Submachine guns in WWII

[Kokopelli]

How effective was the SMG? The "burp gun" and "Chicago Typewriter" were popular with troops. But in what manner was it most utilized? For supressive fire? What was it's intended purpose and was it utilized in combat as the inventors intended? How was it utilized in Vietnam?

[smle-man]

The Soviets equipped entire battalions with submachine guns and carried them on the backs of T34s directly into the German lines. The fire suppression of the guns was incredible.



The Germans understood how lethal the PPSH was.

[dave1947]

In my mech infantry unit in VN one of the guys had a grease gun, no idea how he got it.

[Kokopelli]

Wow! Great find! Germans with Russian guns.

[Kokopelli]

In my mech infantry unit in VN one of the guys had a grease gun, no idea how he got it.

How did he plan to use it? As a short range brush gun?

[DesertDave100]

I have only anecdotal stories I've heard, from folks who would claim to have been the actual users.

Both regard the Thompson.

I recall long ago being told it was a preferred weapon in jungle warfare when encountering tree-borne snipers.

More recently a former co-worker who'd carried a Thompson on riverine craft in Vietnam. He was able to select whatever he wanted to use, since his records show he was stationed on a destroyer. Supposedly going places we never were, doing tasks we never did.

As I understand it, it would be used for suppression fire in heavy jungle. For some reason he told me he'd cut the barrel down, removing the Cutts compensator that was originally on the muzzle.

[I Swan]

In my mech infantry unit in VN one of the guys had a grease gun, no idea how he got it.

Grease guns were sometimes issued on tanks for many years. I think one national guard armor unit had them until 2000!

[timdps]

Would not want to be on the receiving end of a PPsh. Have semi-auto Ppsh and the heavy weight of the gun makes them pretty accurate at short ranges. I'm a lousy off hand (standing) shooter. Had four clays set up at 50 yards and took them all out with four shots. Add in the high rate of fire and a 71 round drum and the fire power of a squad or platoon becomes incredible.

T

[quadmx301]

Ppsh’s are even known to have been recovered on the western & Italian fronts from units transferring from the east. Well loved by the German soldiers.

[Pofoo]

As related to me by a WWII vet of the Pacific campaign.
He was on some island and thought he was in a fairly secure area. He went off a little bit by a wide river to take a dump and brought his Thompson with him.
Squatted down and got comfortable when a sniper across the river let off a round that hit fairly close.
So, pants down, he rolled behind a downed palm tree.
A second round came right through the palm tree, again, quite close to him.
Well, being 20 yrs old, full of p&v, and carrying a devastating piece of destruction, he rose up and let loose a full magazine (20?) into the jungle across the river.
Unbelievable! Most of the rounds fell short into the river.
He then remembered that he was shooting a .45acp and the other guy had a full power rifle. He rolled over, pulled up his pants and hit the road.
Different guns for different purposes.

[colt11]

That would suck, getting shot by a sniper while on the can.

[sigstroker]

In my mech infantry unit in VN one of the guys had a grease gun, no idea how he got it.

Probably out of a blowed up tank, since that's where they were usually issued, and he was in a mech unit.

[sigstroker]

I have only anecdotal stories I've heard, from folks who would claim to have been the actual users.

Both regard the Thompson.

I recall long ago being told it was a preferred weapon in jungle warfare when encountering tree-borne snipers.

More recently a former co-worker who'd carried a Thompson on riverine craft in Vietnam. He was able to select whatever he wanted to use, since his records show he was stationed on a destroyer. Supposedly going places we never were, doing tasks we never did.

As I understand it, it would be used for suppression fire in heavy jungle. For some reason he told me he'd cut the barrel down, removing the Cutts compensator that was originally on the muzzle.

?? M1's didn't have a Cutts. They were a cheaperized, simpler version of the commercial Thompson.

[sigstroker]

It's easier to think of them in generations. First generation were expensive, machined from forgings, heavy, and complicated like the Thompson (my least favorite). Later came the simpler, cheaper, and faster to produce guns made from stampings or tubing, like the grease gun or STEN(ch) guns. After that smg's fell out of favor until the Uzi, a generation unto itself. It was compact because the bolt telescoped over the rear of the barrel. The MAC-10 also copied this feature. This generation is also made of sheetmetal stampings.

The Suomi was sort of reborn in interest because Richard Lage started making M11/9 uppers that used the Suomi coffin and drum mags so he could beat MP-5's in competition. You can also get semi-auto Suomis now, made from old parts sets.

[timdps]

Would also note that the 7.62x25 is a very hot round, pushing towards 2000 fps out of a 12" barrel. Rumored (slightly hotter) Czech ammo is 1700 fps out of a pistol.

Would not want to be on the receiving end of a PPsh. Have semi-auto Ppsh and the heavy weight of the gun makes them pretty accurate at short ranges. I'm a lousy off hand (standing) shooter. Had four clays set up at 50 yards and took them all out with four shots. Add in the high rate of fire and a 71 round drum and the fire power of a squad or platoon becomes incredible.

T