Cat sneeze 30-06 loads

[opos]

I want to play with some "cat sneeze" loads in my 06..(my '06 is a nice and clean Eddystone Enfield barrel and its not badly worn at all...I've loaded some GC projectiles with higher charges and higher velocities and they shoot fine in my barrel...I want to use non gas checked .311 projectiles of about 125-150 grains =- (if lighter weight would work I can find those too) .... I have Unique, Trail Boss, W231, 2400, Red Dot and W231 powders and if I can't do the job with one of those I'm not going to hunt up other powders..I don't cast but do find lots of projectiles in the 12-14 hardness range that look like they have a design to work...

So do any of you folks load these light loads in a 30 caliber rifle? If so do you use any dacron or cotton? Approx load data for a start to play in the 900- 1000 fps +- range? I'm looking at 50-100 yards "plinking" loads...

Appreciate any experinece you might have had..thanks
opos

[highpower790]

Are you sure that .311 bullets are needed,for 06 most would use .308 diameter?

[drdarrin@sbcglobal.net]

My Lyman cast bullets handbook lists Unique, N105, Enforcer, SR4759, IMR4198, 5744, Rx7 and IMR3031 powders for the Lee #C309-150-F bullet.

Max velocity is close to 2500 fps, minimum is around 1850 fps.

I have a mold for the Lyman #311332 - 170 gr GC. I haven't tried loading it yet but do have some 3031 put aside for just that purpose. It seems to have a very linear burn rate and moderate pressures.

If you know someone with Quickload, they might be able to help you out with load data for the powders you mentioned, but they are all pretty fast burning.

Good luck.

[Full Clip]

Regarding the use of Trail Boss...

[thenodnarb]

Are you sure that .311 bullets are needed,for 06 most would use .308 diameter?

with cast bullets, more like .309 or .310. .311 would work if it will chamber.

[highpower790]

with cast bullets, more like .309 or .310. .311 would work if it will chamber.

Thanks for the reply.I dont shoot cast bullets and know of only one aquaintance that does. When his bullets hit a target ,they sound like a football puching through, and that is from the pits.

[Capt.Dunsel]

I want to play with some "cat sneeze" loads in my 06..(my '06 is a nice and clean Eddystone Enfield barrel and its not badly worn at all...I've loaded some GC projectiles with higher charges and higher velocities and they shoot fine in my barrel...I want to use non gas checked .311 projectiles of about 125-150 grains =- (if lighter weight would work I can find those too) .... I have Unique, Trail Boss, W231, 2400, Red Dot and W231 powders and if I can't do the job with one of those I'm not going to hunt up other powders..I don't cast but do find lots of projectiles in the 12-14 hardness range that look like they have a design to work...

So do any of you folks load these light loads in a 30 caliber rifle? If so do you use any dacron or cotton? Approx load data for a start to play in the 900- 1000 fps +- range? I'm looking at 50-100 yards "plinking" loads...

Appreciate any experinece you might have had..thanks
opos

I have used cast bullets meant for the 30 carbine ( 120 gr) with 10 to 15 grains of unique , real mouse farts in a bunch of 30/06s. Funny thing is they to same POI as my 168 jacketed with 5 times the powder ( not unique).

My grand kids ( ages 12 , 10 , 10 and 8 got more but those shoot) love to use the Big Boy rifle ( Remington 700 ) that they see my oldest son and Grampa use .

[sghart]

This thread is right up my alley. Shooting cast bullets in my 30-06 Mauser, VZ24 7X57 and Savage bolt action 30-30 is what occupies a lot of my time. I won't bore you with the standard "10 gr of Unique/ 16 gr of 2400" recipes as you said non gas-checked bullets. But these loads are my favorite when I do use gas checks.

For non gas check loads in a .30 cal rifle I have a favorite that I shoot a lot. Also good for kids/grandkids. I buy a box of .32 cal lead balls for muzzleloaders. They are .311 diameter. And yes, .311 diameter lead is fine in any 30 cal bore. Then I tumble lube them in White Label 45-45-10 or Lee Liquid Alox. I then load them over 4 to 5 grains of W231, no fillers. They are quiet with no recoil and are surprisingly accurate to 60-70 yards.

I have gone as low as 3 gr in my 30-30 cases. Any lower and I am afraid I might stick a bullet. And even if I did I can push it out with a rod.

Super light loads are very popular in some parts of the world. They are also increasingly popular with today's preppers/survivalist/utilitarian crowd. My father grew up in the depression and the family had one rifle and one shotgun. These types of light loads put a lot of squirrel and rabbit meat on the table. They couldn't waste store bought ammo on small game, when they could get it it was reserved for moose and bear. "Beware the man who has one gun, he probably knows how to use it." That describes a lot of people old and young. In fact, my father still had that attitude in the '70's when my oldest brother came home from the service. He mentioned to my Dad that he was going to buy a 1911 with his separation check and my Dad said "what for? you already have a rifle."

Try it and let us know how it worked for you.

[Bastard]

I'm using 170gr gas checked over Unique, haven't finished getting the load down but up to 15.4 gr there was really no recoil to speak of, shot out of a 1950 Winchester Model 70

I use a 165 plain base pill in my 30-30 using Unique as well...

I have read some where that Unique is pretty darn good cast rifle powder, no matter what it is loaded in... Red Dot/Trail Boss is supposed to be pretty good as well.

[rm1911]

This is such a great topic. I don't know if people are aware but unique was actually developed as a gallery rifle round powder. It was designed for reduced rifle loads for military garrison duty. And yes, 10gr of unique is the "magic" number, as high as 12-13gr sometimes. I downloaded an old Lyman manual for somewhere on the Internet and it shows lots of loads for cast bullets in rifle chamberings.

Anyways, I've shot .311 lead (Hunters supply bullets) out of my 03A3 with 10gr unique. Worked great. Wouldn't chamber in my sons marlin X7 though. I'm thinking modern sporting rifles are a little tighter chamber/throat than old military ones. Just a guess though. Don't quite me on it.

The best powder for this application is trail boss. It's hard to find but is amazing. And imr even provides a formula for load development. Best part of TB is that it works perfectly with jacketed bullets. 16-17gr with a 147 in my '06 is like shooting not even a 223. My 12y/o son has a blast with them. Great practice for hunting without beating his shoulder up.

Unique is of course the old war horse. Trail boss is the new champion. However, with cast bullets, and again don't rush out and go balls deep into this, many pistol powders will work. Bullseye has been used as well. Most powders in that range will work. Even powders like blue dot.

Here's the thing though. Some powders are position sensitive, meaning that if he powder is lying flat on the side of he cartridge, you might not get sufficient burn to ignite. So a filled of poly something is necessary. Check the internet for what is commonly used but it's actually pillow stuffing. Weigh it out add to pistol charge weight. That's the "grains". So 10gr if powder and 3gr of filer is a 13gr load. The filler is very fluffy. Make sure powder is on bottom and you put filler in too.

Anyways, a powder like bullseye will work with lead bullets with as little as 5-6gr of powder. Be VEEEEERRRYYY careful not to double charge. It's hard to look into an '06 case and see that little powder. But, it will push a lead projo out the barrel. The trick is getting enough velocity to stabilize it.

Think of the colibri 22 rounds. They're only primer driven. If 22 primer can push a lead bullet out of a barrel then 5-6 gr bullseye will for sure. And in such a big case, in a rifle chamber, you won't have a pressure concern. Besides, bullseye is a fast burning powder, which is what you want for this thing. It won't cycle an auto however.

There's a whole wealth of literature and information on mouse fart loads. Load development isn't actually terribly hard. Just always carry a metal cleaning rod and mallet in case one doesn't exit. And always inspect bore after every shot to make sure it clears.

It's actually quite fun bringing out a big blot rifle to the range and hearing a little "phhhffff". Get strange looks.

[CPRAFAN]

Here you go: Hammond Game Getter cartridges for .30-06: http://www3.telus.net/gamegetter/Calibers.html

[G-Man WC]

Regarding the use of Trail Boss...

I'll second using Trail Boss for Mouse Fart loads. I've tried it in 308 and 30-06 and had kiddies pulling the trigger on 30cal's. They thought it was magic.
At 100 Yds you'll need adjust your sights a bit.
-g

[Agustav]

Used to use Unique, but the chance of double charging is too great. 10gr vs. 20gr in a big case like 30-06 or 7.62x54R is pretty hard to tell even with a flash light down the case.

I've switched to trailboss now and load worry-free...

[CEDaytonaRydr]

Ammosmith did a good "how to" video series on squib loads. Check it out:

[Bastard]

It's actually quite fun bringing out a big blot rifle to the range and hearing a little "phhhffff". Get strange looks.

yes it is... I usually get the "WTF!!! how light did you load those things"