Generators - what to look for?

[IronsightsRifleman]

We had a half-day power outage in my neighborhood earlier this week. Nothing major, but it reminded me I really don't have a backup power plan. I see HF has several affordable tri-fuel generators. Some claim to be'ultra quiet', which I think would be helpful in my location, but they carry a premium price. I own a medium sized single family detached home in coastal LA county, it's just me and the missus.

What is your experience with different manufacturers, stand-alone vs hard wired installation, etc?

[user120312]

In the last five years, what's the longest power outage you've experienced?

What's your typical low-season daily electrical consumption in Kwh?

What's your most commonly used fuel? Gasoline, diesel, natural gas, propane etc. By that I mean what powers most or all of your fuel consuming devices?

Do you maintain your own combustion engines?

My example - In California, for a couple decades, I had 50Kw three phase and 10Kw single phase gensets for the shop and house, both running on diesel. Why? Diesel powered my trucks, tractors, and some shop equipment. The 10Kw doubled as a welder on the service truck.

Now, retired in the forests of Oregon, with power cheap hydro, and reliable, I have a couple solar generators and a number of batteries and a Gooloo jump pack for essential electronics like phone and laptop and battery powered lights. Why? It's all I need. Power rarely goes out and I hardly use power since summers and winters are pretty mild at the coast.

Sure, an engine powered generator is cool, and I can always buy a genhead for the tractor PTO but it's just more stuff. I know the realities from maintaining generators for nearly 20 years. Biggest/longest power outage? The '96 blackout, a couple days where I lived out in the sticks.

Lastly, something to think about.... the noise of a generator, and one's place being lit up and running like the grid is still working, can make one a target. That first came to me in '96 when, at night, I was out and it was dark (in the country it's pitch black except for house/shop lights) except for my place.

There have been some good threads here and in the OT forum on the specifics of generators. Very informative. Good luck.

[jarhead714]

Don’t buy some sorry CARB compliant generator. Pick one up next time you take off to Vegas instead.

[twinfin]

Those half day power outages are important as they remind us to think about what if...? My journey began in the Santa Cruz mountains where fallen trees took out the power lines every year and multi-day outages were the norm.

My first generator was a Coleman 5000 watt that came with the house I bought. It was old, loud and used modified sine wave for electrical output. I hated running it but that old, beat up generator was actually a blessing as it taught me about dirty the power from a generator not using inverter technology to produce a clean, power wave form. Just about anything in the house with a circuit board would not play well with the old Coleman.

We replaced that old generator our first year with a Honda EU6500i generator which was extremely quiet and produced a clean sine-wave via inverter. Everything in the house worked perfectly with the Honda. We had a transfer switch that would allow the generator to run all the important circuits in the house. Though not mandatory, a transfer switch will greatly simplify the process of using your generator. You could just run extension cords from the generator but that gets old in a hurry, especially if it’s cold and raining outside (or there’s mice) and you have to leave a door or window cracked open to accommodate the extension cords.

Portable generators allow you to get into the game at a lower price and you can take them with you if you move. Fixed units are much more expensive and impractical to take with you if you move. They do offer the most seamless experience though when the lights go out.

I’d break it down like this:

1) If you just want to keep the fridge going and run a few low power devices, you can get away with a 2000 to 3000 watt generator and an appropriate sized extension cord.

2) If you want to take things up a notch or two, get a larger generator over 5000 watts and install a transfer switch. You can run the most important things to you and live in relative comfort while waiting for the power grid to come back online.

3) If you want to spare no expense and give up nothing when the grid goes down, go whole-house propane generator mounted on a concrete pad. This is what I’m using now but only as a backup to my off-grid power system.

Whatever you do, pay attention to rated decibels; they matter. Noisy generators become irritating to listen to after a short amount of time. The noise will come right through the walls of your house and annoy you in short order. Honda EU series generators are sort of the gold standard and very quiet. Compare the decibel ratings of the competition against the Honda units of comparable size. I’d stay away from bargain generators.

[user120312]

Very true about noise. I could open a window at night and tell you exactly which neighbor was irrigating by the sound of their diesel irrigation pumping unit. Where I lived a lot of farmers used diesel power units to pump their deep wells, some 1000' deep or more. The sound would carry for miles and one got to know the pitch of the engine drone over time.

Even with a big muffler and a stack through the roof of the shop the 50kw could easily be heard from 1/2 mile away. Sound just carries and intake/fan noise is as much a challenge as exhaust.

When moving and downsizing, I also downsized power, going from a big refer and freezer to a couple of bar-sized absorption units that run fine on a small battery inverter. Same with cooking. Still have a stove but also have a microwave and air fryer that run on the solar generator no problem.

Biggest challenge has been the jet pump on the well due to the inrush when the motor starts. That's something to consider if one is powering electric motors of any sort, particularly those with high starting loads. A submersible or jet pump and air compressors or heat pumps are some examples.

At the end of the day, my advice is research thoroughly and buy once, cry once. That means spend the money for name brand equipment with a parts and service network. Why? Because stuff happens. I get a reminder every time I pull the rope on the old Honda I mow my little patch of forest with. I bought it new, for a lot of money at the time, in 1985. It's still running pretty much like new 40 years later and I think the only time it let me down was when I let crap California gas sit in the carb over the winter.

Oh, that reminds me, fuel. If it's gas, I recommend running clear gas or at least the best quality fuel treatment/stabilizer one can find. I use clear gas here in Oregon, Clear93, in all my gasoline engines, including the cars. Expensive, yes, but the headaches of that crap ethanol fuel, especially in older engines like I run, make it worth every nickel.

[socal m1 shooter]

A few years ago there was a fire in a substation in south Orange County and I heard from someone they were without power for three or four days. Similarly, someone else was without power due to the Eaton fire near Pasadena for about a week, maybe ten days?

Could something like that happen because of other reasons, like mismanagement or incompetence? I'm thinking yes.

There was another generator thread on here last year. At this point the ratings on Consumer Reports have been updated, and I was thinking to drive out of state and see about avoiding the CA-specific models, which cost more and have additional fanciful tree-hugger stuff on them. Right now the top three are:

Generac IQ 3800 Dual Fuel (Home Depot)
Honda EU 3000 iS with CO Minder (Home Depot, outside of CA)
Predator 5000 Watt Dual-Fuel (Harbor Freight, not sure if in CA)

From the other thread and elsewhere, seems like dual-fuel is wise option. I need to do a little more research to be certain but from what I read there is nothing illegal about importing a 49-state generator for personal use.

[twinfin]

…Right now the top three are:

Generac IQ 3800 Dual Fuel (Home Depot)
Honda EU 3000 iS with CO Minder (Home Depot, outside of CA)
Predator 5000 Watt Dual-Fuel (Harbor Freight, not sure if in CA)…

I was a little worried that I could not find a decibel rating on that Generac which is something the manufacturers typically brag about unless the news isn’t good. My impression with Harbor freight is that quality is sacrificed for price which leaves the Honda looking pretty good.

Of course, I am admittedly biased in favor of Honda having owned an EU series inverter generator for 18 years. You sound like you are doing your homework in researching out the options and possibilities so you’re taking the right approach.

Duel fuel is good and from what I hear, Honda’s can be converted for propane. I’ve never had trouble rotating fuel cans to maintain freshness since I have plenty of machines on the homestead that use gasoline.

[OlderThanDirt]

The most flexible option is a tri fuel inverter generator with low total harmonic distortion. Quiet, either a generator designed for quiet running or in a purpose built enclosure is nice. Finally, electric start and a manual transfer switch is an added plus and something your wife would appreciate.

I use a large bank of batteries and inverter connected to a manual transfer switch. I also have all my networking and security equipment on dedicated battery backup. If a power outage lasts for more than a day, I run the house and recharge the batteries using a tri fuel inverter generator and use natural gas as my primary fuel. If the weather is good I also augment my system with some solar panels.

I know a few people with a HF Predator generators and they love them. Some of their models are relatively quiet, have electric start and 220v output that can be connected to a transfer switch.

[Ireloadtoo]

I currently have the Westinghouse iGen4500DF. Its a portable genny. It replaced my old Briggs and Straton 5,000 watt running, heavy, loud, and consumes a good amount of gas at full load.
I've done the break-in period and have changed the oil already a few years ago. I normally turn it on once every two months for 15 mins or 30 mins depending on my mood. I check the output voltage, oil level, and start battery. Once in a while, I'll use the recoil start to exercise the mechanism. I use propane for fuel. I haven't used gasoline yet. But will soon. I've switched the plastic dipstick with a metal one with a magnetic tip to pick up any microscopic metal debri. I do keep extra oil, air filter, sparkplug just in case. I do keep a log of run time, how I started the genny (recoil, key fob, or push button), when oil was changed, etc.
I have not experienced any power outage in my neck of the wood (aka The Burbs) lately. I did back in 2011. Power was out for several hours at least. Funny thing, I never needed to fire up my old B&G generator. I do have plans to run a dedicated electrical line from my genny to a manual transfer switch. Also construct a hush box with ventilation.

[user120312]

One advantage OP has is living at the coast, where temperatures are generally mild. Of course, there are storms and, if in an earthquake prone location, temblors to consider. In that case, a generator factor I'd consider is whether one is focused on sheltering in place or bolting. Power solutions for differing scenarios can be necessarily different.

Forex, if a bolter, I'd look for something that's light and compact but can be multiplexed for more serious power requirements, meaning multiple units connected together to share larger loads. Similarly, consider fuel. Forex having some cool gas gensets is great until one gets stuck in a disaster in their diesel pickup and no gas stations around. Rinse and repeat for other fuel scenarios.

In my opinion, train for different scenarios, both shelter in place and bolting. I usually train during the relatively frequent storms we have here, usually at night.. Raining, wind blowing, shut the main off and make like it's a power outage. When the power goes out for real, one can't see their hand in front of their face here at night. What to do?

Practice it.

[twinfin]

…I've done the break-in period and have changed the oil already a few years ago. I normally turn it on once every two months for 15 mins or 30 mins depending on my mood. I check the output voltage, oil level, and start battery. Once in a while, I'll use the recoil start to exercise the mechanism. I use propane for fuel. I haven't used gasoline yet. But will soon. I've switched the plastic dipstick with a metal one with a magnetic tip to pick up any microscopic metal debri. I do keep extra oil, air filter, sparkplug just in case. I do keep a log of run time, how I started the genny (recoil, key fob, or push button), when oil was changed, etc...

Sounds like you’re doing all the right things. Take care of your equipment and when you need it, it will take care of you. I also logged all my generator activity which came in handy after I built an off-grid house. I was able to review my logs and see that living off-grid, I used the generator less than when I lived on-grid thanks to PG&E!

[Duck Killer]

So generator’s are all about your purpose. I have everything from Honda 2200 to a 45kw diesel 3 phase military generator on a trailer. Figure out your needs. For small outages I have the two Honda or the predator 3500. They work great and handle most of my needs. But you need to store gas. My in laws have a natural gas generator they has an auto start that powers their whole house that is awesome. For small outages either option works well.

Now for disasters or fires gas or diesel is the way to go. Natural gas will be shut off and propane is a bad idea. Propane even though is easy to store especially if you have a large tank for house in a disaster you will burn through it fast and have no way to refill it after the fire or disaster is over. Propane delivery trucks will not be allowed in the area for a long while.

When a fire happens they shut down the power and natural gas first. If you are on city water they you will lose pressure soon. Even if you have water it might not be safe to drink. Then they close all the roads. The roads can be closed for weeks to months after a fire.

Also people have a tendency to run a generator all the time with propane. It is difficult to figure out your consumption rate coming off a large tank. Then you are out for your heater and cooking.

A generator for disasters can be ran for short periods of time for refrigerators and freezers. During this time run lights for night and charge batteries. They make led rechargeable lanterns and dewalt makes 20v battery spot lights. Dewalt also has a conversion to use their batteries to power usb ports.

Things like large water storage the is gravity fell and wood burning stoves help a lot during disasters. Also the propane insta hot heater that runs off a 5 gallon propane are very useful. Added in with a solar system and batteries and you can last a long time.

[hermosabeach]

two quality choices - Japanese vs Chinese

Honda's will run a lot of hours


Next - any sensitive electronics that you will run?


Generators eat a lot of propane.... BBQ tanks wont last long. Great for short projects as you have no fuel in the tank and noting gums a carb. Long running time, unless home has a propane tank, you wont have enough bbq tanks

Firman is a cheap Chinese brand - COSTCO sells them once a year... you can get returns and refurbs on their official site on ebay

If running long time, how many hours inbetween oil changes? Its raining... do you want to change the oil?


for most people, two small ones are better than one big one.... easier to move... burn the fuel you need.... not more fuel with a giant machine....


When the power goes out- its really quiet. I found out my neighbors have a whole home back up as you could hear it running.... 3 days no power- keep the home black- curtains drawn - stay quiet

[operavoice]

I've been running a DuroMax 4850 dual fuel for years now. It got us through the Tubbs fire, and all rolling blackouts since. It's not a clean power generator, but I bought a power conditioning power strip for it, and it runs all electronics without a hiccup.
It is light enough to easily roll up a ramp into the back of my truck for camping.
It's also been extremely reliable.

The down side is that is pretty noisy. Not overbearingly so, but it's definitely not as quiet as an inverter.

My next purchase is going to be a Duromax dual fuel inverter generator in the same power range.

[Duck Killer]

two quality choices - Japanese vs Chinese

Honda's will run a lot of hours


Next - any sensitive electronics that you will run?


Generators eat a lot of propane.... BBQ tanks wont last long. Great for short projects as you have no fuel in the tank and noting gums a carb. Long running time, unless home has a propane tank, you wont have enough bbq tanks

Firman is a cheap Chinese brand - COSTCO sells them once a year... you can get returns and refurbs on their official site on ebay

If running long time, how many hours inbetween oil changes? Its raining... do you want to change the oil?


for most people, two small ones are better than one big one.... easier to move... burn the fuel you need.... not more fuel with a giant machine....


When the power goes out- its really quiet. I found out my neighbors have a whole home back up as you could hear it running.... 3 days no power- keep the home black- curtains drawn - stay quiet

Good post. Weight and noise can be very important. I love having several small generators. They are easy to move and fast to get running