Why do people cycle live rounds at home??

[One Shot, One Dropped]

My point was SOME PEOPLE ARE STUPID, what might be ok for you and I (i.e. cycling live ammo) Is not okay for everyone and should not be promoted as the correct thing to do.

The only time I ever did it was to check whether rounds were in spec before taking them to the range. I didn't have calipers on hand, and I could see different amounts of canelure (sp?) showing on some of the rounds.

[One Shot, One Dropped]

The only time I ever did it was to check whether rounds were in spec before taking them to the range. I didn't have calipers on hand, and I could see different amounts of canelure (sp?) showing on some of the rounds.

And yes, I did create a thread about it. I know it could result in an accidental discharge, but I was being as safe as possible with the muzzle direction and only cycling twice.

[Rudolf the Red]

Just have a reloading buddy make you some dummy rounds with no powder and some silicone in the flash hole. Or make them yourself.

[technique]

The only time I ever did it was to check whether rounds were in spec before taking them to the range. I didn't have calipers on hand, and I could see different amounts of canelure (sp?) showing on some of the rounds.

No ones Flamin or blamin anyone here, Its just not a good idea for everyone to think loading and unloading a firearm in their home is a SAFE thing to do. Not everyone is competent with a firearm, or power tools, or water and electrical.


Some people are accident prone. You have a ND and it kills your neighbors poodle, we all look bad.

[redneckshootist]

I do it all the time to check function and feeding. Also on my HD shotgun to unload them when Im gonna take them to the range.
never had a ND cause everytime I KEPT MY FINGER OFF THE TRIGGER, and kept the gun pointed in a safe direction. If people follow the basic safety rules I dont see a problem with cycling live ammo.

[One Shot, One Dropped]

Just have a reloading buddy make you some dummy rounds with no powder and some silicone in the flash hole. Or make them yourself.

I have those, but that wouldn't have helped my situation because I was seeing if those rounds would chamber correctly...

I don't do it all the time because it's not the safest deal, but I don't think I was doing anything that stupid. If you live in town (or close to your neighbors), you should NOT do stuff like that. If you live in the middle of nowhere surrounded by redwoods and you keep it pointed in a safe direction, I think you will be fine (especially if you live in an area that isn't legally considered a no-shoot zone...)

[saki302]

If you must do it, keep your finger off the trigger and the gun pointed in a safe direction. I've done it rarely, and in weird calibers you can't buy snap caps for readily (I since have found snap caps in most of those calibers).

I've also made snap caps by drilling the side of the case (2-4 holes) and carefully pulling the powder (puor out of the first hole!!), then detonating the primer in a vise (vents out the side holes). Even drilled, if the primer detonates in the chamber it will squib your bullet in the barrel.


"In addition repeated cycling of rounds though the action of your gun accelerates their wear (ask any LE range master about it) and reduces reliable extraction due to wear on the cartridge."

I have a problem with this idea. What do you think happens every time you fire the gun? MUCH more force is put on it than you could ever put by hand. The bad thing on match pistols is to drop the slide on an EMPTY chamber. It will wear the SINGLE cartridge if you keep doing it to the same round again and again.

-Dave

[The Cable Guy]

This thread just reminded me to get some

Just bought 10x STAction Pro dummy rounds in .223/5.56, 8x 12ga and two 50rd plastic cases for 5.56 and 2 25rd cases for 12ga.

Also bought a pack of 24 pachmayr .22LR snap caps from ebay

[God Bless The Mauser]

I hunt the raccoons and skunks that try to get my chickens at night. I take either my AR or AK an I always chamber in the house. I'm aware that both of these have free floating firing pins and that it is possible they could slam fire. I just cycle the action really slow and for AR I just tap foreward assist to fully chamber and AK just tap bolt carrier. I have chambered live rounds in the house hundreds of times and have never has a ND because I am CAREFULL.

[saki302]

Yep- you know the 'proper' way to chamber the AR/AK safely

The snap caps I like are the A-Zoom ones. The polymer primer doesn't wear out quickly, and they won't fall apart like the cheaper ones (red and clear plastic). I've had .223 and 308 versions of those which fell apart after a while.

-Dave

[Darklyte27]

I told myself to never chamber a live rd unless i need to shoot someone.
I only put the dummy rds to play with.

[Beelzy]

As long as one owns a firearm, there will come a time when the cycling of live
ammo will occur.

Now random cycling with live ammo, that should not occur. Get the snap-caps
for that. Sheesh!

[Turbinator]

Perhaps if you refer to a specific incident or 2, including linking to the OP if there were one, understanding would improve.

Ok, Hanko, I can't back down from a reasonable challenge. My point is this - we are always so concerned about ND's and endangering other people who aren't meant to be endangered. Why put yourself 1 step closer to that needlessly if you don't need to?

If you chamber live rounds at home, sooner or later this will happen:

"There is a true story about famed gun-safety/combat firearm technique/journalist Jeff Cooper showing off a new single-action revolver to a fellow reporter, and in the process, thinking the gun was unloaded, he aimed it in a "safe direction" at a gas-meter on a neighbor's house across the street, and blew a hole through the damned thing. (It did not blow up but he it hit exactly at the point he was aiming). Later, the meter was obtained, chromed (or gold-plated, can't remember which) and presented to Mr. Cooper at some kind of an awards/roast dinner. But this was many years after he had already been writing articles and training many, many people on gun safety."

(quoted from CALI-gula from this thread - http://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/s...ad.php?t=71170)

Also in the same post from CALI-gula:

"I DO have a story where this paid off; I bought a BJT Derringer in .357Mag at a local gun store along with a few other guns, handled it in the store at purchase (empty chamber), and on my pick up, salesman #1 hands me the gun, action opened (now if you know these guns, you can't open them and not see a round in it - it's greatly obvious the way they flip open) we do the final 4473/DROS signatures, I checked the chamber, close the empty gun, put it away in it's zipper-case rug and then proceeded to look at another gun in the counter.

Meanwhile, salesman #1 dealing with me, puts the gun (already in its zipper-case rug) back on the back rack and down behind the 90 degree counter, at the other end of the "L" shape, along with a couple of other guns I was buying at the same time, as the store was crowded, so none would "walk off" with it. He and I are looking at a gun from the counter, and meanwhile, dumb-dork salesman #2, out of view, is checking out the "neat derringer" I just bought, unbeknownst to me or salesman #1; we don't even see him doing it as we are at the opposite end of the 90 degree counter.

Time comes for me to leave the store; salesman #1, hands me my stack of guns, which appear to be just as he/we left them, in their boxes, cases, and rugs, and I walk out happy.

I get home. Take the guns out of their cases/boxes/rugs to clean and clear them before putting them into the safe. First thing I do is crack them open to check the chambers - lo and behold, in the BJT derringer, in one chamber, there resides a LIVE blue-nosed Magtech safety cartridge in .38 Special!!

The dumb-dork salesman #2 had loaded it "to see if .38 special would chamber in it" as he would later admit (when I called the store to rip them one). He got distracted with his job and phone call, laid it down, stepped away, then as things got busy, he came back to it, closed the gun up, and put the gun back in its rug, completely forgetting he loaded it and never took the round back out. He was an Vietnam Vet too, a Marine, and a self proclaimed "professional" collector/shooter."

Then MedSpec65 stepped up with his story:

"My major braincramp occurred about a year ago. I left one in the chamber after taking my MK9 to the range. Negligently discharged it into the livingroom wall of my apartment when I mindlessly pulled the DAO trigger prior to cleaning. The round left a 4" diameter crater in the outside stucco in an enclosed entryway area. Luckily the round expended inside a portable cooler I had stashed just outside. I never realized I could mix up a batch of Fix-All so fast. I had both holes patched within minutes. If a neighbor had called I would have had to deny everything to the Police or lose an expensive gun collection. Never again."

M. Sage had a very interesting one to share:

"While we're admitting things... Yes, I've had to do an emergency patch on a couple of walls. There's a surprise sitting behind the stucco outside my bedroom.

That primer was VERY soft. I still have the case and there's really barely even a mark from the firing pin. Happened when de-cocking."

I'll bet cycling a round like that a few times might get it to go off, eh?

M. Sage had a comment that I really agree with:

"I know I'm a lot less likely to chamber a round in my house now. I might put a mag into a gun, but I'm not going to work the action unless I'm really sure I'm going to need a firearm (which hasn't happened)."

Wise lesson, learned the hard way.

Daskraut shared his story:

"Classic!, too dang funny...since nobody was hurt. I can point and giggle because I have done it too!. Cleaning my Tokarev 9MM, I had just reassembled it and was working the action and releasing the slide many times....kinda goofing off to say the least late one night while watching TV. At some point I put the magazine in, let the slide slam forward....and ...then ....pulled ...the trigger..BANG!!!!!!. I had the pistol pointing straight up. I could see the hole in the ceiling. I quickly turned off the TV and lights and waited fot the round to hit close by......then waitied for any sirens.....15 min go by. Then I walked around the block to ensure nobody was screaming or laid out on the sidewalk. All was well. I stopped goofing off with firearms while watching TV with ammo in the same room. What a dingbat. You do not bow your head in shame alone."

I'm telling you, chambering live ammo at home is just a disaster waiting to happen, NO MATTER HOW GOOD you think you are.

Goldy1's experience more closely matches this specific topic:

"sounds kinda like what happened to me recently. i was loading match rounds for my wifes 308 which was sitting on top of the entertainment center in the living room of our appartment. i made one about .1 longer than the prior. i dropped it in the chamber and closed the bolt and it went off. the rifle was right about eye level and perpendicular to me and the muzzle was over my head ( over 6ft up) and facing slightly upward. scared the wife and i both alot. we were lucky no one was around outside. it stopped in a wall about 30ft or less from the muzzle. scarey stuff accidental discharges."

Uh huh. Hmm.

I'm glad to see some of the guys posting in THIS thread agree with me:

http://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/showthread.php?t=120506

Then we have the most recent incident:

"Naw, a few weeks ago I was having problems with my bolt jamming after only a few rounds. I believe I posted the issue, anyway, I went ahead and cleaned it and added teflon lube, just a bit. After I checked it all out i wanted to see how it would chamber a round, I have no .223 snap caps so my dumbass thinking "I know what Im doing" chambered live rounds, just 5 to see how it would work. I chambered them and ejected them no problem. So just now, I went to check out my OLL and see how the bolt was doing. I didnt chamber any rounds. I just pulled on the charging handle and let the bolt drop. It got stuck. I pulled and pulled and nothing. I opened up the upper and saw nothing wrong but it was stuck. Thats when I tripped out and posted this thread. After that, I gave it one more strong pull and the whole charging handle and bolt came flying out along with a live round I had forgot 1 round in the chamber weeks ago when I was checking out how my oll was functioning and that is what caused the bolt to get stuck. Thank God I didnt pull the trigger thinking I was dry firing it. I would have a huge problem. There is a lesson to be learned here I think."

Bold emphasis is mine.

Do we need to keep going? Loaded chambers where they shouldn't be loaded, when they shouldn't be loaded, when you can avoid loading them, is just a problem waiting to happen.

Remember - there are TWO types of gun owners:

1) Has had a negligent discharge

2) WILL HAVE a negligent discharge

Which are you?

Turby

[Matt C]

"There is a true story about famed gun-safety/combat firearm technique/journalist Jeff Cooper showing off a new single-action revolver to a fellow reporter, and in the process, thinking the gun was unloaded, he aimed it in a "safe direction" at a gas-meter on a neighbor's house across the street, and blew a hole through the damned thing. (It did not blow up but he it hit exactly at the point he was aiming). Later, the meter was obtained, chromed (or gold-plated, can't remember which) and presented to Mr. Cooper at some kind of an awards/roast dinner. But this was many years after he had already been writing articles and training many, many people on gun safety."

Pulled the trigger.

Second story had no ND so I'll skip it since it's not relevant.

"My major braincramp occurred about a year ago. I left one in the chamber after taking my MK9 to the range. Negligently discharged it into the livingroom wall of my apartment when I mindlessly pulled the DAO trigger prior to cleaning. The round left a 4" diameter crater in the outside stucco in an enclosed entryway area. Luckily the round expended inside a portable cooler I had stashed just outside. I never realized I could mix up a batch of Fix-All so fast. I had both holes patched within minutes. If a neighbor had called I would have had to deny everything to the Police or lose an expensive gun collection. Never again."

Pulled the trigger.

"While we're admitting things... Yes, I've had to do an emergency patch on a couple of walls. There's a surprise sitting behind the stucco outside my bedroom.

That primer was VERY soft. I still have the case and there's really barely even a mark from the firing pin. Happened when de-cocking."

Can't be sure if he pulled the trigger to de-cock(1911?) or what, need more info on this one. Link?

I'll bet cycling a round like that a few times might get it to go off, eh?

Why? The hammer does not fall when cycling on any of my semi-autos. In any case this happened while de-cocking, NOT while cycling.

"Classic!, too dang funny...since nobody was hurt. I can point and giggle because I have done it too!. Cleaning my Tokarev 9MM, I had just reassembled it and was working the action and releasing the slide many times....kinda goofing off to say the least late one night while watching TV. At some point I put the magazine in, let the slide slam forward....and ...then ....pulled ...the trigger..BANG!!!!!!. I had the pistol pointing straight up. I could see the hole in the ceiling. I quickly turned off the TV and lights and waited fot the round to hit close by......then waitied for any sirens.....15 min go by. Then I walked around the block to ensure nobody was screaming or laid out on the sidewalk. All was well. I stopped goofing off with firearms while watching TV with ammo in the same room. What a dingbat. You do not bow your head in shame alone."

Pulled the trigger.

"sounds kinda like what happened to me recently. i was loading match rounds for my wifes 308 which was sitting on top of the entertainment center in the living room of our appartment. i made one about .1 longer than the prior. i dropped it in the chamber and closed the bolt and it went off. the rifle was right about eye level and perpendicular to me and the muzzle was over my head ( over 6ft up) and facing slightly upward. scared the wife and i both alot. we were lucky no one was around outside. it stopped in a wall about 30ft or less from the muzzle. scarey stuff accidental discharges."

Bolt action apples to semi-auto oranges, this is not what we are talking about.

"Naw, a few weeks ago I was having problems with my bolt jamming after only a few rounds. I believe I posted the issue, anyway, I went ahead and cleaned it and added teflon lube, just a bit. After I checked it all out i wanted to see how it would chamber a round, I have no .223 snap caps so my dumbass thinking "I know what Im doing" chambered live rounds, just 5 to see how it would work. I chambered them and ejected them no problem. So just now, I went to check out my OLL and see how the bolt was doing. I didnt chamber any rounds. I just pulled on the charging handle and let the bolt drop. It got stuck. I pulled and pulled and nothing. I opened up the upper and saw nothing wrong but it was stuck. Thats when I tripped out and posted this thread. After that, I gave it one more strong pull and the whole charging handle and bolt came flying out along with a live round I had forgot 1 round in the chamber weeks ago when I was checking out how my oll was functioning and that is what caused the bolt to get stuck. Thank God I didnt pull the trigger thinking I was dry firing it. I would have a huge problem. There is a lesson to be learned here I think."

No ND here, but there only would have been IF HE HAD PULLED THE TRIGGER. And again, we are talking about pistols.


Still waiting for one single incident in the history of modern semi auto pistols of an ad/nd due to cycling.

[Turbinator]

Still waiting for one single incident in the history of modern semi auto pistols of an ad/nd due to cycling.

I respect you for what you've gone through for the gun owner community, but I really think you're on the wrong track.

My point isn't that a gun in itself is inherently unsafe for cycling rounds - generally they're not - that's what they're made to do. I also never specifically said that semi-autos are unsafe. You can cycle rounds through a pump action shotgun or a bolt action rifle - and I'd still have the same complaint.

My point is that people themselves can be unsafe, as demonstrated in the anecdotes above.

If people insist on cycling live rounds in a non-range environment, when they don't have to, then we'll continue to see more stories like the above come out over and over. Some will be here, in a sheepish fashion. Some will be in the news annotated at night by an anti-gun newsperson.

Don't get hung up on what you *think* I am saying - I'm telling you what I'm saying, and I'm saying that my problem isn't with guns at all. It's with people who aren't mindful enough to stay safe. I've never said in any of my posts (or at least I don't think I have, and if I did, I'm wrong then) that the guns are the problem.

Hope that clears it up a little.

Turby