Do you have a problem with this transaction?

[stillbigmac]

We don't serve your type here either Ivan

Actually because I know and really do like Ivan his story kinda pisses me off. I've lived in the bay area nearly my whole life. It does take more than tatoos and baggy clothes to not get helped. If your talking like an idiot, I cant help you. Course this applies to everyone. I had a white lady in her mid thirties come in wanting a concealable handgun. She was murmuring about how she wasn't going to take it anymore.. no sale..

Yes the young guy did spin around, point a 12 guage into his buddies guts and go "BLAM".

[saki302]

Reminds me of an idiot who walked into the Pasadena Turners years ago.

I was standing at the counter, and he asked the manager to see a snubby revolver.
He takes the gun, holds it at about hip level pointed right at the manager;s gut, and pulls the trigger 5 times.
He then handed it back and left.

I commented to the manager about how the guy just blew his guts out, and he just shook his head in that sad knowing way

-Dave

[natrab]

I first want to say that I think it is un-American to judge AND act on (meaning ask them to leave or something) someone by the clothes their wearing or their race or even their speech. You can judge them all you want, but don't act until something besides appearance gives you reason. In my highschool (very suburban white population), baggy clothes, sideways hats and "ebonics" were the cool thing to do. I never really got into that, but like it or not it is a modern fashion (I now really don't like it).

An aside about me. I work for a 911 ambulance provider in an area which has a huge gang population (mostly hispanic) and is second in gang related gun deaths only to Richmond (info taken from a news story, dunno how valid it is). Many of the patients I see have gang tats and look like they could be packing. I'd say 60% of the time these people were involved with gangs when they were kids, and have no current affiliation (they're usually nice people as well). 30% still seem shady and 10% are pure gangbangers. Those last 40% will usually give themselves away with the first few words they say to me. I.E. I ask: "What happened, are you ok?", reply: "Yeah some scrap wanted to start ****..." etc. Police are there as soon as possible.

I don't make any assumptions until I hear them say or see them do something to makes me feel unsafe around them. The second they do I take action. It's been hard to learn to do this, since when I first started I was scared of half the people we ran on (especially since we're not allowed to carry any self-defense gear). I'd call for PD or SO on more calls then necessary simply for a feeling of security. I slowly got over it and learned to use my senses and judgement. There's nothing wrong with asking someone their intentions when buying ammo or the likes. If they say something that makes you worry, kick em out.

I just don't like hearing people talk about how shady someone was because they were wearing "baggy pants and bling." I knew too many suburban white boys from rich families who strived to look like that in highschool. That's my generation (I'm 22 btw).

[Charliegone]

It isn't necessarily the way they dress, I could care less! Its the lack of safety that concerns me and the way they act.

[Gunner1]

first impressions

First impressions can be tough, Bigmacs story of the Gang Bangers wearing red and pointing guns at people is a no brainer, kick em out.
first impressions are kinda funny though, Take me for instance. I am a very large scruffy, bearded,tattoo'd biker. I am also a Law Enforcement officer.
My appearence says "Trouble" I never meant it that way, thats just the way it worked out. The subject of profiling is a touchy one, I have been pulled over and treated like crap by the CHP until they discover my occupation. Then the comedy begins, its kinda fun to make em squirm a little. Especially the new ones fresh from the Academy.
Enough of my ranting, lets keep focused on whats truly important now. Getting our state to recognize the 2nd ammendment for what it is.


Gunner

p.s. its also kinda fun to go buy a gun in a shop that doesn't know me, I get asked all sorts of funny questions. Ever been in prison? My answer is yes." I have to go quite often". Then they usually say that I wont be able to buy a gun. Thats usually when the business card comes out.

[Ericthenorse]

I am from Richmond.. I knew a lot of guys that dressed like gang members, but absolutely were not... They had to dress that way to survive... How long do you think they could have stayed alive wearing polo shirts and the like ....( most of Richmond is prety peacefull, but it does have areas where I will not drive at night... For a time in the late eighties/early ninetys, a 12 square block area in richmond was the murder capitol of the US...)

[saki302]

Take me for instance. I am a very large scruffy, bearded,tattoo'd biker. I am also a Law Enforcement officer.

You now look "Undercover"

-Dave

[PanzerAce]

p.s. its also kinda fun to go buy a gun in a shop that doesn't know me, I get asked all sorts of funny questions. Ever been in prison? My answer is yes." I have to go quite often". Then they usually say that I wont be able to buy a gun. Thats usually when the business card comes out.

you should have said something like: "Yah, I've been in and out for years"

[bodyarmorguy27]

If it looks like a duck, walks like a duck, talks like a duck, chances are.... it's a duck.

Like Gunner said, profiling is a sensitive issue. And I find it funny how someone can say all cops profile, when they are doing the same exact thing themselves by opening their mouths.

[ghostrider4evr]

I am from Richmond.. I knew a lot of guys that dressed like gang members, but absolutely were not... They had to dress that way to survive... How long do you think they could have stayed alive wearing polo shirts and the like ....( most of Richmond is prety peacefull, but it does have areas where I will not drive at night... For a time in the late eighties/early ninetys, a 12 square block area in richmond was the murder capitol of the US...)

I thought I saw on that news that Richmond is the current murder capital of the U.S.

[rkt88edmo]

I just don't like hearing people talk about how shady someone was because they were wearing "baggy pants and bling." I knew too many suburban white boys from rich families who strived to look like that in highschool. That's my generation (I'm 22 btw).

waaaah

We have to live with the choices we make everyday, how we dress, how we've decorated our bodies, how we've picked up scars from this and that. Even if your past is behind you and you are a changed person, you still bear the mark.

[losangeles]

I don't think it's a big deal about the baggy clothes, the tattos and the bling. Not my style, but that doesn't implicate anybody in my mind. Some folks think they're making a fashion statement. They wear the attire of their rebellious heroes in the rap world. OK by me just as long as they don't start acting out those fantasy roles.

However, that dude pointing the gun at people down range is wrong. It violates gun safety and is reason to have him thrown out of the range.

[saki302]

Like Gunner said, profiling is a sensitive issue. And I find it funny how someone can say all cops profile, when they are doing the same exact thing themselves by opening their mouths.

It's ridiculous to expect anyone in the LE world to not profile people some of the time.

Without profiling, an 80 year old granny hobbling down a street is equally as suspect in a crime- that's just ridiculous (well, I suppose SOME could be, but it's unlikely).

It's just a matter of doing it in a resonable manner, and not simply because of someone's race. If you dress/act like a gang banger, expect to get hassled or treated differently- that's just how it is. For a gang unit cop, a lot of those baggy clothes and styles signify gang colors or affiliations- now you've got a major problem (not just with the cops if you did it by accident!).
I've always been treated great by cops, but I've known a few guys who get the whole other side of the coin simply because of attitude

-Dave

[Shoot-it]

Gunner1

Rant on Rant on i never get tired of LEO stories.I know a retired police captain from Walnut creek i never get tired of his stories.lol..............

[losangeles]

I can understand profiling and find nothing wrong with it!

Part of my childhood growing up gave me a lot of exposure to some violent neighborhoods (Wilmington/Harbor City area, Compton, Carson, Watts). Based on my experience growing up and seeing troublemaking kids, it doesn't take long for you to recognize when trouble is coming, and that includes how they behave, talk, dress.

And I was fortunate enough to subsequently live in some nice neighborhoods where the homies and los vatos don't hang out. Murder in Compton numbers close to like a hundred in 2005; murder in Rolling Hills is zero in 2005, 2004, 2003, .. Hello, there's a difference!

Yeah, it's profiling, and it works! (But my prior post still stands that just generic baggie pants, bling and wannabe mannerisms don't bother me --- there are a lot of wannabees in this world, and I can recognize them as fakes and they don't bother me.)