trigger lock vs. locked container question

[mmartin]

so I'm trying to understand all the details of legal carry and transport... my question: in transport, is a trigger lock legally the same as locked in a container?
have I got these right?

in a vehicle trunk:
1) an unloaded handgun in a locked container in the trunk (legal)
2) an unloaded handgun in the trunk (consealed/not legal?)
3) an unloaded handgun with a trigger lock in the trunk (legal?)

inside the vehicle:
4) an unloaded handgun in a locked container in the front seat, not in a school zone (legal)
5) an unloaded handgun in a locked container in the front seat, in a school zone (legal)
6) an unloaded handgun in plain view on the front seat, not a school zone (legal, not consealed)
7) an unloaded handgun in plain view on the front seat, in a school zone (not legal)
8) an unloaded handgun with a trigger lock in the front seat, not in a school zone (legal?)
9) an unloaded handgun with a trigger lock in the front seat, in a school zone (legal?)
10) an unloaded handgun tucked under the front seat (not legal, consealed)
11) an unloaded handgun with a trigger lock tucked under the front seat (legal?)
12) an unloaded hangun in a locked container tucked under the front seat (legal)

not in a vehicle:
13) an unloaded handgun in plain view while on the street, not in a school zone (legal OC)
14) an unloaded handgun in a locked container while on the street, in a school zone (legal?)
15) an unloaded handgun in your pocket (not legal, consealed)
16) an unloaded handgun with a trigger lock in plain view, not in a school zone (legal)
17) an unloaded handgun with a trigger lock in your pocket, in a school zone (legal?)

thanks for your help in eduating me...
Megan

[dantodd]

I've specifically answered each of you questions that included a "?" the rest seem OK, I didn't read those too carefully.

A trigger lock has zero to do with anything other than a requirement at time of purchase. There are no exceptions within the carry/possession laws for a trigger lock so you can safely ignore its presence when looking at the legality of carrying a handgun. (i.e. unless you feel you want a trigger-lock for actual safety there is zero reason to ever have a trigger-lock on a handgun when transporting it)

2) legal - the trunk is a locked container (but be careful transporting into a range etc. taking the firearm out of the trunk in a gun bag makes it a concealed weapon in a non-locked container.)

3) same as 2

8) legal
9) not-legal

11) not-legal

14) legal (but you must be able to articulate a specific exempted destination)
17) not-legal
18) unloaded handgun with a triggerlock in your pocket, not in a school zone - not-legal

[MrClamperSir]

in a vehicle trunk:
1) an unloaded handgun in a locked container in the trunk (legal)
2) an unloaded handgun in the trunk ( legal)
3) an unloaded handgun with a trigger lock in the trunk (legal)

inside the vehicle:
4) an unloaded handgun in a locked container in the front seat, not in a school zone (legal)
5) an unloaded handgun in a locked container in the front seat, in a school zone (legal)
6) an unloaded handgun in plain view on the front seat, not a school zone (legal)
7) an unloaded handgun in plain view on the front seat, in a school zone (not legal)
8) an unloaded handgun with a trigger lock in the front seat, not in a school zone (legal)
9) an unloaded handgun with a trigger lock in the front seat, in a school zone (not legal)
10) an unloaded handgun tucked under the front seat (not legal)
11) an unloaded handgun with a trigger lock tucked under the front seat (not legal)
12) an unloaded hangun in a locked container tucked under the front seat (legal)

not in a vehicle:
13) an unloaded handgun in plain view while on the street, not in a school zone (legal OC)
14) an unloaded handgun in a locked container while on the street, in a school zone (the locked container applies to a motor vehicle. try here for understanding OC. http://www.californiaopencarry.org/faq.html)
15) an unloaded handgun in your pocket (not legal)
16) an unloaded handgun with a trigger lock in plain view, not in a school zone (depends on how it's carried. see #14)
17) an unloaded handgun with a trigger lock in your pocket, in a school zone (not legal)

[Decoligny]

so I'm trying to understand all the details of legal carry and transport... my question: in transport, is a trigger lock legally the same as locked in a container?
have I got these right?

in a vehicle trunk:
1) an unloaded handgun in a locked container in the trunk (legal)
Legal - the trunk itself is considered a locked container, so you technically have a locked container in a locked container.

2) an unloaded handgun in the trunk (consealed/not legal?)
Legal - Only one locked container is required and the trunk counts.

3) an unloaded handgun with a trigger lock in the trunk (legal?)
Legal - The trigger lock plays no part in this being legal, only the trunk as a locked container.

inside the vehicle:
4) an unloaded handgun in a locked container in the front seat, not in a school zone (legal)
Correct

5) an unloaded handgun in a locked container in the front seat, in a school zone (legal)
Correct

6) an unloaded handgun in plain view on the front seat, not a school zone (legal, not concealed)
Correct

7) an unloaded handgun in plain view on the front seat, in a school zone (not legal)
Correct

8) an unloaded handgun with a trigger lock in the front seat, not in a school zone (legal?)
Correct

9) an unloaded handgun with a trigger lock in the front seat, in a school zone (legal?)
Illegal - a trigger lock does not meet the Penal Code definition of "fully enclosed in a secure locked container"

10) an unloaded handgun tucked under the front seat (not legal, consealed)
Correct

11) an unloaded handgun with a trigger lock tucked under the front seat (legal?)
Illegal - Since the exceptions to PC 12025 both have a requirement for the unloaded gun to be fully enclosed in a secure locked container.

12) an unloaded hangun in a locked container tucked under the front seat (legal)
Correct.

not in a vehicle:
13) an unloaded handgun in plain view while on the street, not in a school zone (legal OC)
Correct - this is UOC

14) an unloaded handgun in a locked container while on the street, in a school zone (legal?)
Only if you are going to, or coming from, one of the specific locations listed in Penal Code 12026.2, otherwise it is illegal.

15) an unloaded handgun in your pocket (not legal, concealed)
Correct

16) an unloaded handgun with a trigger lock in plain view, not in a school zone (legal)
Correct

17) an unloaded handgun with a trigger lock in your pocket, in a school zone (legal?)
Illegal - violation of PC 12025 because the trigger lock does not meet the Penal Code requirement of being fully enclosed in a secure locked container.

thanks for your help in eduating me...
Megan

See answer in bold.

[xxdabroxx]

handgun anywhere in vehicle while in a locked container is ok.

Handgun unlocked in trunk = OK. (there may be something bad about a trunk that can be accessed from inside the vehicle, but i dont think thats really an issue)

i do not believe a trigger lock satisfies the locked container requirement. (not really a container) A backpack would most likely satisfy the locked container req's. I think the conclusion that we came to was if it can keep a 5 year old out it would prob. be considered a container. A stapled paper bag would not be a locked container.

I was late to the party. i leave threads open to long.

[wash]

I would worry about trunks with fold down rear seats or a ski pass-through. In my opinion they would not count as a locked container if you can open it from the interior of the car.

[KylaGWolf]

On my Honda you have a lock that keeps the seats from folding down unless it is unlocked so in my case the trunk is a locked container.

[mmartin]

thank you everyone for the answers, I will take time at lunch to review and make sure I understand, but I think the fog is clearing!

y'all are helping me meet my goal of really knowing the ca laws inside-out by the Ontario show. if I'm going to be in the booth, I want to be of some use.

thank you for the help with my education!
Megan

[GrizzlyGuy]

not in a vehicle:

14) an unloaded handgun in a locked container while on the street, in a school zone (legal?)

In addition to 12026.2 that was already mentioned, 12027 has an additional list of exemptions available for when your firearm is concealed (e.g., locked in a container) and you are not necessarily in or on a motor vehicle:

http://law.onecle.com/california/penal/12027.html

http://law.onecle.com/california/penal/12026.2.html

When in or on a motor vehicle, then you can take advantage of the general purpose locked-in-container-is-OK exemption in 12026.1:

http://law.onecle.com/california/penal/12026.1.html

Note that being "in a school zone" actually has nothing to do with this. School zones just happen to be a trigger that would cause you to want to lock it up. You may decide to lock it up for any reason or no reason at all, and you still have the same concealed carry problem to deal with.

[Gunaria]

Isn't there also some sort of hunting exemption to this whole locked thing?

[Liberty1]

Isn't there also some sort of hunting exemption to this whole locked thing?

Read 12027 PC.

[GrizzlyGuy]

Isn't there also some sort of hunting exemption to this whole locked thing?

Yes, along with many other purpose-specific ones in 12026.2 and 12027. This one in 12027 is pretty good:

(g) Licensed hunters or fishermen carrying pistols, revolvers, or
other firearms capable of being concealed upon the person while
engaged in hunting or fishing, or transporting those firearms
unloaded when going to or returning from the hunting or fishing
expedition.

This is a good thread for hunting, being on public lands, etc.:

http://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/showthread.php?t=186457

[swhatb]

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