.44Mag issues w/Xtreme 240gr RNFP - Thoughts???

[David-K]

I've put together two separate loads recently that have garnered similar results, both horrible. Both loads consist of the following:

240gr Xtreme RNFP
1-2x fired brass
18.5gr 2400
WLP

First load was at an OAL of 1.60" the second at 1.585". The reason for the two OAL's was; on the first load I was having to crimp just below the cannelure in order to achieve the 1.60" OAL. I took those to the range an found they were not very accurate at all. In addition, I was finding plating on my bench that I was shooting from and stuck in the target as well. I figured that may have had to do with where the crimp was and how heavy it was. So, seeing as how I was at the bottom end of the powder charge window, I did a second run at a 1.585" OAL, which put the crimp right on the cannelure and backed off the crimp die a 1/4 turn. Took those to the range...same garbage. Still experiencing the same inconsistency, inaccuracy and plating issues.

Perhaps worthy of note: In previous loads, with actual "jacketed" projectiles (I have some older Hornady JHP's) and similar load recipe, the problems are non-existent. Am I simply pushing these plated Xtreme's too much? Unfortunately, I do not own a chrono so, I'm unsure of velocity. Sadly, it's likely that might give the answer right there.

So gents, I could use a hand here.

[John Browning]

You can't use anything close to the necessary crimp on a revolver bullet when the bullet is plated instead of jacketed. It cuts through the plating and ruins the bullet. You either have to switch to a very light taper crimp or go to jacketed or lead bullets.

Missouri bullet just started making a powder coated lead bullet that looks promising.

[Pablo5959]

I use range scrap, cast and powder coated.
Medium crimp.
Average group at 25yds is around 2 1/2".
The smith would do better. I wish my eyes would cooperate.

Really, if you can get the lead and you have the time.
This is the way to go for plinking large caliber.

Pablo

[chknlyps2]

Can you post a pic of your crimp? My go to load is 18 gr. of 2400 with the same bullet and they shoot fine. I roll crimp lightly right in the middle of the cannelure.

[Oceanbob]

This is an issue with plated bullets.

I just switched to lead .431 inch diameter bullets from Oregon Trail. Got them from MidwayUSA.

http://www.midwayusa.com/product/411664/oregon-trail-laser-cast-bullets-44-caliber-431-diameter-200-grain-lead-flat-nose-box-of-500

While .429 and .430 will run in .44 Mag firearms, my Marlin Lever with Ballard rifling needs the .431 to prevent tumbling. I found this out on the Marlin forum and not from personal experience..

Big discussion over there about plated .44 mag bullets as well. Power them down to maintain accuracy or switch to good old lead...

Thanks Scobun for the tip about Missouri Bullets....I might give those a try..

[BigBronco]

I use range scrap, cast and powder coated.
Medium crimp.
Average group at 25yds is around 2 1/2".
The smith would do better. I wish my eyes would cooperate.

Really, if you can get the lead and you have the time.
This is the way to go for plinking large caliber.

Pablo

^^^^ Yup!

[David-K]

Thanks for the input, guys.

SCOBUN, I took a look at the Missouri stuff and I was impressed enough that I just ordered 500 of these: http://www.missouribullet.com/detail...ary=&keywords=

Also, picked up 500 of the same thing, but for .357Mag.

Chknlyps2 - I would post some pics if I had any of the rounds left. I was so disgusted over how these were performing that I pulled them apart yesterday morning....ALL 270 OF THEM.

I think what I'll do now is just work up a simulated .44SPL load, while using magnum cases and use the Xtreme's for that. It would seem to me that I could get away with using a fairly light crimp for a load like that and hopefully avoid the same thing from happening again. At least, on paper it sounds good and I wouldn't just be throwing these things away.

[Pablo5959]

Just give them a medium crimp in the crimp groove.
You don't want to go much lower then starting load.
Pablo

[David-K]

SOLUTION!!!

Well, today I mixed up a batch using the same bullets and this time used 6.0gr of W231, 1.585 OAL and a light crimp. Took them to the range and the results were absolutely fantastic! Nice mellow, light to mid power magnum load. It became painfully obvious that these plated Xtreme's just can't be pushed as hard as I was when using the 18.5gr of 2400. Even though that load is at the bottom end of the 2400 powder window, it was apparently just too much. I'll clearly save the 2400, W296 and "full house" loads for my jacketed stuff. Though, I am curious to see just how much the Missouri Bullet Co. "coated" lead cast stuff that I just ordered can be pushed? According to them, they say 1400fps is well within reason. I'm looking forward to using them.

Frankly, I really didn't know what to expect from the W231 in this particular application as I typically use it in my 9mm and .45ACP stuff. But, after researching all four of my load books and the Hodgdon Load Center website, I settled on this charge weight and was very impressed. So, for those of you that might be interested in a magnum load that won't shake the fillings out of the mouths of the people on the 5 lanes on either side of you, this is a winner!

Thanks again for the input and suggestions guys, it got me pointed in the right direction.

[stilly]

Your firearm is being a whiney lil douche nozzle.

I feed 240gr plated XTREME/POWERBOND/WHATEVER fueled by 24.5-24.9gr of H-110 to my Deagle and it LOVES them. In fact sometimes it will bite the shells twice... (when it can, but only once in a while).

Plated are not babies; not THAT delicate, but the CRIMP only needs to hold it still, not make it an hourglass. Keep that in mind when you crimp your 44 plated rounds.

[Meety Peety]

Well, today I mixed up a batch using the same bullets and this time used 6.0gr of W231, 1.585 OAL and a light crimp. Took them to the range and the results were absolutely fantastic! Nice mellow, light to mid power magnum load. It became painfully obvious that these plated Xtreme's just can't be pushed as hard as I was when using the 18.5gr of 2400. Even though that load is at the bottom end of the 2400 powder window, it was apparently just too much. I'll clearly save the 2400, W296 and "full house" loads for my jacketed stuff. Though, I am curious to see just how much the Missouri Bullet Co. "coated" lead cast stuff that I just ordered can be pushed? According to them, they say 1400fps is well within reason. I'm looking forward to using them.

Frankly, I really didn't know what to expect from the W231 in this particular application as I typically use it in my 9mm and .45ACP stuff. But, after researching all four of my load books and the Hodgdon Load Center website, I settled on this charge weight and was very impressed. So, for those of you that might be interested in a magnum load that won't shake the fillings out of the mouths of the people on the 5 lanes on either side of you, this is a winner!

Thanks again for the input and suggestions guys, it got me pointed in the right direction.

I use 7.5gr of 231 behind both a powder coated cast boolit and Xtreme plated with similar results. So far, the accuracy of these loads is fantastic. Power is lighter than I'd really like though as truth be told, part of me bought a 44 just to enjoy that big boom. These loads felt like shooting a .22 out of my 6" Smith, and very accurate. Now if only I could get the same accuracy out of a true magnum load, I'd be all set. No dice yet, getting close though.

[mulyhuntr]

I've loaded 20gr of 2400 with 240 xtreme rnfp with no issues. Pretty mild crimp.

[David-K]

I use 7.5gr of 231 behind both a powder coated cast boolit and Xtreme plated with similar results. So far, the accuracy of these loads is fantastic. Power is lighter than I'd really like though as truth be told, part of me bought a 44 just to enjoy that big boom. These loads felt like shooting a .22 out of my 6" Smith, and very accurate. Now if only I could get the same accuracy out of a true magnum load, I'd be all set. No dice yet, getting close though.

One "full house" load that I've had tremendous success with is 23gr of W296 under 240gr JHP. They projectiles were older Hornady's, but I'd imagine similar JHP's would garner like results.

[edfardos]

Even the lowest load of 2400 leaves copper plating in the forcing cone of my Ruger revolver. Extreme plated bullets cannot be fired at magnum velocities in revolvers IMHO. They're awesome in every other cartridge I've tried however. Try Oregon trail laser cast for those 44mags.

Edfardos

[orangeusa]

Even the lowest load of 2400 leaves copper plating in the forcing cone of my Ruger revolver. Extreme plated bullets cannot be fired at magnum velocities in revolvers IMHO. They're awesome in every other cartridge I've tried however. Try Oregon trail laser cast for those 44mags.

Edfardos

Extreme says to keep velocities under 1500 fps. I've don't do mild loads, but the loads for 44RemMag are all mostly under this. I've had no issues with leading or copper residue on a Blackhawk.

Extreme plated seems okay for me. H110, 2400, W231 (mild load when I started), Alliant #9, seem to work fine. Some make a better fireball, all (not counting W231) seem very similar.

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