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Very frustrated (1911 trigger question)

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  • Bullwinkle
    Senior Member
    • May 2008
    • 565

    Very frustrated (1911 trigger question)

    I own a Para Stainless LTC, which just so happens to be my wife's favorite pistol in our gun safe. She says she's "one" with the pistol; and indeed, she does seem to shoot this one better than anything else. So I decided I'd semi-customize it for her. A few months back I installed a set of slim grips and a Wilson Combat 19# mainspring. Over this last weekend, I wanted to install an Ed Brown short trigger to complete the grip reduction process, and add a Wolff sear spring as a finishing touch. The weekend ended up being a lesson in futility.

    The long story (skip below to cut to the chase)
    ---------------------------------------------
    The trigger is semi-drop in. No problem, I can file (sort of)... and I did. I shaved the trigger height and even had to trim down the width a bit. It still wouldn't fit correctly, even though I could see light all around the trigger when viewed from the rear. Got out the calipers and discovered that the stirrup on the new trigger was about .007" too wide (height wise). Filed the forward portion of the stirrup down and got it to where the trigger would slide freely in and out of the frame under gravity alone. I admit it wasn't the best fit in the world (took too much off the sides), but honestly it wasn't all that bad.

    So with the difficult part of the job out of the way, it's smooth sailing from there, right? I bevelled the bottom of the stirrup so the mags wouldn't catch when inserted, deburred, sanded, polished, and pretty much brought the entire trigger assembly to a shiny finish. I mean, I must have spent around (literally) eight hours this weekend working on that stupid trigger. I proudly reassembled the pistol, and then the bubble burst.

    I barely managed to get the thumb safety in place, and its operation was rough. The trigger took an incredible amount of pressure to pull, was really gritty/jerky, and would not reset. Further, the grip safety wouldn't reset either. Everything was stuck. I disassembled the pistol again, pulled out the calipers one more time, and started measuring EVERYthing.

    The short story:
    ---------------
    It turns out the Ed Brown trigger's stirrup is about 1/16" longer than the Para's! Well, 1/16" is also about the thickness of the stirrup, so there's no way I can even file it down to size otherwise there won't be a rear to the stirrup anymore. All that work for nothing.

    So I'm at my wit's end. What are my options, folks? The way I figure it, I can either refit the grip safety, thumb safety, etc to the new trigger--which I do not want to do--or I can throw in the towel and admit defeat. I could try buying another brand of trigger, but I gotta believe that the 1911 master guru, Ed Brown, manufactures his triggers to spec and that it's my Para's trigger that is out-of-whack; so any quality trigger I purchase is going to be the same length as the Ed Brown and won't work in my pistol. I could cut out a small section of the stirrup and then weld it back together to shorten the length, but I have neither the tools nor skill level to attempt a precision job like that. I'm stumped, and leaning heavily toward admitting defeat. The wind has been taken out of my sails, as the analogy goes, and this post is a last-ditch effort for ideas to salvage the short trigger installation.

    Oh, and the Wolff sear spring? It doesn't reach the sear leg! The description on the Brownell's website says, "Fits all 1911s," and the product packaging says, "Colt 1911/1911A1, Commander Officers series, MKIV, Defender, and most copies." Most copies... but apparently not mine. Again, I have to believe that a best-quality outfit like Wolff manufactures its springs to spec, so it's gotta be the Para that's out-of-whack again. At least I can return this part.

    Overall, a very frustrating and depressing Easter weekend. [Ironically, it's also the best Easter I've had in a decade... didn't have to spend this one with my wife's family!]
    John

    Factory Certified Sig Sauer Armorer
    P.O.S.T. Certified Armorer: 1911 pistols, AR-15/M16/M4 weapon systems, Glock handguns, Remington 870 shotgun, Sig Sauer handguns.
    Certified Sig Sauer P320 Armorer

    Let's Go Brandon
  • #2
    NotEnufGarage
    CGN/CGSSA Contributor
    CGN Contributor
    • Oct 2010
    • 4832

    Sorry to hear about your frustration....

    First thing to learn about 1911's is that there is no "in spec"... Every frame differs. Parts differ. Some combinations of frame and parts are just never going to work, regardless of fitting.

    That said, your only recourse is to fit your existing safeties to that trigger or try safeties of the same manufacture and see how they fit.

    I have built a couple 1911's. The first one went together easily with only minimal fitting required. The second one (same brand of frame, different parts), took fitting of almost every part.

    I would put the old trigger away with the grip and thumb safeties that fit it and pick up a new one of each and fit them to the new trigger.. Or, put the old trigger back in and ditch the new one.
    sigpic
    NRA Life Member (Benefactor level)

    "Those who give up some of their liberty in order to obtain a little temporary safety, deserve neither liberty, nor safety." B. Franklin
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    Comment

    • #3
      Chief-7700
      Veteran Member
      • May 2008
      • 3382

      Put it back the way it was. Don't feel bad you should see the box of expensive 1911 parts that I destroyed over the years. Go to Brownells web site and look up part number #376-100-010AE.
      Chief

      XL-650 to feed the: .45ACP's Les Baer Concept V, Ruger SR 1911, Ruger Nightwatchman,custom built Colt M1911, Springfield .45ACP Loaded.. 9MM SA Range Officer,Ruger P-85, Springfield Stainless 9MM loaded, SA 9MM 5.25" XDM, Springfield 9mm Stainless Range Officer, STI double stack .45ACP.
      IDPA A41750 Safety Officer
      NRA Certified RSO
      "Stay out of the deep end of the pool; correct the problem with your credit card, not your dremel!"

      Comment

      • #4
        Bug Splat
        Calguns Addict
        • Dec 2007
        • 6561

        Originally posted by Chief-7700
        Put it back the way it was. Don't feel bad you should see the box of expensive 1911 parts that I destroyed over the years. Go to Brownells web site and look up part number #376-100-010AE.
        Chief
        +1

        Put the old trigger back in. If its a shorter reach she wants then cut off some of the face on the trigger. Fitting everything to a new trigger bar is going to be a PITA. Not worth it for a Para IMO.

        Comment

        • #5
          Bullwinkle
          Senior Member
          • May 2008
          • 565

          Originally posted by NotEnufGarage
          your only recourse is to fit your existing safeties to that trigger or try safeties of the same manufacture and see how they fit.
          Exactly the answer I didn't want to hear... but what I knew to be true deep down, so it's not unexpected. Thank you very much for your help.

          Originally posted by Chief-7700
          Don't feel bad you should see the box of expensive 1911 parts that I destroyed over the years.
          Yeah, the one saving grace that I have in all of this is that it was only a $20 part... and I used a gift card to boot. So at least I got off cheaply. [To be honest, I'm more upset about the time/effort I put into the project going to waste than I am about the price of the part.] I'll keep my fingers crossed, though, and hope this isn't the start of a big box of expensive 1911 parts that I destroy over the years.

          Go to Brownells web site and look up part number #376-100-010AE.
          You know, I've been on my current job now for over 13 years (computer geek), and one of the recurring themes on my performance reviews over the years is that I come up with simple solutions to complex problems. I'm rather embarrassed to say that I never even thought of checking to see if Para made a short trigger for their guns! You can bet I'm going to check into that now; and if they don't, it's nice to know that these other triggers you referenced are out there. Thanks, Chief!
          John

          Factory Certified Sig Sauer Armorer
          P.O.S.T. Certified Armorer: 1911 pistols, AR-15/M16/M4 weapon systems, Glock handguns, Remington 870 shotgun, Sig Sauer handguns.
          Certified Sig Sauer P320 Armorer

          Let's Go Brandon

          Comment

          • #6
            Bullwinkle
            Senior Member
            • May 2008
            • 565

            Originally posted by Bug Splat
            If its a shorter reach she wants then cut off some of the face on the trigger.
            Another simple solution!

            There's not really a lot to the face, though, as the original trigger is already skeletonized; but yes, I bet I could still take something off if I was careful about it. But in the end, I would prefer not to modify the original parts. I keep them in a bag with the gun, and should the occasion ever arise where I want to shoot the pistol on my own w/o my wife present, I can do a quick presto-chango and put the gun back into its original configuration, which is better suited for my hand/ergonomics (though a double-stack would be better still).

            Thanks again, everyone, for the help!
            John

            Factory Certified Sig Sauer Armorer
            P.O.S.T. Certified Armorer: 1911 pistols, AR-15/M16/M4 weapon systems, Glock handguns, Remington 870 shotgun, Sig Sauer handguns.
            Certified Sig Sauer P320 Armorer

            Let's Go Brandon

            Comment

            • #7
              Bug Splat
              Calguns Addict
              • Dec 2007
              • 6561

              Originally posted by Bullwinkle
              Another simple solution!

              There's not really a lot to the face, though, as the original trigger is already skeletonized; but yes, I bet I could still take something off if I was careful about it. But in the end, I would prefer not to modify the original parts. I keep them in a bag with the gun, and should the occasion ever arise where I want to shoot the pistol on my own w/o my wife present, I can do a quick presto-chango and put the gun back into its original configuration, which is better suited for my hand/ergonomics (though a double-stack would be better still).

              Thanks again, everyone, for the help!
              Oh if its already got holes drilled through then my idea will not work. You would only gain maybe 1/16".

              Comment

              • #8
                wash
                Calguns Addict
                • Aug 2007
                • 9011

                For sear springs, EGW prefers Colt.

                It has narrowed legs instead of reduced bend and Brownells sells them cheaper than some other sear springs.

                There is a spec. for 1911s, it's the ordnance spec. The real problem is that not all manufacturers stick to it.
                sigpic
                Originally posted by oaklander
                Dear Kevin,

                You suck!!! Your are wrong!!! Stop it!!!
                Proud CGF and CGN donor. SAF life member. Former CRPA member. Gpal beta tester (it didn't work). NRA member.

                Comment

                • #9
                  Bullwinkle
                  Senior Member
                  • May 2008
                  • 565

                  Originally posted by Chief-7700
                  Go to Brownells web site and look up part number #376-100-010AE.
                  Well, Chief, you gave it a good try and I certainly appreciate it; but alas, I'm hosed. Those triggers are for hi-cap frames, not the single-stack ones.

                  I also contacted Para directly, and they don't make anything either. Can't find a short Para-specific trigger anywhere.

                  Dang, dang, dang, dang, dang!

                  I don't suppose there's any way to just swap bows between the two, is there? [Last question of desperation!] Nah, didn't think so.

                  Thanks again, everyone, for your help.
                  John

                  Factory Certified Sig Sauer Armorer
                  P.O.S.T. Certified Armorer: 1911 pistols, AR-15/M16/M4 weapon systems, Glock handguns, Remington 870 shotgun, Sig Sauer handguns.
                  Certified Sig Sauer P320 Armorer

                  Let's Go Brandon

                  Comment

                  • #10
                    sarge1572
                    Senior Member
                    • Aug 2007
                    • 1086

                    never give up. I found these

                    Browse a HUGE selection of hunting rifles & shotguns, gun parts, gunsmithing tools, reloading equipment, ammo, and more! Brownells: Since 1939

                    er

                    Comment

                    • #11
                      kmca
                      Senior Member
                      • Oct 2005
                      • 2371

                      How about here:


                      It might be worth a call to see if these are for double stacks?

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