Commercial Reloading Startup.

[anon-e-mouse]

I am considering going partners with a good friend into commercial reloading here in SoCal. I have no experience with reloading however I know enough to understand that supplies are extremely hard to come by right now. My partner has access to the supplies and knows the process and well I'm the guy with the money lol. Anyways just trying to do my research into this before I dive in further.

I am planning on investing 40-80K into this startup assuming my partner proves to me that he can get the hard to find supplies in bulk and from a reliable vender. I have no problem renting an industrial building (properly zoned of course) and hiring on 15 employees if need be as I already have 3 offices and 7 staff members so managing that part of the business I am experienced with.

So lets assume I can get the supplies for a reasonable price, whatever that may be and my primary focus is on 223 ammo. I'm guessing were running 10-15 presses that put out about 1000-1200/hr thats 288-432K per day assuming its a 24/7 operation.

What type of expenses are we really looking at, for example cost to make 1K reloads (materials only). Then of course need to factor in cost of labor, insurance, rent...etc and from there try to figure out what I can sell them for. Ideally if I'm really doing those kinds of numbers I would probably want a small store front and also to sell to other stores and online in bulk only.

Trying to figure out what the potential return is on this assuming my partner can prove he can get the supplies. I'm not trying to make millions from this however I have a feeling it can be very profitable if done right.

[joelogic]

Reloaders gross $40-$50 per 1k pre panic prices.

[tiller]

I am considering going partners with a good friend into commercial reloading here in SoCal. I have no experience with reloading however I know enough to understand that supplies are extremely hard to come by right now. My partner has access to the supplies and knows the process and well I'm the guy with the money lol. Anyways just trying to do my research into this before I dive in further.

I am planning on investing 40-80K into this startup assuming my partner proves to me that he can get the hard to find supplies in bulk and from a reliable vender. I have no problem renting an industrial building (properly zoned of course) and hiring on 15 employees if need be as I already have 3 offices and 7 staff members so managing that part of the business I am experienced with.

So lets assume I can get the supplies for a reasonable price, whatever that may be and my primary focus is on 223 ammo. I'm guessing were running 10-15 presses that put out about 1000-1200/hr thats 288-432K per day assuming its a 24/7 operation.

What type of expenses are we really looking at, for example cost to make 1K reloads (materials only). Then of course need to factor in cost of labor, insurance, rent...etc and from there try to figure out what I can sell them for. Ideally if I'm really doing those kinds of numbers I would probably want a small store front and also to sell to other stores and online in bulk only.

Trying to figure out what the potential return is on this assuming my partner can prove he can get the supplies. I'm not trying to make millions from this however I have a feeling it can be very profitable if done right.

he may think he can get supplies... he can probably get like 50-100k of each item.... but what your talking is 1,000,000 + items....


i would not do business with that guy... hes just lied to you


the ammunition factories have cut back on selling reloading supplies so they could have enough components just to make there own ammo....

its slim picking now... good luck! you chose the worst time to start up a business

[Oceanbob]

Save your money. The overhead and extremely high Liability Insurance will hurt bad. Also, protect yourself with a Corporation so when someone loses an eye on a double charge you won't lose everything in a Lawsuit.

I doubt your buddy can get the components he speaks of. He wants the Money. If making ammo was so profitable he should have plenty of money and a credit rating good enough for an SBA loan or Private funding.

As soon as this Freny is over expect .223 to drop way, way down in cost. No profit, no sales, not worth it.


Stay away.

[ExtremeX]

Good luck with this… I don’t see it getting off the ground for 80k with what you have mentioned…

It sounds like your overhead is going to be terribly high to turn a profit too… 15 presses? 15 employees?

What I envision here is 15 minimum wage workers rocking out on some Lee Classic Turrets…

You can one man band this operation with a couple machines from Camdex…

Even if you are able to get it off the ground, I don’t see component availably working in your favor to feed your machines to have a 288-432k per day turnover.

What about quality control? Even if your price is right id have concerns buying commercial reloads especially from a new startup company…

[DarkSoul]

Also is your friend licensed? You need to have an FFL to manufacture ammo for resale, if he doesn't already, bank on about 6 months to get that. As well you need to check in with the CA DOJ to make sure you have that sorted as well as local zoning, you will after all be storing gun powder by the ton and primers (explosive) by the ton.

I seriously doubt that your boy has the components lined up, let's look at the numbers, if you have 6 machines, and we will assume they can each run out 1k per hour each, so you have 6k per hour total, and say you run a single 8 hour shift and let's say you can get 6 full blown production hours out of that, that's 48000 primers a day, run 5 days a week, 2400000 primers a week, so roughly 1 million per month. I can't even find 5000 primers right now, where are you guys gonna get a million a month every month?

And that's just the primers, still need brass, projectiles and powder.

You also have to prep the brass, specially .223, this is time consuming, you will need a dozen converted cement mixers to tumble them clean, think about what a quarter mill in brass is going to require in prep.

To get into a full blown commercial reload op is going to be way more than $80k, and a lot more planning than your friend has done. I would pass.

[Mp5marley]

don't forget the FFL paper work! you would be better off manufacturing 80% lowers.. It's a lot easier and there are lots of machine shops that no longer have aerospace work here in cali to rely upon....unregulated and market is looking excellent for 80% lowers.

[tiller]

do not buy a camdex machine...what people dont know is that you have to pay a federal excise of about 30% if you run one of those machines....

why do you think people use 1050's.....?

you only have to pay an 11% manufactures fee!! plus sales tax!


have at it!!

[anon-e-mouse]

he may think he can get supplies... he can probably get like 50-100k of each item.... but what your talking is 1,000,000 + items....

This is actually one of my #1 concerns. I'm unsure of the exact quantities available but I would need multi-millions in a market where people are having problems finding 1,000. Granted with the right connection, maybe its possible, maybe its a smoke screen. I will find out more tomorrow.

Save your money. The overhead and extremely high Liability Insurance will hurt bad. Also, protect yourself with a Corporation so when someone loses an eye on a double charge you won't lose everything in a Lawsuit.

I doubt your buddy can get the components he speaks of. He wants the Money. If making ammo was so profitable he should have plenty of money and a credit rating good enough for an SBA loan or Private funding.

As soon as this Freny is over expect .223 to drop way, way down in cost. No profit, no sales, not worth it.

From my understand he has everything he needs, except the cash to make it happen or the credit to go out and get a loan. I didn't fund anything yet, this is like day 1 of talks and before I invest a penny I'm glad I came here for some advise.

But yes thats another concern is turning a profit once supply returns and demand lowers since every is stockpiled up. Of course Im talking about making rounds for just about anything thats in need not just 223 rounds.



I checked out the Camdex site, pretty awesome stuff they got there but something says the machine will cost 30-50k to output 3,500ish rounds per hour when 3-4 of the $1300 machines could do the same thing?

Also is your friend licensed? You need to have an FFL to manufacture ammo for resale, if he doesn't already, bank on about 6 months to get that. As well you need to check in with the CA DOJ to make sure you have that sorted as well as local zoning, you will after all be storing gun powder by the ton and primers (explosive) by the ton.

I seriously doubt that your boy has the components lined up, let's look at the numbers, if you have 6 machines, and we will assume they can each run out 1k per hour each, so you have 6k per hour total, and say you run a single 8 hour shift and let's say you can get 6 full blown production hours out of that, that's 48000 primers a day, run 5 days a week, 2400000 primers a week, so roughly 1 million per month. I can't even find 5000 primers right now, where are you guys gonna get a million a month every month?

And that's just the primers, still need brass, projectiles and powder.

You also have to prep the brass, specially .223, this is time consuming, you will need a dozen converted cement mixers to tumble them clean, think about what a quarter mill in brass is going to require in prep.

To get into a full blown commercial reload op is going to be way more than $80k, and a lot more planning than your friend has done. I would pass.

I agree, everything is in beginning stages, literally its day one and if this really takes off I'm sure its going to take a month or two to take off. I understand about risk, zoning laws, etc and yes my partner has his FFL although not sure what level.

But I totally see what you mean about having huge tumblers to prep...etc.

don't forget the FFL paper work! you would be better off manufacturing 80% lowers.. It's a lot easier and there are lots of machine shops that no longer have aerospace work here in cali to rely upon....unregulated and market is looking excellent for 80% lowers.

Good call, might start looking into that as well.

[call-in]

OP, believe us, there is nothing we would want more than have another ammo producer help out with the supply side and keep prices down. But reality is, you couldn't have picked a worst time to join the game. Sorry, I wish we have better news for you.

[call-in]

This is actually one of my #1 concerns. I'm unsure of the exact quantities available but I would need multi-millions in a market where people are having problems finding 1,000. Granted with the right connection, maybe its possible, maybe its a smoke screen. I will find out more tomorrow.

Maybe you can ask him to get the components first before you get the machines, if anything, you could re-sell the components for a little profit, if it comes down to it. My concern wouldn't be the initial shipment but his ability to provide a steady stream of components once you have paid for the machines.

[ExtremeX]

I checked out the Camdex site, pretty awesome stuff they got there but something says the machine will cost 30-50k to output 3,500ish rounds per hour when 3-4 of the $1300 machines could do the same thing?

[anon-e-mouse]

OP, believe us, there is nothing we would want more than have another ammo producer help out with the supply side and keep prices down. But reality is, you couldn't have picked a worst time to join the game. Sorry, I wish we have better news for you.

I agree its an extremely hard time to come into the game, however "if" and only "if" this supplier can produce a large enough quantity to make this worth while then I can see it actually becoming an extremely profitable business. I mean simple supply and demand, nobody has the supply and the demand is intense so if I can get a reliable supply I'm an instant success.

I briefly talked with my buddy a few mins ago, asked if his supplier can get enough supplies for 300k rounds per day and he laughed at me lol, so at least I know hes honest and isn't trying to act like he can produce 9 million rounds per month from his supplier. Tomorrow I will speak with the supplier directly and will try to find out to what quantities we can really expect to receive. I found out who the supplier is and their company specializes in firearm and ammunition supplies to military and law enforcement, so anyways well see more tomorrow.

Out of curiosity lets say I can get a nice supply however don't really want to go ahead with the whole idea, can I resell these supplies right now for a descent profit?

[ExtremeX]

Out of curiosity lets say I can get a nice supply however don't really want to go ahead with the whole idea, can I resell these supplies right now for a descent profit?

If you can actually find primer and powder and can offer reasonable

[joelogic]

This happened in 08 as well. During every ammo shortage people want to get into manufacturing to capitalize on the high margins.

Miwall sells a million dollars in ammo during a gumshoe weekend. Tough to compete, IMHO. But there is always room for more competition.