Laws requiring reload disclosure

[Noldor]

I bought some ammo from LAXammo a few months ago. It was stated to be Winchester Match grade .308 ammo, and arrived in the factory boxes. While firing at the range I noticed a number of feeding problems. Then a very serious problem developed. The casing broke off in the chamber!

After I found out what it was, I looked over the casings and I saw the textbook signs of loads that are too hot (flattened primers, bands around the casing near the head). I didn't think to check them before that since I had no idea that it was NOT factory ammo.

Apparently everyone knew that they sell reloaded ammo but me.

Is there not a LAW requiring them to disclose the fact that the ammo they're selling is reloaded?

[nothing4u]

What did the receipt say factory new or factory reloads? On their webpage and even at the gunshows their ammo is advertise as reloads unless stated otherwise.

[CSACANNONEER]

Uh, if it was loaded in new brass by an 06 or 07FFL (LAX is on or the other), it is FACTORY NEW ammo. Instead of going off on them without knowing what you're talking about, why not call them and politely discuss it.

Disclaimer: I am not associated with LAX in any way. I have no personal experience with their products and no need to ever do business with them. In fact, I don't even buy stuff from them at gunshows.

[J-cat]

Do the cases say Winchester? Do the boxes say Winchester? Or do the boxes say .308 Winchester?

[bitethebullet]

Hopefully they didn't put reloads back into a factory box

[bsumoba]

Winchester has been notorious for quality issues. See this guy's review of factory ammo. He mentions winchester white box specifically as having quality issues, but wouldnt be surprised if it extended out to other types of ammo such as match grade.

I would stick with Black Hills, Hornady, Buffalo Bore, Federal, and other "higher" end brands/mfg.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ivh_rfwd1UM

[knucklehead0202]

I think they do sell some factory ammo but mostly reloaded or "remanufactured" ammo. that said, I have experienced issues with win white box but not nearly as bad as rem UMC. regardless of if they've fixed it or not, I've never experienced such inconsistency in ammunition before. fire 2 on target, 3rd one 5ft low and stovepipe, over and over. it'd happen 2-3 times in one magazine in my pistols. anyhow, I would consult them over your ammo issue and likely as not they'll make it right, being regulars around here and I know a lot of people have shot their ammo to great effect. they have a reputation to uphold and I imagine they will do so with gusto! good luck and always check your fired cases no matter where they come from.

[Germz]

From LAX AMMUNITION website
In the year 2009, LAX firing Range Inc. established LAX AMMO. Ammunition was at a scarce, prices were ridiculously high, and retailers did not have a decent supply of any caliber. Though LAX continues to stock and carry a large supply of new factory brand ammunition, we knew we could bring a high quality reload to the market and to our range customers with substantial savings. In addition to manufacturing our own high quality reload and new ammunition, LAX has gone direct with companies such as Remington, Tula Ammo, Fiocchi, Winchester and Federal/CCI, which allows us to offer our customers additional savings. We also purchase in huge quantities with distributors of PMC to get the best pricing possible.

LAX AMMO is Southern California’s premier loading center manufacturing both reloaded and factory new ammunition. Over 1/2 million high-quality rounds are loaded in our facility each week. We pride ourselves in manufacturing the highest quality reloads anywhere and we offer a 100% satisfaction guarantee policy!

Our goal is to buy the lowest price point possible so that we can sell to our customers at a rock bottom price. We always have case quantity pricing and our reloads come in cans of 500 and 1000 rounds

OP does the box specify "remanufactured" or "reloaded"? If it doesn't (or didn't at the time of purchase) I think you have a legitimate complaint. If it did well...at least you're wiser to their quality of ammo now.

[promethean_spark]

Is your gun okay with other ammo? A friend of mine got a 308 barrel with a tight throat that kicked out brass with severe overpressure signs on several types of ammo while a couple other guns ate them fine. Barrel returned, problem solved. (this was a brownells LR-308 barrel)

[Noldor]

Thank you everyone for your responses.

The ammo was shipped in Winchester boxes that clearly say "Winchester Match 308win 168 grain Matchking HPBT". The headstamps say "Winchester 308 win". The guys at the range (including the owner) said it looked like the brass was reloaded. There is nothing on the box, receipt, or website mentioning reloaded or remanufactured. So yes, they put their own reloads into Winchester factory boxes. I am aware that frequently manufacturers will call all .308 ammo "308win" and .223 ammo ".223 Remington". This goes beyond that.

On their webpage and even at the gunshows their ammo is advertise as reloads unless stated otherwise.

Please show me where this is stated. I am unable to find it. If it's my own fault, of course I'd like to know.

CSACANNONEER, since I seem to be "going off on them without knowing what [I'm] talking about," let me clarify. I started this post to get more information before deciding whether to get a refund (if it's an isolated incident) or pursue legal class action.
Help me to understand:
FACTORY NEW only means that the manufacturer has a 06 or 07 Federal Firearms License and that the brass is new? What term is used to describe ammunition that is actually manufactured/assembled by "The Winchester company brand used today under license by two subsidiaries of the Herstal Group, Fabrique Nationale (FN) of Belgium and the Browning Arms Company of Morgan, Utah." I'm not a lawyer, but I believe if they're selling ammo that is not made by Winchester, and passing it off as being made by Winchester, they are violating copyright and/or trademark laws.

If LAXammo has "gone direct" with those five firearms companies, I would think LAXammo is buying direct from them, not manufacturing ammo under their names. I think those companies would want to know about this!

I'm not out of line being very angry about being duped into using crappy reloads that could damage my rifle, my hand, or my face in an explosive detonation, because it was not subjected to quality control standards. My own reloads were giving me tighter groups than this garbage! I also object to unethical business practices.

[Ritchie8719]

The guys at the range

that is a big WHATEVER.

[at_liberty]

Hmm...once reloaded in a cleaned case, what is it about a cartridge that gives it away as a "reload"?

[J-cat]

Once a case expands to fit a chamber, it cannot be returned to original dimensions by the sizing die which typically leaves a ring at the bottom of the case head maybe a tenth of an inch north of the extractor groove. Even small base dies do this. Maybe a roll sizer wouldn't.

[J-cat]

Hey OP:

Put up a hi red pic of the unfired ammo and some fired brass.

[toby]

Learn how to load your own and never buy factory or someone else's reloads again. It's like an EASY button!