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Bulletproofing A Self-Business ?

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  • #16
    pachador
    Member
    • Sep 2009
    • 130

    if you have a retail store, you can try the following based on my experiences when we still had my parents' retail store:

    1.) Raise the height of your store counter. it deters robbers specially the short ones from jumping over the counter.(yes, this is one method
    used by criminals - they just jump over the counter suddenly- this usually has a shock effect on unsuspecting store employees)

    2.) dismantle your counter wall or siding and insert a thick iron or steel plate. make it a double-layered plate. or a hide a cement wall inside the counter.

    3.) this one will cost money -- from the top of the counter to the ceiling, install a bulletproof glass wall to protect your torso. if this is impractical for your store, then you will have to start wearing a bullet-proof vest(but get one thats not obvious) or else they will aim for your head.

    4.) have at least 2 security cameras pointed at you and your counter and supplement it with 2 or more fake cameras(they have it at walmart) . the more cameras in the store the more chance the thieves will notice it.

    5.) install a secure bulletproof partition/cabinet/wall a few feet away from the counter that is roughly 3 feet wide by at least 6 feet tall. why? if a suspicious customer comes in, retreat immediately behind this partition, and just pretend to be rummaging for something( actually its your gun your looking for hidden behind this partition) while asking the customer how you can help him. if he pulls out a gun, well your already behind the partition so you can start firing while calling 911.

    6.) move your store to a location with lots of foot traffic and good lighting . its good for business and it deters thieves. getting a store because the rent is low is not a good idea if foot traffic is very low anyway.

    7.) have at least 2 push buttons in your store(under the countertop) and somewhere deeper in the back that you can push to activate a 120 decibel alarm, and/or automatically dial the security electronic box that will call the police. Check out www.x10.com .

    8.) lastly, it helps if your suspicious,combative, attentive and alert by nature. its in the genes, google it. something to do with the hunter gene. yep its true. I suppose you can also try to train or will yourself to pay more attention to each customer or person that goes near your "personal space" assuming your the laidback/relaxed type.

    9.) Another trick used by criminals who pretend to be customers is to ask your help to get something. this is really a trick to get you to leave the comfort zone of your counter. Just say "NO" and give an excuse that you have a water pot boiling in the back or watching a baby in the back or something ! if they get mad, then so what? you have the right to refuse service . if they get madder, then start retreating to your defensive partition and keep one hand on the gun(but still hidden from the customer's view). you can also start calling police to report harassment. that will almost always get the irate customer to leave.
    Last edited by pachador; 09-25-2009, 3:44 PM.

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    • #17
      StoneRoots
      Member
      • Jul 2009
      • 164

      Lot of good information there. It is very much appreciated pachador. Have a good weekend. -SR
      The only 911 I know is engraved on the slide of my 1911....
      sigpic
      Laws that forbid the carrying of arms ... disarm only those who are neither inclined nor determined to commit crimes.

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      • #18
        pachador
        Member
        • Sep 2009
        • 130

        well you can easily save bigtime on the bulletproof glass that extend to ceiling if you just get one that covers a 6 foot or 7 foot person instead of one that goes all the way to the ceiling.(its better than nothing). you can cover the remaining space between the standing glass and the ceiling with thick plywood so the criminal cannot jump over the glass. you can even just order the glass to be roughly the height or length of your torso which means you just install the glass on top of the iron/cement reinforced counter.

        You can hold the glass in place using strong wood or metal sidings on both sides of the glass without even drilling through the glass.

        Anyway, most of my suggestions was based on my experiences 15 or so years back. laws, materials/supplies keep changing.

        Originally posted by StoneRoots
        Its a high risk retail store. He wants to put in a smaller version of what some banks have, or a larger version of what some convience stores have (the safety rooms with bullet resistant glass). The landlord has authorized the right for construction and really doesn't seem to care too much as long as his rent check comes in on time.

        He wants it to look like this:

        I dont think thats anywhere realistic to his budget. But I do have friends who are skilled in construction so id really hate to bring in contractor who will charge 2-3x what the job would cost if we ordered the material and did it ourselfs. He is more concerned with small caliber (handguns). I always took my grandpops advice "Prepare for the worst and hope for the best". I cant see any other situation in which his advice would better apply. So id want something capable of stopping anything put to it, rather it be .22, .44, .500, 5.62, etc...



        Thanks again for all your help fellas. Have a great weekend,


        SR
        Last edited by pachador; 09-25-2009, 4:16 PM.

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        • #19
          dfens
          Senior Member
          • Jul 2007
          • 945

          I work in banking and the glass at the branches that have it only covers to the counter. If you shoot the counter and below it's just wood. You'd think they spend the extra dough on steel reinenforcement.

          Guess as long as everyone thinks it's safe all the way down.

          Yeah that glass is expensive I think it costs us about 50-100k have a branch have the set up you're looking for. Lots of good tips on previous posts. I would just get a vest and arm yourself, and most important be ever vigilant.

          A buddy of mine has guns all over his shop. A S&W 4inch .357 on the counter hidden out of sight/reach by a magazine or something as his primary and a mosseberg in the corner if he has to retreat/needs more firepower.

          Personally I think it's best to have it concealed on your person, too many shows I have seen the owner have to rush to where it's kept or they can't get to it at all. And make sure not to keep the safety on unless you'retrained for cocked and locked. Saw one jewelery store guy nearally lose his life in a gun fight because he forgot to turn off the safety and was shot multiple times.

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          • #20
            pachador
            Member
            • Sep 2009
            • 130

            I believe, if you install the glass at an angle, it will also help deflect the bullet instead of installing it staight up and/or maybe 3 of those fish-type glass stacked together will do the trick(??) I assume you mean the glass you see in those big public zoo/aquariums which are much thicker than the small home aquariums.

            Originally posted by StoneRoots
            Yeah, I looked into those 4x8's and they were in My friend was also telling me something about these fish tank type enclosures that are supposed to severly reduce the amount of force of a fired shot. At this point im looking at any and all options.

            Thanks again. -SR
            Last edited by pachador; 09-25-2009, 4:57 PM.

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            • #21
              Beelzy
              Calguns Addict
              • Apr 2008
              • 9224

              Originally posted by Lancear15
              .223 and above will go through 1/4 plate like butter and and the thicker you go the more expensive it gets and difficult to handle.
              Oh, believe me I know that......however unless it's SWAT coming in shooting, the plate will stop the average thug's bullets.

              (you're NOT kidding about it being hard to handle......)
              "I kill things for a living, don't make yourself one of them"

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              • #22
                bbguns44
                Senior Member
                • Oct 2006
                • 1182

                If it's a retail shop, you really don't want to make it look like a bunker.
                7-11 uses better lighting and open views to deter robbers. Do like the
                banks, insurance + bright lights + cameras. Maybe a vest if he's worried
                about getting shot.

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                • #23
                  rct442
                  Senior Member
                  • Sep 2008
                  • 708

                  This is what you need.

                  Comment

                  • #24
                    Sunwolf
                    Calguns Addict
                    • May 2008
                    • 7445

                    2x6 framing on a lower half wall filled with 3/4 inch gravel.Just built a 2x4 wall for a front porch.Stops SS109 and 7.62x39.Have not tried any pistol.Will try .308 and 30-06 next week.

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                    • #25
                      randy
                      In Memoriam
                      • Nov 2006
                      • 4642

                      Get a guy to sit in there with a shotgun.
                      I move slow but I make up for it by shooting poorly.

                      When I hit the lotto I'm only shooting factory.

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                      • #26
                        Turbinator
                        Administrator
                        CGN Contributor - Lifetime
                        • Oct 2005
                        • 11934

                        Originally posted by rct442
                        This is what you need.
                        Now, that setup is just awesome, I like it.

                        Turby

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                        • #27
                          copenhagen269
                          Member
                          • Jan 2009
                          • 341

                          Construction-Bullet Penetration Report[1].pdf

                          Heres some info on different building materials

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                          • #28
                            tango5
                            Senior Member
                            • Dec 2008
                            • 2276

                            Originally posted by Lancear15
                            Cheapest and easiest way would to build cinder block walls(w/ rebar) behind existing walls and pour concrete in them. There are also ballistic composite 4' x 8' sheets that can but put on existing walls, but that's very expensive.
                            Cinder blocks are pretty much useless for any rifle caliber. I used to take cinder blocks out to my friends property to shoot with an AK, just cuz it made some awesome exploding blocks. 1 round and it would simply explode. Fill both openings with concrete and a few bars of rebar, and it might hold together, but the bullet will still penetrate it.
                            US Army Veteran
                            1995-2003 31U Commo Chief

                            "You cannot invade mainland America. There would be a rifle behind every blade of grass" -Japanese Admiral Isoroku Yamamoto (WW2)

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                            • #29
                              Lancear15
                              Veteran Member
                              • Oct 2008
                              • 2629

                              Originally posted by rct442
                              This is what you need.

                              Where is that, Oakland?
                              Absolute power corrupts absolutely, even on Calguns.
                              NRA Life Member
                              USPSA Member
                              IDPA Member

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                              • #30
                                rct442
                                Senior Member
                                • Sep 2008
                                • 708

                                Originally posted by rct442
                                This is what you need.

                                Originally posted by Lancear15
                                Where is that, Oakland?
                                I have no clue. It's hosted on Flickr by some guy in the Bay Area.

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