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Non lead ammo, recent studies show.........

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  • 1911man
    Senior Member
    • Jun 2006
    • 1575

    Non lead ammo, recent studies show.........

    http://www.northamericanwhitetail.co...#ixzz59MOtlBw6


    I was trying to find out if any other states are going to lead free ammo for hunting. I was told the army is going away from lead, even in war time. Do any of you know if that is true?
    Last edited by 1911man; 03-10-2018, 7:42 AM. Reason: Info
  • #2
    dustoff31
    Calguns Addict
    • Apr 2007
    • 8209

    Originally posted by 1911man
    Just found this today.

    According to HFTA’s web site, “A comparison of pre-ban and post-ban blood-lead data from condors in the “condor range” indicates that the incidence of lead exposure and poisoning in condors remains static, or has actually increased slightly! The failure of California’s lead ammunition ban to decrease lead poisoning proves that alternative sources of lead in the environment are causing lead poisoning in condors.”



    Read more: http://www.northamericanwhitetail.co...#ixzz59MOtlBw6


    I was trying to find out if any other states are going to lead free ammo for hunting. I was told the army is going away from lead, even in war time. Do any of you know if that is true?

    I thought I heard something awhile back that something like 22 states have banned lead ammo for hunting.


    The Army has been using the lead free M855A1 for some time. The Marines adopted it late last year.

    Spanning a decade-and-a-half, the process of adopting the lead-free 5.56x45 mm NATO M855A1 ball cartridge was hardly transparent. In the end, however, testing indicates that our troops ended up with a better combat round.


    The U.S. Army replaced its green-tipped 5.56x45 mm NATO, M855 standard ball cartridge in June 2010 with the lead-free, or “green,” M855A1 cartridge. Like its predecessor, the new bullet weighs 62 grains, but since its copper core is one-third lighter than lead, it is approximately 1/8 inch longer. As such, the bullet is seated deeper (and the propellant compressed) to achieve an identical cartridge overall length of 2.248 inches.
    The United States Marine Corps has finally officially announced its adoption of the 5.56mm M855A1 EPR round, developed in the late 2000s by the US Army, marking an important step towards ammunition commonality between the two services.Until now, the USMC has officially only used the legacy M855 round, and to a more limited extent the SOCOM-developed Mk.318 SOST round, refusing to adopt the US Army’s new M855A1.


    M855A1 EPR Officially Adopted By US Marine Corps
    "Did I say "republic?" By God, yes, I said "republic!" Long live the glorious republic of the United States of America. Damn democracy. It is a fraudulent term used, often by ignorant persons but no less often by intellectual fakers, to describe an infamous mixture of socialism, miscegenation, graft, confiscation of property and denial of personal rights to individuals whose virtuous principles make them offensive." - Westbrook Pegler

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    • #3
      billped
      Veteran Member
      • Oct 2009
      • 2504

      I've done some reading on this. No one has been able to find bullets or shot in the condors' digestive tracts, but have found lead paint and other lead-containing objects.

      Regardless, the lack of change in blood-lead levels combined with the massive drop in lead projectiles appears to invalidate the hypothesis that the problem is our ammo.
      Bill

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      • #4
        OCEquestrian
        Calguns Addict
        • Jun 2017
        • 6899

        Nature has made the call on the Condor... the tree huggers are just delaying the process. "Birds that eat stupid things win stupid prizes too!"
        "Extremism in defense of liberty is no vice. Moderation in pursuit of justice is no virtue." ----Sen. Barry Goldwater

        Those who would give up essential Liberty, to purchase a little temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety." ----Benjamin Franklin

        NRA life member
        SAF life member
        CRPA member

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        • #5
          Svashtar
          Senior Member
          • Apr 2017
          • 936

          Last edited by Svashtar; 03-10-2018, 9:30 AM.
          "Civil Defense Thru Civil Disobedience; Never Disarm!"

          sigpic NRA Benefactor Life Member
          NRA Certified Instructor
          CRPA Life Member

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          • #6
            G-Man WC
            In Memoriam
            • Oct 2005
            • 10991

            The lead condor ban is BS. More junk science like global warming.
            No ethical hunter gut shots a game animal and a soft tissue would be
            a bullet pass through.
            This was just an early argument and plan to erode hunting and gun rights by the left IMO.
            -g
            If ever time should come, when vain and aspiring men shall possess the highest seats in Government, our country will stand in need of its experienced patriots to prevent its ruin.
            -Samuel Adams

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            • #7
              nate76239
              Senior Member
              • May 2013
              • 1628

              Comment

              • #8
                Notpc
                Veteran Member
                • Nov 2016
                • 3459

                Come on now, it was never about the condors. It was about making it harder and more expensive for the evil hunters to purchase ammunition.
                "I've seen things you people wouldn't believe. Attack ships on fire off the shoulder of Orion. I watched C-beams glitter in the dark near the Tannhauser gate. All those moments will be lost in time, like tears in rain..."
                Roy Batty

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                • #9
                  Jimi Jah
                  I need a LIFE!!
                  • Jan 2014
                  • 18734

                  Condors are scavengers and eat trash. Broken glass is the largest problem as they are attracted to that stuff.

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                  • #10
                    CandG
                    Spent $299 for this text!
                    CGN Contributor - Lifetime
                    • Apr 2014
                    • 16970

                    Good, maybe this means I can go back to using lead shot for all my condor hunts
                    Settle down, folks. The new "ghost gun" regulations probably don't do what you think they do.


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                    • #11
                      IVC
                      I need a LIFE!!
                      • Jul 2010
                      • 17594

                      We knew this when CA was expanding "lead free zones" to the whole state. The study showing no effect was intentionally withheld until the law passed.

                      CA doesn't use any science when it comes to wildlife - from hunting bans enacted by ballot initiatives, to hiding scientific studies for political reasons. No wonder we don't have deer, pigs, elk or any other species that would normally thrive in the area.
                      sigpicNRA Benefactor Member

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                      • #12
                        IVC
                        I need a LIFE!!
                        • Jul 2010
                        • 17594

                        Also, CA "wildlife management" is based on some quasi-morality and touchy-feely imagination of how the wildlife should work. When it doesn't work, they don't care as long as they can choose not to see the consequences of their poor decisions.

                        Remember the head of DFG/DFW who went on a mountain lion hunt in *another state* where it was fully legal, only to be ousted by the local activists for "exercising poor judgment." They see it as a moral issue not to hunt mountain lions, science and law be damned...
                        sigpicNRA Benefactor Member

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                        • #13
                          FISHNFRANK
                          Senior Member
                          • Jul 2008
                          • 1029

                          I’m sure CA will repeal the law immediately....

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                          • #14
                            OCEquestrian
                            Calguns Addict
                            • Jun 2017
                            • 6899

                            Originally posted by Svashtar
                            At one time, the “California” condor ranged over most of the continental United States, Canada, and Mexico. Everyone hunted, and everyone used lead ammo, and the condors thrived on gut piles left by hunters and abundant predatory wild animals.

                            People don’t realize how much hunting was being done back when they thrived. In 1900 there were fewer than an estimated 250,000 whitetail deer in the whole country. Last I heard 10 years ago there were 30 million. Lead from gut piles didn’t do them in, it was a lack of food left behind by predators.

                            More bad info for people already predisposed to dislike firearms and hunters.


                            Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
                            Great points I had not thought of before. That said, don't be too fast to discount the stupidity of these birds I seem to recall they like to drink radiator fluid as well..
                            "Extremism in defense of liberty is no vice. Moderation in pursuit of justice is no virtue." ----Sen. Barry Goldwater

                            Those who would give up essential Liberty, to purchase a little temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety." ----Benjamin Franklin

                            NRA life member
                            SAF life member
                            CRPA member

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                            • #15
                              Notpc
                              Veteran Member
                              • Nov 2016
                              • 3459

                              Remember, it's for the animals that hunters slaughter with lead ammo.
                              "I've seen things you people wouldn't believe. Attack ships on fire off the shoulder of Orion. I watched C-beams glitter in the dark near the Tannhauser gate. All those moments will be lost in time, like tears in rain..."
                              Roy Batty

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