Can Someone help me build a computer?

[bigbearbear]

^THAT

Storage is a huge bottleneck. rapter drives are expensive and run hot, and I have heard mixed reviews on their MTBF. I would rather have a SCSI 15k drive than a rapter, SSD +2tb whatever dive is a cost effective alternative and faster, much faster than a rapter.

Not anymore, have you checked out their new "HTZ" series? I got 2 of them, they're running cooler than my regular 7200rpm Seagate drives.

Here's a review of them:

http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/velociraptor-1tb-hdd-ssd,3250.html

[blazeaglory]

The motherboard has an option for installed SSD cache...I know its not the same as a stand alone SSD but its still pretty cool.

ASUS SSD Caching

3X Faster Performance at a Click
SSD Caching from ASUS is easier than ever. At 3X faster, this feature boosts system performance by using an installed SSD with no capacity limitations as a cache for frequently accessed data. Harness a combination of SSD-like performance and response and hard drive capacity with just one click, no rebooting needed and instant activation for complete ease of use, and even prevent data loss with included backup functionality.

[five.five-six]

Not anymore, have you checked out their new "HTZ" series? I got 2 of them, they're running cooler than my regular 7200rpm Seagate drives.

Here's a review of them:
http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/...-ssd,3250.html

WOW! but no mention of MTBF, but lowering the temp has to help that a lot

[Merc1138]

WOW! but no mention of MTBF, but lowering the temp has to help that a lot

Yes, the velociraptors have been way better than the raptors were. They're cooler, quieter, use less power, higher capacity(even though they're actually 2.5" disks).

But still, unless you need the IOPS for bulk storage, I'd still go with an SSD and other larger drive/s.

[stilly]

ok im a bit confused on this stuff. I know I have to pair a CPU to a MOBO and thats not what im quite sure of and how to select that stuff. Someone told me to try a AMD Bulldozer Fx8150 with a Sabertooth 990fx because something about running 16pic together instead of 8 seperately as well as supporting USB 3.0 So im considering going that route since I dont know better. I found a Corsair 850 & 700 power supplies for around $100 or so.

I guess now im trying to figure out how to pair my Mobo to CPU and how do i determine the RAM from there? i see there are different numbers like diff megahertz , PCI and Pins

This is what I am currently looking to due with a diff dif hard drive selection and my own copy of windows 7

http://www.maximumpc.com/article/features/step--step_guide_how_build_gaming_pc_amds_bulldozer_cpu

^what do u guys think of this

If you could not tell by other posts of mine I am an AMD guy. I HATE intel. It started with them withholding chipsets back in the mid 1990's to any oem that was going to ALSO produce AMD based motherboards. Back then The difference was about $100-$200 for the CPU amd vs intel vs cyrix. I did not know it but I had AMD already and I was going for a cyrix 233 mhz... Anyways, Later on around the time when the Athlon came out (slot 1 or slot A I forgot and I don't care to look it up because now that I think of it it is kinda unimportant) That was when Wintel pulled their cheap tactics and I swore NEVER to buy them and use them as a rule of thumb because of their dirty ways to make me have to spend more money to get their crap. I am glad that mobo manufacturers did not cave in to that load of ****. Anyways, that kinda locked in AMD for me.

NOW, I have JUST started putting together a game/multimedia system for someone. They really wanted the Bulldozer 8150 but I talked them out of it because the Phenom 2 x6 1100 pretty much beats it out in several areas but GOOD luck in finding a phenom now but if you can they are on Ebay for around $170-200 each. THOSE work BEST with the 890FX chipset AND the 990FX chipset. The bulldozer is not as good from several pages that I read but the NEXT version of bulldozer is supposed to work even better and in 2013 they are gonna release a much better version that the technogeeks are waiting for so they can overclock the hell out of it and jizz on themselves afterwards... Yeah whatever, I know, the usual way is that usually the next cpu IS better but in THIs case, the Phenom 2 x6 1100 or 1090 is still a GREAT contender. PLUS, you gotta love the name PHENOM. Bulldozer implies boxy and slow
As you read through posts you tend to pick up hints on chipsets. You can see a reference or to to FX chipsets over GX chipsets that go unchallenged...

http://forums.overclockers.com.au/showthread.php?t=961429

This is a good place:

http://www.legitreviews.com/article/1626/15/

Here is a local to Tustin place for 990FX mobos...

http://www.microcenter.com/search/search_results.phtml?Ntt=990fx

That Sabertooth 990FX mobo is a GREAT board but I am going with a Biostar TA990FXE which is pretty close to the same thing, but way cheaper. When it comes down to it, most of the time you need to look at the CPU and the chipset performance. http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16813138341

I saw a shootout that showed the 890FX chipset being superior for the Phenom class CPUs and the 890 is hard to get, the 990 is the successor and it is just a tad faster PLUS it has the latest features like sata 6gb and usb 3 which was what I was looking for. When you read a lot of pages you do not need to understand everything, but just notice certain things and trends and once you get a feel for a chipset then look for mobos that have those features. Once you find a decently reviewed mobo then look for it and don't stray from it unless there is a GOOD reason. Finally you choose your ram, no need to get all fancy 4 GB of some fast **** should do it. in this case, 1866 ram should be good. I would bother to mention asynchronous operation here but forget it, this aint the time or place...

Okay, it is like this, BACK in the day there was a mystical beast called Asynchonous Operation in which that RAM ran at the same speed as the CPU. Then evil bottlenecks would be forced to look elsewhere to slow down computers. To make a long story short, if your ram is running at 1000mhz and your cpu is at 2000 mhz then you are not in async, but if you get your ram up to 2000 then you are good again. Now they measure things differently so by all means if ANYONE WISHES TO CORRECT ME PLEASE FEEL FREE TO DO SO. Because as I see it, you look for a fsb (frontside bus speed) that your cpu is running at, like, the PHENOM is not REALLY 3.3ghz, it is really more like 1333 mhz with a multiplier of 2.5 or something. I DO NOT KNOW FOR CERTAIN, I AM JUST SAYING FOR ARGUMENT'S SAKE, that the FSB is 1333 so in reality 1333 speed RAM would most likely be IDEAL to run since it is right there with the CPU. Now a days, I say who cares about Async anymore, just get the fastest (1833mhz) and if it throttles down it will throttle down.

Anyways, I am sure several cans of worms have been opened up now. If you do not understand, then just keep looking. There are all kinds of folks here that know what works and there are folks that are just crazy and will tell you to buy the latest that is out. I am one of those crazy folks that will try to keep you from spending money unless you must. I am somewhat openminded and I accept that MY opinions are wrong to others here. Like, I think there is no need to get more than 4GB of RAM in a normal system. MANY folks think it is cheap enough to get as much as you can and even though it is never all used so what. I am fighting that fight in another thread... Anyways, we can;t all be experts overnight. Heh, I am not even an expert but I know enough to know what works and I will tweak it when it don't.


Still awake? I see the page you are talking about. Keep in mind this, those *******s get paid to play around with things and they always follow the same general template, latest and greatest stuff and who cares if it sucks or not, they will use it. I wonder what they would be saying about the phenom II 1100T instead of the bulldozer 8150... AND if you are gonna go the way of the 8150, look at the 8120 since it can be clocked up to the 8150 (supposedly) and you will save yourself some money. If you wanna follow that page then go follow it, I never look at the latest **** that hits the shelves because that is how you go broke fast following bad advice. I prefer the tried and true older stuff that has dropped to 1/2 the price and now it gives GREAT bang for the buck performance. Kinda like building up a hotrod vs going to the dealer and buying one. :\

As for my comments with an OEM windows, well, the OEM version of windows XP when it is installed it makes notes of your mobo and later on I was called in to do a job and upgrade their mobo to a faster mobo and cpu. I did that but upon reboot the windows OEM had issues and it did NOT let me complete the upgrade. I had to do a repair install of it and that even fuxed things up worse. Finally I figured out that it was the OEM that was mad at me for changing the mobo. Even afrter I sysprepped it and all. I ended up reformatting and reinstalling and it was FINE, but what a PITA... Same thing happened to TWO Windows 7 machines that were brought to me, I ended up having to replace the mobo and on both times windows 7 BSOD on boot and the startup/repair did NOTHING to fix the problem. I had to reinstall that **** again for both machines.

I will add that the LAST windows 7 mobo replacement I did actually went without a hitch, BUT he ALSO had windows 7 ultimate... NOT an OEM...

FINALLY, Another reason to HATE Intel CPUs. They SUCK *** when it comes to cooling. Have you seen the AMD systems? Lift a lever, swing out and pull up, BUT NOT for a goddamn intel POS. I had to replace the HSF on one about 5 months ago and I had to remove the MOBO from the box, and then remove the X from the mobo in order to put the damn fan on. HEY! Yeah, I COULD have only gotten another FAN but that would have been on me because this was the BOSSES computer and I did not want to make him wait another day so I MADe it happen. But intel cpu coolers SUCK compared to AMD. Look at those stupid clips they give you that you press down and twist to release. Sorry, AMD wins that contest hands down. The design has been the same for the past umpteen years (ever since slot 1/a).

anyways, have fun.

[Merc1138]

As for my comments with an OEM windows, well, the OEM version of windows XP when it is installed it makes notes of your mobo and later on I was called in to do a job and upgrade their mobo to a faster mobo and cpu. I did that but upon reboot the windows OEM had issues and it did NOT let me complete the upgrade. I had to do a repair install of it and that even fuxed things up worse. Finally I figured out that it was the OEM that was mad at me for changing the mobo. Even afrter I sysprepped it and all. I ended up reformatting and reinstalling and it was FINE, but what a PITA... Same thing happened to TWO Windows 7 machines that were brought to me, I ended up having to replace the mobo and on both times windows 7 BSOD on boot and the startup/repair did NOTHING to fix the problem. I had to reinstall that **** again for both machines.

I will add that the LAST windows 7 mobo replacement I did actually went without a hitch, BUT he ALSO had windows 7 ultimate... NOT an OEM...

Umm, it has nothing to do with being an OEM version of windows. It has to do with low level drivers that get installed first and swapping motherboards is pretty much guaranteed to break things if the chipset on the replacement board is different. A BSOD in windows or kernel panic in linux is pretty much expected if you do that.

FINALLY, Another reason to HATE Intel CPUs. They SUCK *** when it comes to cooling. Have you seen the AMD systems? Lift a lever, swing out and pull up, BUT NOT for a goddamn intel POS. I had to replace the HSF on one about 5 months ago and I had to remove the MOBO from the box, and then remove the X from the mobo in order to put the damn fan on. HEY! Yeah, I COULD have only gotten another FAN but that would have been on me because this was the BOSSES computer and I did not want to make him wait another day so I MADe it happen. But intel cpu coolers SUCK compared to AMD. Look at those stupid clips they give you that you press down and twist to release. Sorry, AMD wins that contest hands down. The design has been the same for the past umpteen years (ever since slot 1/a).

anyways, have fun.

First of all, it takes 15 seconds with a flathead screwdriver to turn the 4 tabs on an OEM Intel heatsink and it lifts straight off.

Second, any modern case that isn't a piece of garbage has a hole cut out of the motherboard tray so the back side of the board can be accessed to easily mount a heatsink backplate.

Third, just about any decent cooler for an AMD CPU is going to require you to remove the top mounting bracket anyway(meaning you'll still need access to the rear of the board to hang onto the stock backplate while you screw the new top bracket on).

And seriously dude, knock off the caps and swearing. It just makes your posts hard to read.

[blazeaglory]

Ouch...lol stilly

I agree that the phenom is a good chip buuuuut the rest is just personal opinion. You mentioned XP, please dont mention it again because the name XP makes me sick, worst OS ever. Windows 7 is much better and functions as smooth as 98 did (for me anyways). All OEM means is that it is for system builders.

When it boils down to it, intels outperform AMD with less but AMD are cheaper. To each is own. We all know Intel can be a cutthroat business but thats capitalism I guess.

And the i series intel CPU's are simple. You dont even need a screwdriver anymore to remove the heat-sink. Its designed as a "twist to tighten" system. It literally took me 20 seconds to install my CPU. All I had to do was take the plastic off, lift the lever, lower the lever, place heat-sink on top and twist each corner. Simple.

[Merc1138]

And the i series intel CPU's are simple. You dont even need a screwdriver anymore to remove the heat-sink. Its designed as a "twist to tighten" system. It literally took me 20 seconds to install my CPU. All I had to do was take the plastic off, lift the lever, lower the lever, place heat-sink on top and twist each corner. Simple.

You usually can, but they still have the slots on top for a screwdriver and I just use one instead of reaching in to fiddle with crap getting in the way of my big *** hands(depending on the case layout).

[stilly]

Umm, it has nothing to do with being an OEM version of windows. It has to do with low level drivers that get installed first and swapping motherboards is pretty much guaranteed to break things if the chipset on the replacement board is different. A BSOD in windows or kernel panic in linux is pretty much expected if you do that.


First of all, it takes 15 seconds with a flathead screwdriver to turn the 4 tabs on an OEM Intel heatsink and it lifts straight off.

Second, any modern case that isn't a piece of garbage has a hole cut out of the motherboard tray so the back side of the board can be accessed to easily mount a heatsink backplate.

Third, just about any decent cooler for an AMD CPU is going to require you to remove the top mounting bracket anyway(meaning you'll still need access to the rear of the board to hang onto the stock backplate while you screw the new top bracket on).

And seriously dude, knock off the caps and swearing. It just makes your posts hard to read.

What can I say, intel brings out the monster in me. I become the little red hulk and just start cussing and screaming and people don't like me when I am angry.


About the rest though, from the top.
Low level drivers, that is good to know, but I know the chipset was different on the windows 7 ultimate upgrade because the old mobo was no longer available and we moved from a DFI lanparty Infinity II to something else, I dunno but it was a different chipset and AM3+ board where the previous was an AM2 I think. Does not mean much really and it COULD have been a coincidence but then how would you go about fixing a computer after a motherboard swap with different chipsets involved? Is the only way to do that by reformatting? Why did the repair install not work? I thought that was the super top secret way to refersh your windows and everyone should do it once a month... (okay that last part I made up).


Yeah, the intel boxes they had were cheap. The only PLUS to those cases were the rolled edges. I have also only had to put a high performance fan on ONE AMD cpu and that is my phenom II x4 and even then it was a new install, but my case allows for that. But in the case of desktop pcs that people walk into a store and buy there are the kinds that have the plastic tabs (that I always seem to break because they are too dainty and china like) and there are the screw down ones with the metal X support (which I prefer) but if you only have one fan and you gotta make it work you gotta make it work and why would they even provide different HIGH PERFORMANCE hsf combos that use the cheap clips? Makes no sense, most AMD coolers have the simple levers. Only if you move to the larger more expensive ones might you then be required to actually put the reinforcement plate underneath it.

Admit at least that much. Nobody walks into microcenter and says, oh what kind of case does that have, can we replace the cooler with no problems? No, they tell ME to pick the good ones for their money and I chose the AMD based systems but I was overridden because the lousy intel boxes had faster ghz numbers... :\ If you know comps and folks that do not then I do not need to tell you that nobody is gonna go full techie and start explaining l2 and l3 cache and ghz vs cores vs fsb etc etc just to get the blank stares and then get overridden anyways... So that's my story and I'm sticking to it...

[Merc1138]

What can I say, intel brings out the monster in me. I become the little red hulk and just start cussing and screaming and people don't like me when I am angry.


About the rest though, from the top.
Low level drivers, that is good to know, but I know the chipset was different on the windows 7 ultimate upgrade because the old mobo was no longer available and we moved from a DFI lanparty Infinity II to something else, I dunno but it was a different chipset and AM3+ board where the previous was an AM2 I think. Does not mean much really and it COULD have been a coincidence but then how would you go about fixing a computer after a motherboard swap with different chipsets involved? Is the only way to do that by reformatting? Why did the repair install not work? I thought that was the super top secret way to refersh your windows and everyone should do it once a month... (okay that last part I made up).


Yeah, the intel boxes they had were cheap. The only PLUS to those cases were the rolled edges. I have also only had to put a high performance fan on ONE AMD cpu and that is my phenom II x4 and even then it was a new install, but my case allows for that. But in the case of desktop pcs that people walk into a store and buy there are the kinds that have the plastic tabs (that I always seem to break because they are too dainty and china like) and there are the screw down ones with the metal X support (which I prefer) but if you only have one fan and you gotta make it work you gotta make it work and why would they even provide different HIGH PERFORMANCE hsf combos that use the cheap clips? Makes no sense, most AMD coolers have the simple levers. Only if you move to the larger more expensive ones might you then be required to actually put the reinforcement plate underneath it.

Admit at least that much. Nobody walks into microcenter and says, oh what kind of case does that have, can we replace the cooler with no problems? No, they tell ME to pick the good ones for their money and I chose the AMD based systems but I was overridden because the lousy intel boxes had faster ghz numbers... :\ If you know comps and folks that do not then I do not need to tell you that nobody is gonna go full techie and start explaining l2 and l3 cache and ghz vs cores vs fsb etc etc just to get the blank stares and then get overridden anyways... So that's my story and I'm sticking to it...

I always format when swapping a board unless it was a direct replacement for a failed board. Of course that's not particularly different to do if you don't keep anything of any importance on the same partition as the OS.

I've done a repair install once, and if I remember correctly it was to switch the SATA controller mode to AHCI because the BIOS defaulted to IDE(which sucks) and of course windows hates that. Otherwise? I format. I get from booting off of a windows dvd to installed with drivers and running updates in about half an hour.

If AMD is your preference, fine. I don't care what you like to spend your money on. I was using AMD for quite a few years myself, but I don't like anything they've done for the past 5 or so years and as such I don't buy AMD CPUs. As far as me telling people what to get, I don't try to convince anyone of anything. I'm not in computer sales anymore, and I quit doing random acts of tech support for friends and family long ago(it was always more of a headache than it was worth, discussing things on a forum is different).

[stilly]

Ouch...lol stilly

I agree that the phenom is a good chip buuuuut the rest is just personal opinion. You mentioned XP, please dont mention it again because the name XP makes me sick, worst OS ever. Windows 7 is much better and functions as smooth as 98 did (for me anyways). All OEM means is that it is for system builders.

When it boils down to it, intels outperform AMD with less but AMD are cheaper. To each is own. We all know Intel can be a cutthroat business but thats capitalism I guess.

And the i series intel CPU's are simple. You dont even need a screwdriver anymore to remove the heat-sink. Its designed as a "twist to tighten" system. It literally took me 20 seconds to install my CPU. All I had to do was take the plastic off, lift the lever, lower the lever, place heat-sink on top and twist each corner. Simple.

BAH! XP rocks. That is my 1987 Honda Civic CRX that gets 43 mpg AND does 10 seconds...

okay, Really I want DOS 3.2 back but XP is so much fun to play with and it is SIMPLE and only takes up between 350MB and 5GB of data so having a 27GB C: has worked well since 2004. What is the smallest install for Windows 7? I do not think it is 350mb-5GB or anywhere near that. Windows 7 seems to grow faster and right now I might consider moving to windows 7 but only for the game system. On my master system I do not want any conflicts with what I already have and I have a ton of crap that is installed that I do not want to hunt down and reinstall.

Wow really? 4 clips? that was what I was talking about. They give you these clips that you like, press down and then twist to unlock, but if you are not careful and illiterate like me and can not read chinese comics then you might press to hard or twist the wrong way after looking at their illustrations and then it does not work like it should anymore. It aint foolproof for clumsy fools like me. The AMD coolers are.

yeah yeah yeah, capitalism. I am all for it, but there is no need to attack others and take cheap shots like that.

There is also another thing with intel that I do not like, I find that most AMD boards are upfront and tell you what CPUs they support but the INTEL nono. One intel mobo that is an lga775 will NOT support certain CPUs that other boards with the same chipsets and so forth will. It was so hard to locate a NEW mobo that supported the dual core Pentium S ??? Damn. I forgot, But I bought three of those boards because I had 3 of those CPUs and they suck for doing that. AMD supports amd, but intel does not support all intel cpus no matter how much alike they might be.
It would be like an AMD board supporting an Athlon, a Sempron, a Phenom, a Phenom II but not a Phenom II 1045 but all others are okay. WTF?

[yellowsulphur]

Yes, the velociraptors have been way better than the raptors were. They're cooler, quieter, use less power, higher capacity(even though they're actually 2.5" disks).

But still, unless you need the IOPS for bulk storage, I'd still go with an SSD and other larger drive/s.

When the original Raptor's spin up it reminds me of bacon frying in a cast iron pan. I like bacon.

[Mr.Caketown]

Ill have to look at some i5 2500k vs i7 3700K comaprisons , as I only plan to build this computer once and hope it lasts for a couple of years. Uses are mainly for Photoshop while watching a movie and occasional gaming.

Anyone have any good recommendations for a video card based off of my current route? I saw some one had suggested ATI but any particular one?

yes hyperthreading is something I would like because from what i read apparently photoshop benefits from it greatly

[Mr.Caketown]

http://pcpartpicker.com/p/fq7O

here is my build thus far

This is like my rough draft , still undecided on the RAM whether or not the Vengeance or Dominator Platinum is that big of a difference

input on the GPU choicE?

[Wallabing]

I have the Corsair dominators, they are very reliable and stable. Been using the 2133 for 1 year now.

I would also reccomend getting a HD 7870, it's only $260 and in the same performance area with the HD 6970.

And if you're not overclocking, you dont need a H100.

If you are overclocking, you only need this.

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16835103065