Case type

[jmdc]

Hey I am new to reloading and I have been been reading a ton and putting my press XL750 together. My brother used to do our reloading for us but has passed on this year. So I am taking over and learning along with my two sons and my his son.

Question: He used to use different brass, but I am wondering if that was the incorrect thing to do, It all worked through our firearms but as I am trying to learn myself I see some data sheets using specific brass such as winchester and even x-treme has data with their own brass. So should I just keep the random brass I currently have or do others try and use all the same brass brand?

[tabascoz28]

It's all about consistency, random brass is ok as long as you don't load max. Just don't expect to win any accuracy competitions with it. The only brass I won't use with my 9mm are stepped shelf ones which could jam the machine or over pressure because there is a massive volume decrease.

My 762nato brass is all mixed too but are nato stamped. My 556 is made in batches but I have LC, Frontier, FC, and PMC brass, they all are similar.

[jmdc]

It's all about consistency, random brass is ok as long as you don't load max. Just don't expect to win any accuracy competitions with it. The only brass I won't use with my 9mm are stepped shelf ones which could jam the machine or over pressure because there is a massive volume decrease.

My 762nato brass is all mixed too but are nato stamped. My 556 is made in batches but I have LC, Frontier, FC, and PMC brass, they all are similar.

For now I will load for range shooting in door and out door, so sounds good to me. What do you recommend for accuracy?

[CSACANNONEER]

I have a friend who asked for donations of the worst 50bmg brass anyone could find. I sent him a few pieces. Anyway, he prepped them all and shot them in a FCSA match. His results from this one test were that it didn't affect his scores or group sizes at all. While I haven't seen him in several years, he still holds 8 out of the 16 "world records" the FCSA keeps track of. Oh yea, his wife holds two more.

That said, to start and learn reloading, just use decent brass and don't worry about it all matching. Once you get into benchrest shooting, you'll end up dividing your brass into lots that were purchased together (not just having the same headstamp).

[jmdc]

I have a friend who asked for donations of the worst 50bmg brass anyone could find. I sent him a few pieces. Anyway, he prepped them all and shot them in a FCSA match. His results from this one test were that it didn't affect his scores or group sizes at all. While I haven't seen him in several years, he still holds 8 out of the 16 "world records" the FCSA keeps track of. Oh yea, his wife holds two more.

That said, to start and learn reloading, just use decent brass and don't worry about it all matching. Once you get into benchrest shooting, you'll end up dividing your brass into lots that were purchased together (not just having the same headstamp).

Thanks!

[tabascoz28]

I'd guess that the larger the caliber the smaller differences start to not matter. For example, the internal volume of a 223 between winchester and Nato are very different as a percentage of their total volume. Whereas the .50 might be all made to 1 spec. Then he may have even fire formed them in his chamber and then loaded consistently. I know that for my .338LM I don't even care if it is off by .1 grains but for my 6.5CM it is an issue.

I don't shoot pistol for accuracy but I'd imagine that it's about finding the right bullet, depth, powder. I'd start using all the same brass at that point. Also, loading for the highest speed doesn't equate to accuracy, it's good for penetration on self defense targets (if you hit it). On pistols, it's more about the shooter, how much of the right practice they've had.

For rifles people spend thousands on annealing machines, trimmers, neck turners, trickle powder drops, custom dies, barrels and scopes to put holes in the same hole. The low hanging fruit (only my opinion are: same brass, consistent powder, consistent bullet seating, finding the node first, quality gun and scope to start.

[Supersapper]

Hey I am new to reloading and I have been been reading a ton and putting my press XL750 together. My brother used to do our reloading for us but has passed on this year. So I am taking over and learning along with my two sons and my his son.

Question: He used to use different brass, but I am wondering if that was the incorrect thing to do, It all worked through our firearms but as I am trying to learn myself I see some data sheets using specific brass such as winchester and even x-treme has data with their own brass. So should I just keep the random brass I currently have or do others try and use all the same brass brand?

I've been reloading random brass cases since I started and they are fine. Another poster talked about stepped cases, and I agree with that. The stepped cases have pressure differentials that can cause case separation, but otherwise, at 20 yards, I've gotten 2 inch shot groups with random brass, Berry's bullets (115 and 124 gr), 4.0 grains of Titegroup seated to 1.14X COL.

When I first started, I thought I could make really cool match grade 9mm. I actually reloaded 50 Winchester cases that I cut to the exact same length, weighed the bullets and got 50 bullets to within .1 gr of each other, seated them to the same depth with hand measured powder.

All I got was ammunition whose velocity from highest to lowest was within 10 fps on the chrono. Not really worth the effort. While it was more accurate than any factory ammo, it wasn't like I was shooting it through the same hole at 25 yards.

The big thing on brass is to just make sure the cases aren't damaged, dented, creased or have been shot 30 times already. Don't use stepped cases (if you look inside, there's a difinitive ridge inside the case where it's thicker at the case head and thinner at the lip).

Other than that...go to it. Enjoy the freedom it gives you and the savings. Enjoy the pew-pew therapy for this strange, aggravating world.

[noylj]

When learning to reload, read several how-to books and manuals. Follow general rules. If one book has one specific rule not in the others, ignore it if it will make money for the company.
Those who shoot Bullseye at the upper echelon generally don't sweat Reloading and use mixed cases all the time. Main interests are practice, good gun, and more practice.
Next, how accurate is the gun? Unless it is sub 0.5 MOA, just load carefully (no OCD precision is required).
A 12-20 MOA handgun really just needs reasonably consistent loads.
If you shoot handguns inside 12yds, all you need are safe loads.
I have a Ruger M77 in 30-06 that has, since the late 70s, shot 0.75-1.25" at 100 yds no matter what accuracy tricks I have tried. That is all I need for fun or hunting, though I still hunted often with a 2-3 MOA Win lever in 30-30

[jmdc]

All great information! Thanks a ton!

[CSACANNONEER]

I'd guess that the larger the caliber the smaller differences start to not matter.

Not true, specially when you're trying to shoot small groups. I've seen another friend and past world record holder do a real world test with two different primers. The point of impact was about a 12" difference at 1000 yards. Also, 50bmg brass varies A LOT. There aren't even Saami specs for 50BMG.

[Supersapper]

Not true, specially when you're trying to shoot small groups. I've seen another friend and past world record holder do a real world test with two different primers. The point of impact was about a 12" difference at 1000 yards. Also, 50bmg brass varies A LOT. There aren't even Saami specs for 50BMG.

CSA,

I'm by far not what your friend is by any stretch of anyone's wildest imagination, but only 12" at 3000 feet? At that difference, you couldn't, from a physics perspective, prove that a small gust of wind, invisible imperfection in the bullet, trigger pressure differential causing that microscopic shift in muzzle placement, etc, right? Even match grade bullets are not PERFECTLY the same weight, so even that could cause it.

I don't think he was being really literal with what he was saying. I mean...at 200 yards, that kind of precision is effectively the same hole.

[CSACANNONEER]

CSA,

I'm by far not what your friend is by any stretch of anyone's wildest imagination, but only 12" at 3000 feet? At that difference, you couldn't, from a physics perspective, prove that a small gust of wind, invisible imperfection in the bullet, trigger pressure differential causing that microscopic shift in muzzle placement, etc, right? Even match grade bullets are not PERFECTLY the same weight, so even that could cause it.

I don't think he was being really literal with what he was saying. I mean...at 200 yards, that kind of precision is effectively the same hole.

Over 1 moa is over 1 moa at any distance. That's a huge amount for ammunition to vary for benchrest shooters.

[LynnJr]

As a general reloading rule of thumb it is best to shoot like brands of brass in like groups.
Then by following the same general reloading guideline you would start low and work your load up.
The reason is you will find the internal case volume of brand "A" brass to have a different internal volume than brand "B".
Accuracy minded shooters will weigh each piece of brass and shoot it in like groups.
I remember Lee asking about 50 BMG brass years and years ago but never heard his test results or how it was selected for that test.

[Supersapper]

Over 1 moa is over 1 moa at any distance. That's a huge amount for ammunition to vary for benchrest shooters.

Perhaps so, but at those distances, there can NOT be any gaurantee that it was the primers. I was only saying that ANY single deviation from EXACT could cause it to vary given those great distances.

1 inch at 100 yards is not that hard to get it together. Even my old wrinkly butt can do that.

I'm no sniper, but the physics is not that hard. The bullet is in flight for a lot longer, permitting whatever error (wind, spin drift, extra granules of powder not registered on the scale or what have you) to magnify itself 10 times as much (100 vs 1000 yards). There's a point where you simply can't control what happens, no matter how much time/energy/ detail you put into it.

But...my focus has always been different. At 100 yards, I do not care if it hits the animal's left or right eye. It's still dead.

[CSACANNONEER]

As a general reloading rule of thumb it is best to shoot like brands of brass in like groups.
Then by following the same general reloading guideline you would start low and work your load up.
The reason is you will find the internal case volume of brand "A" brass to have a different internal volume than brand "B".
Accuracy minded shooters will weigh each piece of brass and shoot it in like groups.
I remember Lee asking about 50 BMG brass years and years ago but never heard his test results or how it was selected for that test.

Measuring case capacity with water is more accurate than just weighing brass.

Lee wrote a detailed article about his experiment with different brass. It appeared in a VHP some years ago. Check your old VHPs.