De-Priming before Sizing

[M76]

I shot a 0.95" 3 shot group at 600yds in 5 seconds (no joke) with dirty primer pockets.
How much better do you figure it would have been with clean primer pockets?

Perhaps rifle rounds are different, I only load for pistol calibers
and found the primers seat more uniformly with a clean pocket.
I even use a dremel with a wire-brush to clean out the pockets!

[RickD427]

You are missing the wind part.
It's much more important than the basic geometry part at 600.

You're right, and that was the reason for all of the "smilies" at the end of the post.

The truth be told, learning to read the wind is proving to be the most difficult part of my benchrest learning curve.

My .292 was shot at the beginning of the match in May and there was no wind. OTOH, during last month's match I was shooting a light varmint bag gun and 14 of the 15 other competitors were shooting rail guns. I didn't do so good on that day.

[kcheung2]

I deprime/resize at the same time, but I can see some (non benchrest) reasons to do it separately.

Most depriming tools can be used while sitting on the couch, watching tv. Depriming/resizing is done at the press, standing in the cold/hot garage.

Many hand deprimers have a better design in that the deprimer rod is less likely to break. And even if it breaks, depriming can still be done on the die.

The deprimer tool is a less "critical" tool in that the chamber is oversized so doesn't matter if it gets dirty.

Many reloaders want to clean the brass as early in the process as possible. However, they face the conundrum mentioned in above posts that cleaning first means the primer stays in & thus pocket stays dirty. Depriming/resizing with a dirty case in a die dirties up the die. A separate depriming step with a dedicated deprimer solves that.

Many deprimer tools are universal, so one could conceivably resize a random handful of different cartridges in a sitting. Don't know how useful that is, but it's possible.

[RickD427]

I deprime/resize at the same time, but I can see some (non benchrest) reasons to do it separately.

Most depriming tools can be used while sitting on the couch, watching tv. Depriming/resizing is done at the press, standing in the cold/hot garage.

Many hand deprimers have a better design in that the deprimer rod is less likely to break. And even if it breaks, depriming can still be done on the die.

The deprimer tool is a less "critical" tool in that the chamber is oversized so doesn't matter if it gets dirty.

Many reloaders want to clean the brass as early in the process as possible. However, they face the conundrum mentioned in above posts that cleaning first means the primer stays in & thus pocket stays dirty. Depriming/resizing with a dirty case in a die dirties up the die. A separate depriming step with a dedicated deprimer solves that.

Many deprimer tools are universal, so one could conceivably resize a random handful of different cartridges in a sitting. Don't know how useful that is, but it's possible.

"Cheep" also made a good point in his posting that removing the primer greatly facilitates the drying process after wet tumbling.

I just finished hydroforming a bunch of .220 Russian brass into (roughly) 6mm PPC brass. That required a spent primer to be placed in the case to hold the water during the hydroforming process. It was major PITA to drain the cases afterward. There was no source of venting and water simply hung up in the cases. I had to resort to a compressed air gun to blow them out.

When I was doing mainstream reloading, I frequently had problems with the decapping pins on most dies. They just proved to be too fragile for the application and I would frequently break them.

I'm now using a dedicated decapping die made by the "Mighty Armory" It has a very massive shaft and a short pin. I haven't broken one yet and have used it to deprime a couple thousand rounds. (I used the primer and powder hiatus of the winter to acquire and prep a lot of brass).

Putting the clean primer pocket issue aside (which I still view as a plus), just the durability of the dedicated decapping die has me sold on doing the process separately.

[TomReloaded]

I shoot a bunch, and sweep the brass off the floor and into my bag.

Goes straight from the bag to DRY tumbler for 30 minutes, and then it goes straight into the press. Ammo comes out completed and ready to store.

My entire reloading process is done before some people get their brass out of the wet tumbler to spend more hours doing weird stuff to. This is for competition pistol ammo, and its more consistent and accurate than premium new defensive ammo from the big brands.

Wet tumbled, hand primed, retumbled ammo is not better ammo. Its just wasted time.

[RickD427]

I shoot a bunch, and sweep the brass off the floor and into my bag.

Goes straight from the bag to DRY tumbler for 30 minutes, and then it goes straight into the press. Ammo comes out completed and ready to store.

My entire reloading process is done before some people get their brass out of the wet tumbler to spend more hours doing weird stuff to. This is for competition pistol ammo, and its more consistent and accurate than premium new defensive ammo from the big brands.

Wet tumbled, hand primed, retumbled ammo is not better ammo. Its just wasted time.

Apples and Oranges.

Pistol ammunition isn't anywhere near as sensitive to minor differences in the loading process.

Nobody shoots 600 yards with pistols.

I still do mass-production reloading for my pistol stuff for just that reason.

But my mass-production rifle stuff shot 1/2 MOA.

My "Crazy" produced rifle stuff shoots 1/8 MOA.

That difference makes for time well-spent.

[jimmykan]

You're right, and that was the reason for all of the "smilies" at the end of the post.

The truth be told, learning to read the wind is proving to be the most difficult part of my benchrest learning curve.

My .292 was shot at the beginning of the match in May and there was no wind. OTOH, during last month's match I was shooting a light varmint bag gun and 14 of the 15 other competitors were shooting rail guns. I didn't do so good on that day.

I thought benchrest shooters just wait for the wind flags to droop then bang out their string before the wind picks up again?

[JackEllis]

I take out the primers with a decapping die, then wash 'em (no tumbling). There's absolutely no reason I couldn't decap and size in the same step other than to keep grit out of the sizing die.

I tried dry tumbling in hopes it would take off residue that ended up on my fingers. No such luck. At some point I'm going to turn my tumbler into cash instead of having it take up space.

[RickD427]

I thought benchrest shooters just wait for the wind flags to droop then bang out their string before the wind picks up again?

It's a lot more complex than that, but I haven't learned enough yet to comment on the differences.

One big problem is that when the wind comes up, it rarely goes completely away. If you wait for the flags to droop, you're gonna be waiting until the next morning.

Another issue, and it's a particularly acute one at the range where I shoot my matches is that range is enclosed by trees on three sides and that creates a lot of wind "eddies". It's not uncommon to see the wind flags pointing in opposite directions at 50 and 100 yards, and at widely varying speeds.

[LynnJr]

Some reloaders deprime by hand so nothing touches the neck like a expander ball.

[ar15barrels]

Nobody shoots 600 yards with pistols.

https://www.bellmtcs.com/blog/don-bower-long-range-handgun-course/

[Dirtlaw]

https://www.bellmtcs.com/blog/don-bo...andgun-course/

But is that REALLY a pistol? Apologize for caps. For some reason I can no longer format text on this board.

[nedro]

Why do some reloaders remove the spent primers in a separate step vs during the sizing process?

Neck sizing only or also FL sizing?

Because 'Merica.
And Liberals haven't made it illegal yet.

[RickD427]

https://www.bellmtcs.com/blog/don-bo...andgun-course/

But is that REALLY a pistol? Apologize for caps. For some reason I can no longer format text on this board.

Randall,

1) Touche

2) That ain't really no "Pistol" (Technical definitions not withstanding). It's really a short barreled benchrest rifle with a pistol grip.

[ngnrnlo]

You can leave dirt in the primer pocket if you want, under a shiny new primer.

And you can sweep your living room dirt under the rug; your room will still look clean.