that weapon or device granted under Section 4181
      and Subchapters F (commencing with Section 4216) and G (commencing
      with Section 4221) of Chapter 32 of Title 26 of the United States
      Code, as amended, and the regulations issued pursuant thereto.
      (D) It is made or altered to expel a projectile by the force of an
      explosion or other form of combustion.

      Comment

      • #4
        shepric
        Junior Member
        • Apr 2010
        • 3

        Deleted
        Last edited by shepric; 12-15-2023, 2:37 PM.

        Comment

        • #5
          the_quark
          Senior Member
          • May 2006
          • 1003

          Originally posted by shepric
          Thanks for the responses guys. Parts B and C of that statute are a bit confusing Barabas; do you know they mean practically?
          Heh.

          Unfortunately, no one does. It's really, really vague (one might say unconstitutionally so). The folks that build their own around here have generally figured that, as long as you're building a version of something that is manufactured by a licensed manufacturer, you're not making a zip gun.

          It sounds like what you want to do doesn't fall into that situation. My honest assessment is that it's not clear whether what you want to do is legal, or not.

          I do think over the long term, what you want to do has to be legal under the Second Amendment, but, sadly, it's not real high on the priority list at the moment.
          Brett Thomas - @the_quark on Twitter -
          Founding CGF Director and Treasurer; NRA Life Member; Ex-CRPA Director and Life Member; SAF Life Member; Plaintiff

          Comment

          • #6
            G-forceJunkie
            Calguns Addict
            • Jul 2010
            • 6182

            I think "B" has to do with lets say turning a flashlight or ballpoint pen or cane into a firearm. If your building a typical shaped rifle, you won't have an issue. If your build a firearm that does not look like a firearm, then you have issues.

            Comment

            • #7
              the_quark
              Senior Member
              • May 2006
              • 1003

              Originally posted by G-forceJunkie
              I think "B" has to do with lets say turning a flashlight or ballpoint pen or cane into a firearm. If your building a typical shaped rifle, you won't have an issue. If your build a firearm that does not look like a firearm, then you have issues.
              I agree with you that was probably what they intended. But, it's so vaguely worded that no one really knows what it means.
              Brett Thomas - @the_quark on Twitter -
              Founding CGF Director and Treasurer; NRA Life Member; Ex-CRPA Director and Life Member; SAF Life Member; Plaintiff

              Comment

              • #8
                Barabas
                Veteran Member
                • Oct 2009
                • 3370

                A is pretty self-explanatory and inapplicable in your case.

                B is just saying that the design was created by a manufactuer who is licensed by the AG to do business in the US, possibly, but not likely applicable. I'd contact the author of your plans to see if they are a licensed manufacturer, probably too much trouble.

                C is where a lot of people give up hope. There are no exemptions specified under 26 USC 4181, so the PC refers to something that only exists in 26 USC 4182. If you wanted to argue that you are exempt under 4182 (which you likely would be) that opens up a whole can of worms about "manufacturing" which leads us right back into B.

                D, of course, is exactly what we want.

                Don't take my word for it, I'm not a lawyer.
                Last edited by Barabas; 10-22-2010, 12:18 PM. Reason: Removed editorial

                Comment

                • #9
                  wash
                  Calguns Addict
                  • Aug 2007
                  • 9011

                  If I were you, I would ask the BOF, send them a picture of a rifle similar to what you want to make and ask them if it could be considered a zip-gun.

                  I think in your case it should be obvious enough that it is not, but let the BOF tell you that.
                  sigpic
                  Originally posted by oaklander
                  Dear Kevin,

                  You suck!!! Your are wrong!!! Stop it!!!
                  Proud CGF and CGN donor. SAF life member. Former CRPA member. Gpal beta tester (it didn't work). NRA member.

                  Comment

                  • #10
                    shepric
                    Junior Member
                    • Apr 2010
                    • 3

                    Deleted
                    Last edited by shepric; 12-15-2023, 2:37 PM.

                    Comment

                    • #11
                      CHS
                      Moderator Emeritus
                      CGN Contributor - Lifetime
                      • Jan 2008
                      • 11338

                      Originally posted by Barabas
                      Specifically, don't fall afoul of PC 12020a(1) as defined by PC 102020a(10)A-D:

                      (10) As used in this section, a "zip gun" means any weapon or
                      device which meets all of the following criteria:
                      (A) It was not imported as a firearm by an importer licensed
                      pursuant to Chapter 44 (commencing with Section 921) of Title 18 of
                      the United States Code and the regulations issued pursuant thereto.
                      (B) It was not originally designed to be a firearm by a
                      manufacturer licensed pursuant to Chapter 44 (commencing with Section
                      921) of Title 18 of the United States Code and the regulations
                      issued pursuant thereto.
                      (C) No tax was paid on the weapon or device nor was an exemption
                      from paying tax on that weapon or device granted under Section 4181
                      and Subchapters F (commencing with Section 4216) and G (commencing
                      with Section 4221) of Chapter 32 of Title 26 of the United States
                      Code, as amended, and the regulations issued pursuant thereto.

                      (D) It is made or altered to expel a projectile by the force of an
                      explosion or other form of combustion.
                      To be a zip gun, the firearm has to satisfy *ALL* of the above.

                      "C" is your out. No tax is due because A.) You're not a manufacturer and B.) The firearm remains a Title 1 firearm.

                      Don't build an AOW or other Title 2 firearm, and you are legally fine.
                      Please read the Calguns Wiki
                      Laws that forbid the carrying of arms...disarm only those who are neither inclined nor determined to commit crimes...Such laws make things worse for the assaulted and better for the assailants; they serve rather to encourage than to prevent homicides, for an unarmed man may be attacked with greater confidence than an armed man.
                      --Cesare, Marquis of Beccaria, "On Crimes and Punishment"

                      Comment

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