Progressive Reloading Setup Advice

[RANGER295]

I'm very happy with my xl650. I tried the LNL, 550b, xl650 and even a 1050 before buying mine. The LNL was too finicky, required constant adjustments and while the LNL die holders were cheaper than a dillon toolhead I liked that the Dillon kept everything together. The 1050 was of course the best. I knew I would buy one eventually, which I did and if budget were no concern I'd buy one in every caliber. I was surprised how easy caliber changes were on it though but the tolhead costs kills it for caliber changes.

That said the xl650 is not perfect. There are many little add ons to make it better, I had a thread going for one for a while. It seems dumb to spend so much on a press then have to spend more money to make it better but there really are no perfect presses out there.

I also have the mrbulletfeeder and others have commented about how much caliber changes are going to cost you. For the rounds you listed you'll only need four conversions for the bulletfeeder. Moving the die does suck and I wish they would offer just the lower section of the die instead of the whole unit with the switch and weight. But I makes life easier, especially if you have hand problems like I do. Setting bullets can be painful after a while.

Also while I obviously don't agree with Stillys discontent for Dillon, I did really like the Lee Pro 1000 when I tried one a year or so ago and if you are on. Budget that's a great press for the money. I load 14 calibera on my xl650 though so having 14 Lee pros would not be an option.

How long does it take to do a caliber change on your XL650? I am planning on getting the Mr. Bulletfeeder. I am basically going all out and totally setting myself up in one shot because I was given the green light. That said, I am thinking I may not get a .308 or .30-06 setup. Especially the .30-06 I probably will never shoot enough to make it worth a progressive setup. I can make higher quality rounds with my single stage presses for the high power rifles.

I actually looked at the Lee Pro 1000 and while it is a good bang for the buck, I want to go top quality. Room however is not a factor. I have a 50' work bench built into the back of my shop (no exaggeration) and about 10' that I am willing to devote to reloading. I thought about putting 6 Lee presses side by side. If money was no issue, I would just set up a bunch of Dillon presses.

I recently had the same conundrum. researched relentlessly. pros and cons to both as stilly said. I found two constants. people always converted from red to blue and never vice versa and there were many complaints about a need for tinkering on the LNL. for that reason I went blue. I figured for something as expensive as reloading it's best not to cheap out especially when the difference was only about $120 initially.

This is what I am leaning towards.

Red or Blue, it's no different than Ford Or Chevy, Glock or Hi Point, etc. Each one has it's own small advantages over the other but, in the end, they are pretty equal and it ends up boiling down to personal preference.

You had me until you mentioned Hi Point which it is an insult to compare even a Glock to. Kimber Vs. Colt maybe

Ranger...

I can only speak for myself and my 35 plus years with Dillion. I can't speak for red or green systems....

I have three machines in Blue. When I was younger I was totally into .45ACP
and I was shooting 500 to 1000 rounds per week. I had some single stage that I bought in the early 1970s but I just stopped using them because they were not an efficient use of my time.

So I leapfrogged into a Dillon 1050. What a machine. They come all set up with the caliber of your choice, mine is .45ACP. I also ordered a conversion kit in .308. I admit I never used that conversion for two reasons. I had several thousand rounds of .308 in storage and it seemed complicated to spend much time switching over. But I ran that 1050 every week and it's so fast that you spend more time loading the extra primer tubes (have 15 at least) and having components at the ready. Clean shells, boolets and if you prepare you can churn out 1000-1200 rounds per hour.

As the Gun Games faded and I was shooting other calibers I bought a Dillion 550B. It's fast but you have to index the shell plate manually. I didn't mind that you could see and correct any mistakes and stop anytime without hesitation.
Much less pressure.

Production dropped to 500-600 per hour. Again, you want to pre load primer Tubes and have components at the ready. But I love this machine. ❤️

No stress my friend. I can switch calibers in a couple of minutes.

Then I bought another for feeding my lever guns. .44 mag and .357 mag.
(Really save some bucks on ammo)

If I were going to set up a great reloading room I would not hesitate to buy the new Dillon 550C . Maybe two.

Here you go sir

https://www.dillonprecision.com/rl-550c_8_1_23594.html

Ranger....don't know how much you shoot but if money isn't an issue the
thinking is (since the primer systems on the 1050 take time to swap out)
Is to buy two Dillon 1050s, one with the large primer system (.45ACP, .308, and a butt load of calibers) and the Small primer system 1050 to cover 9MM, .380 and you name it.) Easy peasy to swap calibers when you own both machines however it will be expensive.

Be well
Bob

Yeah buying two blue machines is a bit much. I also do not think it is worth (at least for me) the extra money to step up to the 1050

I agree with folks pushing the underdog and saying you should go for it. I also agree with the notion that you need to establish dominance over everyone else on the block. So you bring in the Imperial Starfleet instead of the Rebel Alliance. After all, NOBODY really likes the Imperial Starfleet, but they obliterate the competition.

So if you think you are ready to handle a Dillon- GO FOR IT. Spend that money CHACHING CHACHING! But you best not be crying after you are done. Big boys do not cry, even after they spend a ridiculous amount of money for something that is BLUE...

On the other hand, logically speaking. I see a tidal wave of cash flowing out of your wallet if you DO go with a Blue Machine. Just look at all of those calibers. Changing calibers is SOOOOOOOOO easy on them Dillons, it is why EVERYONE that has one, only buys it for ONE caliber. So that is about $1600 x each caliber for you.

On the other hand, the main advantage with the LNL AP is that you will be able to 1. save space with the bushings for the dies and 2. save space by not having to spend all of this money for additional toolheads.

I think when I decide to leave my Loadmaster finally and move to another Progressive, it WAS going to be a PC5 or PC7 but MAYBE the new Lee Progressive they are coming out with in a few months (hopefully) will be a game changer for them and drive that burning stake through the heart of Dillon and Hornady alike........ .......BWAHAHAHAHAHA. Okay.

Seriously though, weigh your options and see what works for you. Do you really have room for 8 presses?

And btw, if you said you were gonna do ONE caliber only, I would say go for that Dillon. ONE caliber- that is what they work best at. ONE caliber, set them up and forget about them, just pull to win! but CHANGE calibers? Are you ****ing insane?

And yes, I AM exaggerating a LITTLE on the calibers thing. But am I really? I mean, I know I just JOKED about it, but now I am thinking back to a lot of peeps that I know that DO own a Dillon, they typically own several and have them set for each caliber. Then they buy cute little PVC stands that hold the toolheads and display everything, but they will NOT ever change calibers. It seems as though they would rather go out and buy another new press and NOT want to deal with the hassle of setting it up.

Am I right or am I right about this? Look, I only own ONE Lee Classic Turret and I own about 7+ turret heads for it. Changing my LCT is about a 2 minute process, IF THAT. I understand that changing out progressives does take a little more time, but it should NOT be THAT costly. I can swap out heads on the Loadmaster and go from 9mm to .44 mag in about 8 minutes or less because of the custom things I have. But still... Just do not expect me to be boasting about having 8 LCT setup for various calibers unless I am hosting a reloading clinic.

**** man, if you have THAT many calibers you wanna load on a go-fast machine, consider a Lee Pro-1000 for each caliber. They are the Red Dillons in that folks buy them for ONE caliber, and then leave them alone, and since calibers only cost about $200 or less, ($169 each! ) DAMN that is hard to beat. https://fsreloading.com/index.php?_r...00-2085695781/

But no seriously. Go buy that Dillon. **** logic. You deserve a break and all your life you have dreamt of it. Now you can afford it (right? No pending divorce suits hopefully) Go get it!

Ok I have reread your post at least half a dozen times. It has so much satire mixed with seriousness that I just had to. I think I understand it. And yes I can afford it now. My wife told me to buy something nice for myself because I put in a new roof on our house, resheathed it, and did a bunch of dryrot repair. I saved us about $20k in labor but have pretty much blown my whole summer on the project. I was thinking about a jeep or a motor cycle or something like that but someone in OT suggested a reloading setup. I gave myself a $5k-ish budget. With this option, I could spend about $2k on the reloading setup, $1k on components, and $2k on a gun or two (I was thinking about getting a 1919. All said, I really want to find someone that has a Lee Pro 1000 to see if they are as bad as people make them sound online because I do have the room for half a dozen presses or more.

[stilly]

All said, I really want to find someone that has a Lee Pro 1000 to see if they are as bad as people make them sound online because I do have the room for half a dozen presses or more.

LoLz. Yeah, for some folks they work EXCELLENT. But I only really ever hear about issues folks have with them. However, if you have your ladder load dialed in and you just need to make ammo, no adjustments necessary, they DO give you a good shot at it. On that same hand, you could also obtain a blue press of whatever model and greatly improve your chances of having a nice flat out single caliber race.

Also, it IS very tempting to pick up a Pro-1000 and I just MIGHT do it instead of using the Loadmaster for this next batch of 12k, but as much fun as it might be to try out, I already have a Loadmaster and I do not have that extra cash to throw around.

But **** man, you got the space, you saved the cash, ****ing go for broke, I mean blue...

Actually, instead of a Pro-1000, I might pick up that new progressive that Lee is making. That should hopefully be out in a few months. Maybe Christmas...

[Pardini]

The Pro 1000 is the most infuriating press I've ever used. The primers hang up and don't feed then powder drops and plugs up the works even worse. Parts continually wear out and break. Don't buy a Pro 1000, a Loadmaster perhaps a Pro 1000 forget it. I've one friend that still loads on a couple, he babies them and loads at a slightly higher rate than a single stage. They still gum up, jam and break. He is constantly buying new parts for them. Lee warranties nothing.

I taught a friend how to reload recently. Told him to get a Dillion 650 like mine. A couple others talked him in to a Hornady LNL. I think it's a good press. The one draw back is the thing always needs to be tweaked and adjusted. I like the powder measure a lot more than the Dillion and run one on my 650. Also like Hornady bullet seating dies.

I couldn't tell you how many toolheads and conversions i have unless I went out and counted. At least a couple dozen. Takes 15 to 20 minutes to change calibers. Probably 30 minutes if changing primer sizes. Takes a little longer with the Hornady powder measure.

I've had the 650 since the early 90's. Worn out a few parts. Nothing's really broken. Dillion has always had replacement parts to me in less than a week at no charge. Sent the entire press back once to have it cleaned and updated for no charge. Sent it in without a priming assembly and I t came back with one.

My friends with the Lee and Hornady have replaced many times more parts than I have, in far less time, paid for all of them and have to wait 2 to 3 weeks to get them.

[maxx03]

You ever notice when people are selling a used Dillon it's because they are either upgrading to another Dillon or getting out of reloading? I'm sure somewhere someone with a brain injury sold their Dillon to get a Hornady. The last Dillon I got was from a friend that just wasn't using it and I wanted a 550 for large pistol primer (45ACP) and he approached me and said "I got a 550 laying around, you want it?" I purchased it for $300 complete with the promise if I ever sell it, he gets first crack at buying it for what I paid for it.

^^^^
This.

[CSACANNONEER]

You had me until you mentioned Hi Point which it is an insult to compare even a Glock to. Kimber Vs. Colt maybe

Yea, I know, Hi Points aren't as ugly as Glocks. I apologize for that.

[RestrictedColt]

After much research I went with the LNL. When comparing to Dillon you'll have to specify which one. I'm not sure which Dillon it was that I was mostly using as a comparison but it looked awkward to use necessitating doing some operations with the right hand forcing it off the handle, and there were a few other things I didn't like.

As for the "nobody sells a Dillon to get a different one" I read of a few that did just that to get a LNL including one that started at LNL, "upgraded" to Dillon, then went back because he liked the LNL more. I do all the calibers you listed other than X39, plus a few other calibers up to .338WM. The only other reloader I've chatted with quite a bit uses a LNL and loves it.

Someone equated them to cars and I'd say it's a fair comparison. You'd have to try both presses to really know which you like more, buying the more expensive one isn't an automatic win. I believe Cabella's has presses on display that you can fondle and at least get some feel for them. They probably won't be greased up so it won't be exactly the same.

[C.G.]

The Red and Blue are both fine presses, each has its pluses and minuses. I was going to buy a Dillon but missed out on Sniper's Hide Group buy. Then I had a chance to try out Hornady LNL AP and liked the ergonomics better than the Dillon 650. I would also suggest trying out both presses before you buy.

[RANGER295]

Yea, I know, Hi Points aren't as ugly as Glocks. I apologize for that.

Yeah but Glocks work better than Hi Point supposedly. That said, you will never see either of them in my arsenal.

The Red and Blue are both fine presses, each has its pluses and minuses. I was going to buy a Dillon but missed out on Sniper's Hide Group buy. Then I had a chance to try out Hornady LNL AP and liked the ergonomics better than the Dillon 650. I would also suggest trying out both presses before you buy.

I would love to try them if I knew where I could. Does anyone in the Stockton/Manteca/Escalon area (I live in the sticks kind of in that area) have either of these presses?

[bigdrunk92037]

Used to own a LNL and now a 650. 650>LNL all day long. You have a pretty solid budget so there is zero reason to compromise, get the 650.

Also, caliber changes on the 650 are quick and easy. I have heard people complain about changing out the primer sizes on a 650 being difficult and time consuming as well. My experience has been it is EASY and takes only a few minutes.

[divingin]

I did NOT like the Hornady powder measure that came with it. The Lee powder measure that I use on it now is more consistent.

Do you have the Lee set up to auto-drop charges, or are you activating it manually?

[wbunning]

Do you have the Lee set up to auto-drop charges, or are you activating it manually?

Yes.. I have Lee powder-through dies for the Lee measure. Mine is the slightly older auto-disc rather than auto-drum. I replaced the discs with Lee's micrometer kit though.

[gobabygo]

I've only loaded on Dillons. And I'm one of those that started on a 550, upgraded to a 650 and now to a 1050. If you really don't like the Dillon, you can sell it easily for only a small discount. I don't believe you can say the same for the other brands.

I do know people that have multiple Dillions, but I have only ever had 1 press at a time (due to space) and I reload for 9mm, 38 super, 40 and .45 and I reload in quantity. Caliber changes only take a few minutes from 9mm to 38 Super to 40. Same shellplate and they're all small primer so all i have to do is change the toolhead. 45 is a little longer because it requires changing to a large primer system and changing the shellplate.

I reload in quantity for pistol games so my volume is high so I want to reload faster which ultimately led me to the 1050. No way I would start with that though. The 550 is a great press. If I had the room I'd probably buy one for .45 so I don't have to convert my 1050.

Over the long run, ammo costs far exceeds the cost difference between presses. I'm guessing my kids and I shoot around 12,000 rounds per year. Cost per round is roughly $0.16 each (.10 bullet, .02 brass (I don't pick up), .02 primer, .02 powder) = almost $2,000 per year in components and I've been reloading for 15 years so I've spent at least $30,000 in components alone. The cost difference between reloaders is nothing compared to what it costs to feed it long term.

[MrElectric03]

How long does it take to do a caliber change on your XL650? I am planning on getting the Mr. Bulletfeeder. I am basically going all out and totally setting myself up in one shot because I was given the green light. That said, I am thinking I may not get a .308 or .30-06 setup. Especially the .30-06 I probably will never shoot enough to make it worth a progressive setup. I can make higher quality rounds with my single stage presses for the high power rifles.

I actually looked at the Lee Pro 1000 and while it is a good bang for the buck, I want to go top quality. Room however is not a factor. I have a 50' work bench built into the back of my shop (no exaggeration) and about 10' that I am willing to devote to reloading. I thought about putting 6 Lee presses side by side. If money was no issue, I would just set up a bunch of Dillon presses

I do caliber changes in probably 10-15 minutes. If I'm just changing the conversion kits and tool head that under 10 minutes easy once you get the hang of it. You can make it quick if you keep a powder Measure setup for each caliber. I don't. I own four Powder measures, one on my 1050 9mm head, one on my 1050 .223 head, one large bar for the 650(only used for .44 mag for now) and the other for everything else on the 650. Setting the power takes a bit. I DO NOT have a seperate primer quick change, really don't see the point to spend about $100 on it, it swaps out quick.

I don't load .30-06 on my 650 and rarely .308, they get loaded on the single stage, the 650 rocks for case prep using the Dillon trimmer though and that's what I use.Also the great thing about .308 and .30-06 is it's the same caliber conversion...almost. I think you'll need a diffeeent casefeed adapter and powder funnel. So buy the .308 conversion and spend another $30 and you are ready. Also if you load .45 acp it's the same shellplate, brass pins ect. No need to buy complete kits for every caliber.

Check this out, just check "need" for the calibers you want to load and it will show you how many shellplate sect you'll need.

http://thegunwiki.com/apps/calconversion/index.asp?machine_1=on&go=Choose+Machines

[C.G.]

I would love to try them if I knew where I could. Does anyone in the Stockton/Manteca/Escalon area (I live in the sticks kind of in that area) have either of these presses?

Gun stores or gunsmiths sometimes have them set up, not sure about your area.

[9mmepiphany]

I would love to try them if I knew where I could. Does anyone in the Stockton/Manteca/Escalon area (I live in the sticks kind of in that area) have either of these presses?

Maybe a bit longer drive, but if you're inclined to drive up to Elk Grove, I'll show you the ins-n-outs of my LNL