BODY ARMOR: The Good, The Bad, and the Ugly

[Dee_Dub]

Out of all the things that are wrong with our country they choose to go after body armor....

[d-r]

Wouldn't outlawing possession by those law abiding citizens amount to an unconstitutional "taking" by the government that would require compensation?

I don't know if I have a problem with anyone unable to own a firearm also being prohibited from owning body armor. Outlawing felons from possession won't stop posession but will give prosecutors another charge /enhancement when trying to put filth away in our permissive criminal justice system.

Felons are already "prohibited persons" under 18 USC 931:

http://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/text/18/931

This proposed legislation is arbitrary and unlawful under the public law.

[d-r]

Are any of the concealable plate carriers actually concealable? I like look like I got my hockey pads on under my shirt with my current carrier. Looking for one ideally that holds side plates as well. Doesn't help I'm 240lbs.

Mike, there's concealable, and then there's "concealable." Until such time as we get ballistic roll-on, there will always be an issue with the necessary thickness required for center fire rifle rounds. The most concealable rifle plate carrier I have seen is the older DBT low-vis carrier. I would give them a call and see if they still have them available. They are BALCS soft armor compatible, which will take care of the side-wrap.

[deckhandmike]

Are any of the concealable plate carriers actually concealable? I like look like I got my hockey pads on under my shirt with my current carrier. Looking for one ideally that holds side plates as well. Doesn't help I'm 240lbs.

[Ronin2]

**POTENTIAL LEGISLATIVE ALERT**

PROPOSED OUTRIGHT BAN ON ALL HARD ARMOR OWNERSHIP, SALE, TRANSFER:

https://drmorgear.wordpress.com/2014/08/10/potential-legislation-alert-outright-ban-on-hard-armor-proposed/

https://beta.congress.gov/bill/113th-congress/house-bill/5344/text

http://www.guns.com/2014/08/08/congressman-wants-to-ban-sale-of-enhanced-body-armor-to-civilians/

Wouldn't outlawing possession by those law abiding citizens amount to an unconstitutional "taking" by the government that would require compensation?

I don't know if I have a problem with anyone unable to own a firearm also being prohibited from owning body armor. Outlawing felons from possession won't stop posession but will give prosecutors another charge /enhancement when trying to put filth away in our permissive criminal justice system.

[d-r]

**POTENTIAL LEGISLATIVE ALERT**

PROPOSED OUTRIGHT BAN ON ALL HARD ARMOR OWNERSHIP, SALE, TRANSFER:

https://drmorgear.wordpress.com/2014/08/10/potential-legislation-alert-outright-ban-on-hard-armor-proposed/

https://beta.congress.gov/bill/113th-congress/house-bill/5344/text

http://www.guns.com/2014/08/08/congressman-wants-to-ban-sale-of-enhanced-body-armor-to-civilians/

[d-r]

Great thread! Lots of good info...

To make sure I understand, the general rule of thought is:

All around set-up:

Carrier with plates, backers and spall mitigation - can be worn with with just backers or complete

Plates - L3,L3+,L4 depending on need and desire
- materials, steels, ceramics and UHMWPE all good with pro/cons for each
- Line-X coating on steel plates (as example) works as spall mitigation along as well as corrosion (to be used in conjuction with additional spall mitigation such as backers)

Backers - L3A (best option)
- Materials - avoid all except woven aramids (kevlar etc)

Am I missing anything - on the basic level? Is this something that would be good and versatile for nearly all situations as it is adaptable?

Last question - backers ran alone - just as effective as soft armor vest (given same level pro?)

This is an excellent summation. I would add to this the choice between concealable/overt, and subset that with the need for load carriage or not with the overt.

The best choice for an all-around use is a low profile overt carrier (that can be concealed if need be without pouches) utilizing a plate such as the FM-STX and soft armor backers/cummerbunds. Soft armor backers are just as effective as full-size vest panels when worn alone.

[Champagne-N-Beer]

Great thread! Lots of good info...

To make sure I understand, the general rule of thought is:

All around set-up:

Carrier with plates, backers and spall mitigation - can be worn with with just backers or complete

Plates - L3,L3+,L4 depending on need and desire
- materials, steels, ceramics and UHMWPE all good with pro/cons for each
- Line-X coating on steel plates (as example) works as spall mitigation along as well as corrosion (to be used in conjuction with additional spall mitigation such as backers)

Backers - L3A (best option)
- Materials - avoid all except woven aramids (kevlar etc)

Am I missing anything - on the basic level? Is this something that would be good and versatile for nearly all situations as it is adaptable?

Last question - backers ran alone - just as effective as soft armor vest (given same level pro?)

[arslin]

The goal of this bill is to stop all armor that is able to defeat "law enforcement ammunition." I will ignore WTF is law enforcement ammunition, and stay on point. LVL IIIA is able to stop just about every pistol round there is. Most Law enforcement uses 9mm, and everything in current production can stop that. Even IIA (the worst armor in regards to stopping power) can stop 40s and 45ACP.

So... what is the point of this bill again?

[Ajcrash]

This article doesn't cover any technical details regarding armor, but it does touch on the potential future legality of it.

http://www.guns.com/2014/08/08/congressman-wants-to-ban-sale-of-enhanced-body-armor-to-civilians/

[dogabutila]

Guy I know is offering to sell a set of velocity systems ULV plates for $600. This seems to be too good of a deal. Any issues with them? They're steel so it's not like they can be broken right?

[97F1504RAD]

What is the weight of one of the curved patriot plates?

7.9lbs

[Bobbar]

What is the weight of one of the curved patriot plates?

[Lugiahua]

http://www.policeone.com/police-products/apparel/articles/7412293-Cop-creates-cool-breathable-vest-to-wear-under-armor/

Saw this on PoliceOne.com today, some sort of body armor insulation to reduce heat buildup inside. $69.99 per piece, might pick up one later to test the performance...

[97F1504RAD]

You would simply ruin the backer and still have spall in your face. Backers in back, fronters in front.

OK that was my thoughts it did not make much sense to me when I read it.