Submachine guns in WWII

[aklon]

Google Type 100.

Outstanding! This is the first I'd heard of one, and even though it was only rarely used in combat (according to the article) it is an interesting piece of work. Looks like a PPsH. I wonder if it was reversed engineered after the incident at Nomonhan?

[smle-man]

In the U.S. Army in WW2 the sub gun was primarily an NCO's or specialist's weapon. The user was expected to be directing and leading or performing their technical task. The submachine gun was added muscle for CQC, wielded by a squad leader.

Most WW2 vets that I have spoken with (including my father, a corporal) had little use for the Thompson as it was way too heavy and not that reliable. The little M1 carbine was on most user's list as the perfect weapon. My dad told me that 'everyone' wanted a Jeep and a carbine when they got out of the service.

[Mojaveman]

I've read accounts of Special Forces and Seal operators using them in 'Nam.

As another member posted, the CAR-15 was superior but one of the reasons the Special Operations forces used the M-45 was because it was harder for enemy forces to identify them by what they were carrying. That would also include the sound of the weapon if fired.

[Quiet]

Thanks for that info, Quiet. I've got some reading up to do.

Here is an old picture of my dad holding an M3 SMG. I have no information about it. It looks like he is clowning around with a couple of guys somewhere, as dad was not in the military during WWII. He worked in the defense industry. Big pic so I'll just share a link to view it. https://i.imgur.com/14P1Bkm.jpg

The Guidelamp M-3A1 "grease gun" remained in US Military service until the mid-1990s.
US Army armored units were the last to give them up.

[Quiet]

It should be noted that Japan did not develop a submachine gun during WW2.

Most of the submachine guns used by Japan were bought from other countries.

The submachine guns they used were variations of the Bergmann MP-18 (made & sold by SIG during the 1920s) & Rhinemetall MP-34 (made & sold through Steyr-Solothurn during the 1930s).

Google Type 100.

Outstanding! This is the first I'd heard of one, and even though it was only rarely used in combat (according to the article) it is an interesting piece of work. Looks like a PPsH. I wonder if it was reversed engineered after the incident at Nomonhan?

Most likely it's a based off the MP-18/MP-34.

The Bergmann MP-18 was copied/upgraded by several countries.
The Lanchester Mk1 was the British copy of the MP-18
The Degtyaryov PPD series was the Soviet copy of the MP-18.
The Rhinemetall MP-34 was the product improved upgraded version of the MP-18.

The Nomonhan incident happened in 1939, which would indicate that Soviet forces would have been using the PPD series (PPD-34 and/or the PPD-34/38), not the PPSh-41.

[mossy]

let us not forget that the first few generations of Thompson's were stupidly expensive to manufacture because they were Blish lock firearms. Thompson was obsessed with the Blish lock system in his early years of firearms design and incorporated it in all his designs.

[Quiet]

let us not forget that the first few generations of Thompson's were stupidly expensive to manufacture because they were Blish lock firearms. Thompson was obsessed with the Blish lock system in his early years of firearms design and incorporated it in all his designs.

AFAIK...
Cost of the Thompson M-1928A1 was around $200.
Cost of the Reising Model 50 was around $65.
Cost of the Thompson M-1A1 was around $70.
Cost of the Guidelamp M-3A1 was around $15.

The Thompson M-1 and M-1A1 did not incorporate the Blish lock system.

[smle-man]

AFAIK...
Cost of the Thompson M-1928A1 was around $200.
Cost of the Reising Model 50 was around $65.
Cost of the Thompson M-1A1 was around $70.
Cost of the Guidelamp M-3A1 was around $15.

The Thompson M-1 and M-1A1 did not incorporate the Blish lock system.

1928A1 Thompson was 2,894 in 2018 dollars (in 1943)
M1A1 Thompson was 1,103 in 2018 dollars
Reising was 940
M3A1 was 217 and looked every penny of it.

[elSquid]

M3A1 was 217 and looked every penny of it.

Yeah, ugly as sin, but still looks cool in slo-mo.