Powder Coating projectiles Methods/Tips discussion

[bigred1]

I am extremely new to this process and kinda high jacked another thread. So to be appropriate, I started this thread to discuss techniques or methods for:

Cleaning store bought hard cast

Spray vs wet/dry shake

baking

resizing and seating

etc etc etc

[meaty-btz]

Spray will produce the most "even" and regular coating. This is a plus in my book. It just requires time and effort to build jigs and that sort of thing. Dust control is an issue with custom booth. Powder gets everywhere.

Tumble seems to work just fine in a two coat system. It's a bit rough and uneven and that will create an unbalanced weight on the bullet in flight. Does it matter? Need to run some tests as I lost half my bullets to a melt-down.

[bigred1]

My first attempt went horrible wrong.

I baked at 200* for 20 mins and kinda hoped that I got all the lube off.

dry shook white HF PC then backed at 400* for 20 mins. Then repeated the process for a second coat.

Coating looked good and I tried to seat without resizing (.452 die inbound) ended up skinning some coating right off.

Another member chimed in and gave his method for cleaning involving a double preheat and an acetone bath.

Once my resize die comes in, I will get a lot more involved in this process. If it's worth doing then it's worth doing right. I kind of went at this first batch half *****.

So for next time:
Meaty's cleaning method
2 coats of dry shake
Bell the brass a little deeper
resize and seat.

I'm doing all my testing with .452 HC 230gn RN purchased from my LGS.

[anyracoon]

Here is a link from 300BlkTalk http://www.300blktalk.com/forum/view...?f=141&t=84219

[meaty-btz]

Acetone is most certainly your friend in removing the lube. I've got a few hundred commercial hard cast .38 bullets to clean.

Does not rank very high on my "fun things to do" list. It is labor intensive to even remove the waxy hard type lube as it is also elsewhere on the bullet.

You can skin the coating off without enough belling of the casemouth (pistol) or a good chamfer (rifle) or if a gaschecked casting w/o a gas check you will always shave. Just as with seating regular lead bullets, very easy to shave lead without proper accounting for the differences in seating and belling.

[3006mv]

you may try and like the Lee Universal flare die, I for one do, especially for .22 hornet. http://www.midwayusa.com/product/140...-expanding-die
you should trim all your cases to same length for it to be most effective.

[bigred1]

Universal flare die looks interesting.

Right now I'm loading with a standard RCBS 3 die set. I normally just barely bell to seat HC and I get a little bit of shaving on occasion. The PC shave, probably would of shot fine but I did not want to chance it.

I would really like to spray and probably will have to once this progress to casting 30 cal for my Black. I'm limited on space right now as it is so I'm trying to perfect the dry tumble for mass 45 loading.
I think I'm gonna buy another tumbler specifically for doing PC.

[thenodnarb]

I don't understand the point in powder coating 45 acp. I don't get any leading in my 45 with my pan lube method and I can do that in the kitchen. My lube is just something I threw together based on the ingredients from other people's lube. I mix equal amounts of beeswax and paraffin and added a small amount of crisco and olive oil to soften it slightly.

The point of powder coating to me is to push the bullets faster than they otherwise could be. that is not an issue with 45acp.

Also, it seems really silly to buy cast bullets from commercial suppliers, then spend all that time in removing their lube only to lube it with your own lube or powder coat. For the cost of buying a batch of bullets, you could buy a mold and a cheap pot and have the tools to be set for life. Now if this is just an experiment that might get you into casting, then by all means go for it.

Now regarding methods, I chose to spray because I already had the compressor and respirator. Overspray notwithstanding, I think it is a better method that will save you time. Tumbling, baking then tumbling again and re baking again seems like more effort and a less than fantastic result(due to unevenness). The spray method is superior but probably costs more if you don't have the gear. I think there might be an alternative method though that doesn't require a sprayer: Heat the bullets in your oven in whatever jig you are using. Then remove, and use something akin to a powdered sugar sifter to shake powder onto the bullets. The powder should stick and even melt a little. If you have a good jig you can turn it every which way so the powder gets all over the bullets. Then just put it back into the oven and cure. One coat should do it, and no special equipment is necessary. You could also potentially use a heat gun to heat the bullets and cure the powder, but the toaster oven seems better.

My jig, as I have now written about 3 times today, is just an oak board with 100 or so holes drilled into it of the proper size to stick my bullet bases into. They stick in with resistance and I can even shake the whole board with the bullets in it and they wont fall over. Since I am spraying, I use a sacrificial tin foil sheet and place it on top of the board, then push the bullets through the tin foil into the holes. I attach the sprayer lead to the tin foil to provide the electrical charge for the powder to stick to, and then spray and bake. It takes no longer to do this than to pan lube, and I get less mess overall(no beeswax in my dies or on my fingers as I size and load).

here is my jig


Here are my beautiful beautiful bullets


As mentioned over in the cast boolits thread on this(which is ridiculously immense), there are sprayers that can be had for around $70 that do not require an air compressor. This tool is also useful if you want to powder coat gun parts or other things as well so it is not strictly a reloading tool. Spend the money now on the tools you need and you will save in the future for a long time. I'm shooting .308 for under .20 cents and most of that is powder. I shoot .45acp for $3 a box. Heck it costs more than that to shoot .22lr these days! My casting equipment has paid for itself already and I've only been doing it a few months!

[thenodnarb]

Don't spend the money on another tumbler! This is a better solution and costs the same!

http://www.ebay.com/itm/WAI-Fully-electric-complete-powder-coat-system-gun-cup-Craftsman-powder-sample-/300996732022

That is the WAI powder coat system(sears one is discontinued). just buy powder from Harbor freight(red or black) and you are set to powder coat(plus a toaster oven).
Heck, I bet you could go to a scrap yard and buy an actual gas oven for cheap that can serve as your outdoor, dedicated casting(via top burners) and powder coating oven. And you will only have to spray once.
If space is your concern, the self contained sprayer is probably more compact when stored than the tumbler. And you can save yourself the careful picking up of bullets and balancing them gingerly on a cookie sheet and slowly transferring them to the toaster oven, TWICE for the tumble coat method.

[bigred1]

^^^^excellent idea^^^

I could spend the same cash and just buy a HF sprayer too. I have a compressor and respirator already

To spray, I would have to construct a booth that breaks down. It's the space to store a small booth that I don't have. Even 24"x24"x24" would be a pain in my arse right now. My garage looks like a shab-chic furniture factory.

Casting is where I am headed. But for right now, I only load lead in 45. and since I merry xmas'd myself a 629, casting equipment will have to wait. After the first I will probably start lead hunting.

[hermosabeach]

I had NEVER heard of this technique....

How hard is the Powder after it has been baked?

Will these wear out a barrel like Bi-metal?

I am definitely interested in the process

[thenodnarb]

^^^^excellent idea^^^

I could spend the same cash and just buy a HF sprayer too. I have a compressor and respirator already

To spray, I would have to construct a booth that breaks down. It's the space to store a small booth that I don't have. Even 24"x24"x24" would be a pain in my arse right now. My garage looks like a shab-chic furniture factory.

FYI I don't spray in a booth. I just spray on the back porch/ back yard and hose down the overspray. It doesn't harden or stain, at least not on my concrete. It just washes off. You could put down a tarp or even trash bag right on the ground and spray. the powder doesn't go too far.

[thenodnarb]

I had NEVER heard of this technique....

How hard is the Powder after it has been baked?

Will these wear out a barrel like Bi-metal?

I am definitely interested in the process

i Hadn't heard of it before either until two weeks ago! Now I'm having great success!

To answer your questions, the powder coat is very durable, but softer than copper so it will not wear out your barrel faster than ordinary bullets. People have pounded these bullets flat and the powder coat doesn't come off or flake. I have not recovered any of my bullets yet but others have shown that the powder coat maintains a barrier between the lead and the rifling all the way down the barrel. Essentially it does what we need it to so we can push them faster than straight lead.
Its a whole lot easier than paper patching and has some other advantages as well.

[Sampachi]

I had purchased some Makarov lead bullets from a forum member on Gunboards and had wondered why they looked like this! I had thought it was some sort of silicon coating.
Thanks for posting this. Now I know how to make my own.

[hermosabeach]

One of the cool things on powder coating is that you can reuse the overspray.

It is a dust until baked and melted onto the product.

Any overspray can be vacuumed up or reused I clean.



After seeing the wear tests on bimetallic rounds wearing out an AR twice as fast as copper I was worried that this would do the same.

Does anyone have an MSDS on cured powder coat?

This looks like a win for the .44 mag lever guns.