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  • #16
    bruss01
    Calguns Addict
    • Feb 2006
    • 5336

    I do take precautions with my wi-fi (absurdly long password, good encryption, MAC filtering) but keep in mind as others have said, this is a layered approach.

    Which means, each layer makes it harder for someone to get through.

    Let's say that each layer will block 9 out of ten serious attempts to get into your system. Most folks that are just casually interested will not go through the effort to overcome each layer unless they think you are a high-value target. But someone with unlimited time, resources and motivation will eventually defeat any and all security measures. The idea here is the same as having good security on your home. The more difficult you make it for bad guys to get in, the more they are going to try to find a softer target. However, if you have the National Guard on your doorstep with grimly determined looks on their faces and you can see a hundred guys in uniforms and an APC in the background when you peek out, you know they're getting you out of your house, it's just a matter of when and on what terms.
    The one thing worse than defeat is surrender.

    Comment

    • #17
      NYT
      CGN/CGSSA Contributor
      CGN Contributor
      • Apr 2011
      • 3811

      Originally posted by monk
      By themselves sure, but if you truly know security you know it's a layered approach. Hiding SSID, MAC filtering, limiting amount of DHCP addresses, and a strong WPA2 password are a lot better than just a WPA2 strong password.

      Heck, if you want to get fancy, set up a Radius server and authenticate from a central location using a certificate.

      BTW, I just did some searching and WPA2 had a vulnerability published having to do with the de-authentic/re-authenticate process.
      radius is a pre-2012 term, its called network policy server these days.

      Comment

      • #18
        NYT
        CGN/CGSSA Contributor
        CGN Contributor
        • Apr 2011
        • 3811

        Originally posted by 71MUSTY
        SO what is the most secure Remote Desktop software??? Currently using Microsoft provided but have concerns
        RDP with NLA (network layer auth) is the MS recommended but i use Logmein.

        Comment

        • #19
          NYT
          CGN/CGSSA Contributor
          CGN Contributor
          • Apr 2011
          • 3811

          Originally posted by monk
          each one of those "myths" is best practice for SMB wireless enabled businesses. i wouldnt put too much weight on a blog piece at pcworld. each and every one of those myths can help layer security.

          Comment

          • #20
            j-shot
            Senior Member
            • Jan 2014
            • 1646

            Originally posted by Barbarossa
            all great until you have to actually enter the stupid long complicated password.
            You can make long "complicated" passwords that are easy to type and remember. Start by moving to a passphrase. Switch vowels to numbers, symbols, etc. Develop a system that you can remember and works for you.

            *2016r0wr0wr0wy0urb0at*

            etc...

            Originally posted by monk
            By themselves sure, but if you truly know security you know it's a layered approach. Hiding SSID, MAC filtering, limiting amount of DHCP addresses, and a strong WPA2 password are a lot better than just a WPA2 strong password.

            Heck, if you want to get fancy, set up a Radius server and authenticate from a central location using a certificate.

            BTW, I just did some searching and WPA2 had a vulnerability published having to do with the de-authentic/re-authenticate process.
            Originally posted by monk
            We all learn as we go.
            Originally posted by Citadelgrad87
            ...what we have here is a hillary panty sniffer...
            Originally posted by Appleseed
            A Rifleman understands that owning and mastering a rifle is part of his heritage as an American.
            Originally posted by ProShooter
            No man, butt rape is happening like, all of the time in prison. It's basically just one huge orgy.

            Comment

            • #21
              danfinger
              Member
              • May 2016
              • 295

              my passphrase is:

              HelloHelloThisIsScheckyShpilkaFromTheTouchyFeelyPo keySqueelyMaritalAidAndRubberProtuberenceCompanyOf PasaikNewJerseyForThoseOfYouLadiesWhoThinkBenWaIsT heOwnerOfAChineseLaundryPleaseComeInForAPersonalFi ttingFromMyWifeBrunHilda
              Last edited by danfinger; 09-13-2016, 4:29 PM.
              Anti-intellectualism has been a constant thread winding its way through our political and cultural life, nurtured by the false notion that democracy means that 'my ignorance is just as good as your knowledge.'
              ― Isaac Asimov

              Reason is the greatest enemy that faith has.
              ~Martin Luther

              Comment

              • #22
                OutlawStar
                Member
                • Sep 2010
                • 455

                So even if you're in an apartment and 12 people have a decent signal to your wireless router, and your password is something easy like john12345, what are the odds that someone would use a tool to Crack the password in 30 secs and gain access to your Internet? I'm guessing fairly low.

                Doesn't windows itself block other users on your network or home group from accessing your files as well?

                Comment

                • #23
                  Victor Cachat
                  Senior Member
                  • Apr 2014
                  • 1546

                  You know, we hear about all of the gun battles that erupt when cops bust people for child porn, so it is understandable that they would raid the house when they were likely to be asleep.

                  What?
                  Never happens?
                  Well, then why the eff did they think they had to do it that way?
                  Democrats>Socialists>Communists - Same goals, different speeds.

                  The most effective and pervasive enemy of American freedoms today is the Legacy Media. Defeat them first.

                  Comment

                  • #24
                    the86d
                    Calguns Addict
                    • Jul 2011
                    • 9587

                    Originally posted by 71MUSTY
                    SO what is the most secure Remote Desktop software??? Currently using Microsoft provided but have concerns
                    How about an ssh tunnel?
                    This option is gratis, with free software.

                    Comment

                    • #25
                      NYT
                      CGN/CGSSA Contributor
                      CGN Contributor
                      • Apr 2011
                      • 3811

                      Originally posted by OutlawStar
                      So even if you're in an apartment and 12 people have a decent signal to your wireless router, and your password is something easy like john12345, what are the odds that someone would use a tool to Crack the password in 30 secs and gain access to your Internet? I'm guessing fairly low.

                      Doesn't windows itself block other users on your network or home group from accessing your files as well?
                      it depends. a lot of apartment buildings have budding hackers as tenants. when i was in my college apartment building, we would try to break into as many wireless networks as we could. i remember messing with my friend and sending his shared printer about 1000 full size pics of penises.

                      windows does have a firewall but it depends on how they setup their lan.

                      Comment

                      • #26
                        j-shot
                        Senior Member
                        • Jan 2014
                        • 1646

                        Originally posted by danfinger
                        my passphrase is:

                        HelloHelloThisIsScheckyShpilkaFromTheTouchyFeelyPo keySqueelyMaritalAidAndRubberProtuberenceCompanyOf PasaikNewJerseyForThoseOfYouLadiesWhoThinkBenWaIsT heOwnerOfAChineseLaundryPleaseComeInForAPersonalFi ttingFromMyWifeBrunHilda
                        Needs more symbols

                        Originally posted by OutlawStar
                        So even if you're in an apartment and 12 people have a decent signal to your wireless router, and your password is something easy like john12345, what are the odds that someone would use a tool to Crack the password in 30 secs and gain access to your Internet? I'm guessing fairly low.

                        Doesn't windows itself block other users on your network or home group from accessing your files as well?
                        Fairly low, correct.

                        Depends on how you set windows.

                        Originally posted by the86d
                        How about an ssh tunnel?
                        This option is gratis, with free software.
                        Win.
                        Originally posted by Citadelgrad87
                        ...what we have here is a hillary panty sniffer...
                        Originally posted by Appleseed
                        A Rifleman understands that owning and mastering a rifle is part of his heritage as an American.
                        Originally posted by ProShooter
                        No man, butt rape is happening like, all of the time in prison. It's basically just one huge orgy.

                        Comment

                        • #27
                          NYT
                          CGN/CGSSA Contributor
                          CGN Contributor
                          • Apr 2011
                          • 3811

                          ssh2 is great for command line interfaces, i use them daily to work with my rhel servers. they are not so great for rdp connections to windows machines as the connection is buggy.

                          the primary security concern with rdp, especially with NLA enabled is a man-in-the-middle scenario. traffic is passed to a sniffer of some sort which can root out the creds you are using to connect.

                          logmein rescue addresses all these concerns and is the only remote SSL/TLS tool to be endorsed by major banks and credit card companies.

                          Comment

                          • #28
                            Fizz
                            Senior Member
                            • Feb 2012
                            • 1473

                            As someone who's broken into many a wireless network (for fun) and secured many more (professionally) these points are key:

                            - WEP is useless. I was able to break into these at age 14 using articles posted on the internet about replaying packets/capturing IVs.

                            - MAC Filtering is useless. The reason is your MAC is broadcast in plaintext for all to see, regardless of your encryption. You can readily see what MACs are communicating with what access points and vice versa. You can 'change' your MAC address to match a client that's in the allowed list.

                            - Hiding the SSID is useless. When you see a hidden SSID all you need to do is either wait for someone to join the AP (who know the SSID) and this will be broadcast for all to see. Or if you're impatient you can deauthenticate one of the clients, force them to reconnect and you'll get the SSID.

                            - If you have a good WPA2 password; you're FINE. WPA2 is not broken, UNLESS someone can GUESS (Brute Force) or otherwise acquire your password via other means your wireless transmissions from your devices to/from your router are secure (what happens after that is another question...) ***

                            - ^ UNLESS your router has a WPS vulnerability (that 'easy connect' button on some routers that allows you to push it, then on your device to automatically configure them). Not as big an issue on routers within the last few years.

                            *** For a long time AT&T was giving its customers 2wire router/modem combo units that followed a simple formula for SSID and password; 2wire### and a 10 DIGIT password. This means the SSIDs were guaranteed between 2wire000 and 2wire999 and passwords between 000000000 and 999999999. It used to take me about 1-3 hours to crack ANY one of these (in a lab environment of course) on a desktop computer utilizing a GPU (video card) to figure out password (CPUs suck at this).

                            I performed an experiment where I drove around the city for a bit and found all the 2WIRE### SSIDs I could, as to limit the amount of SSIDs to examine. I then precomputed ALL the handshake possibilities for each SSID (If you have two networks with the same SSID and different passwords, the handshake doesn't look the same). The database was massive, but of all the 2wire### i had almost a 80% success rate being able to determine the WPA2 password. The ones I couldn't the users either changed the default password or had a newer 2wire that came with a alphanumeric passwords.
                            Last edited by Fizz; 09-14-2016, 9:26 AM.

                            Comment

                            • #29
                              Uxi
                              Calguns Addict
                              • Apr 2008
                              • 5155

                              Originally posted by Marauder2003
                              So you are saying there is no way to secure WiFi?
                              If they want in, they're going to get in, it's only a matter of when and what they can reach. Wifi should be isolated from the wired net.

                              MAC addresses can be sniffed and spoofed. Encryption is just a math problem. If you're not moving, a computer can crank on it for as long as it's needed.

                              For good security, you would do two phase authentication (Radius, etc) and a Certificate. You should rotate passwords and certificates on a periodic basis as well as turning off radios during middle of night, if not also in day when no one else is home, etc.
                              "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms. The strongest reason for the people to retain the right to keep and bear arms is, as a last resort, to protect themselves against tyranny in government." -- Thomas Jefferson

                              9mm + 5.56mm =
                              .45ACP + 7.62 NATO =
                              10mm + 6.8 SPC =
                              sigpic

                              Et Verbum caro factum est et habitavit in nobis; Jn 1:14

                              Comment

                              • #30
                                machrono
                                Senior Member
                                • Feb 2012
                                • 637

                                Agreed, hiding your SSID and MAC filtering do nothing to improve your security, they only add headache.

                                Comment

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