Range Obligation Regarding Illegal Guns

[guns_and_labs]

Really? You can tell the difference between an illegally configured firearm and a perfectly legal RAW just by looking at it? Pretty good eyes I guess

You can tell a perfectly legal RAW by the halo over it, right?

[fourXfour]

Really? You can tell the difference between an illegally configured firearm and a perfectly legal RAW just by looking at it? Pretty good eyes I guess

You can tell a perfectly legal RAW by the halo over it, right?

If its got a serial number.... All you have to do is run it. The R stands for registered. That just requires looking at it. The post I replied to asked how "I" would be able to check.

As far as a private citizen, The SBR/SBS should be pretty easy to ID. In reality I want mis-informed new shooters to be educated. If the suspected offender is considered dangerous. I would hope no one would try to detain someone they knew to be armed.

[John Browning]

If its got a serial number.... All you have to do is run it. The R stands for registered. That just requires looking at it.

As far as a private citizen, The SBR/SBS should be pretty easy to ID.

Wow, this is quite possibly the dumbest thing I've seen since visiting the shotgun forums today. The R stands for registered? You derped when you should have herped.

[fourXfour]

The R in RAW. I added to my post before I saw your reply. I do apologize for the confusion. I was referring to DOJ's database. Our dispatch can run any serial number and confirm registration in a few moments. Looking at my earlier post, I did not mention that.

[joefreas]

The R in RAW. I added to my post before I saw your reply.

So I get detained by range staff while they wait for a real cop to come run the numbers on my RAW???

What range do you work at because I don't want to go there.

[fourXfour]

So I get detained by range staff while they wait for a real cop to come run the numbers on my RAW???

What range do you work at because I don't want to go there.

Again I apologize. I was asked what "I" would do. I presumed it was from an LE perspective. I'm not an RO. By all means keep shooting and having fun. I will excuse my self from this thread. I do apologize if I insulted anyone.

[Gryff]

So as a customer at the range, do you expect the range to police their shooters for illegal guns?

No. There are so many vagueries in the laws that it is difficult to know what is illegal. As long as the guns are safe and appropriate for the range, I expect the staff to butt out.

[warbird]

I just keep a copy of my DOJ printout in the gun case and they can check the serial numbers if they want. The guns are legal preban guns in teh stock configuration they came with from the factory. that should resolve any issues.

[FourLoko]

At our PRIVATE gun range, members are expected to tell a RSO if the suspect any firearm is illegal. The RSO must act on the information, and have the member or guest remove the firearm if it violates range rules. One of our range rules is no illegally configured firearms. I have had members question my featureless rifles, but after telling them it is legal, and explaining why, they have always let it drop.

I would never get involved in that discussion at a public range. I have however ratted out several unsafe individuals (loading off the line, no muzzle discipline, etc.) and let the range deal with them.

sounds terrible

[Pthfndr]

Again I apologize. I was asked what "I" would do. I presumed it was from an LE perspective. I'm not an RO. By all means keep shooting and having fun. I will excuse my self from this thread. I do apologize if I insulted anyone.

No apology needed. But it would have helped had you mentioned you are LE. Stay in the discussion.

But even as a LEO, if you are at the range on your own time, off duty, how do KNOW that something is illegal? By the way it looks? By the way the user looks?

If you go up to them and tell them you think their firearm is illegal and they say it's perfectly legal, and legal for them to have it, without invoking your LE status and seizing said firearm, how do you KNOW it's illegal.

It could be a NFA regulated item, and still be legal for them to have in CA. They might have all the proper paperwork. None of that is readily apparent.

[fourXfour]

No apology needed. But it would have helped had you mentioned you are LE. Stay in the discussion.

But even as a LEO, if you are at the range on your own time, off duty, how do KNOW that something is illegal? By the way it looks? By the way the user looks?

If you go up to them and tell them you think their firearm is illegal and they say it's perfectly legal, and legal for them to have it, without invoking your LE status and seizing said firearm, how do you KNOW it's illegal.

It could be a NFA regulated item, and still be legal for them to have in CA. They might have all the proper paperwork. None of that is readily apparent.

I really don't get involved with other shooters and their gear when I'm off duty. If they are doing something unsafe, then I leave and possibly let the range know. And that's only happened once when a guy was waiving his shotgun all over the place. Unless I'm in some form of imminent danger, I won't ID myself.

Personally I take pride in making sure everything I have is legal. Our chief won't give out letterhead for RAWs, so I do the bullet button route as well. I go shooting with SWAT guys at public ranges with their SBR M4s. Sometimes that's the only chance they get to shoot at 200 yards. Some of them work narcotics and look fairly shady. They definitely get a few odd looks. There is plenty of reasons someone may have some interesting gear. Most ranges check the weapons and prefer not to have anyone committing a crime on their property. I honestly can't think of any kind of way a range could get in trouble. I don't even know who would regulate non-FFL ranges.

As far as on duty, 100% of the guns I get to examine are from drug search warrants, gang cases, domestic violence cases and mental committals. Honestly I point guys in the right direction if there is a violation or tell them how to describe the weapon in their report. Sometimes I do it over the phone. Most guns are in a legal configuration and are only tested to see if they are functional to charge for some form of an enhancement. The few unregistered assault weapons I have seen were all purchased out of state, not sure if they were straw purchases or the person moved from out of state.

I there is a complaint about a RAW, a simple procedure is to run the serial number to see if it is a RAW or stolen. After that, the flow chart will determine everything else. All of that is checked just by looking at the rifle. Depending on the situation, criminal history will be checked to see if someone is a convicted felon.

There are FFLs and ranges in the city I work in. In the ten years I have worked there, we have never received a call regarding the concerns in this post. I know for a fact they are strict about RAWs and demand to see the paperwork. They have never called if something was not legit.

That being said, I could see a bizarre scenario where someone is checking in with an RO. They have an sbr and they look to be about 18 years old. Immediately you confirm they are not LE and are no where close enough in age to have lawfully registered an AR. They openly admit that they don't have any idea what a RAW is or what the NFA is. They admit to building a lower that was given to them with parts they ordered online. Can an RO detain or arrest? I think they would be on solid legal ground, but I would hope they would chose to educate the new shooter. If a private citizen is going to this route, obtaining some form of an admission would be essential.

I hope that answers your question.

[Pthfndr]

I hope that answers your question.

Yes, much better

[cmichini]

Seeing as that is 100% legal, I'm sure you'll catch an earful.

Careful, M1A with standard flash hider and 20 rd. mag is an AW if I understand correctly. WIth the muzzle brake you're OK.

In that case the RO, if he figured it out, would be right. But, hey, even a blind squirrel finds a nut now and then.

[cmichini]

While there is no obligation. If a felony or misdemeanor is committed in your presence anyone can detain or arrest. The mall does it everyday. If an RO witnesses a felony, he can go the citizens arrest route. Highly unlikely, but plausible.

Now, that I'd love to see. Especially if the RO is a typical one who has cranium planted firmly in the sphincter. The ensuing civil case would be an eye opener for ol' Barney Fife.

[Saym14]

mind your own business.