"Cop Killer" hand gun rounds

[RobG]

Actually some of the modern versions of helmets can defeat a rifle round. Watching the Military channel about a year ago, saw a profile on a helmet company that test fired a .308 round into the helmet at 50 yards as a demonstration for the show. Helmet contained the bullet with zero penetration or interior deformation. Nice to see innovation that works.

It may not penetrate but a 308 round at 50 yds could easily kill by the impact alone.

[nick]

Yes, but the PASGT helmet used widely by ours and others suck (and the one in the link by the OP). Ask me how I know.

How do you know?

[MrSlippyFist]

How do you know?

lol

Had many re-issued to me, some from shrapnel some from being squashed by the M113.

/DO NOT joke around with the crew-chief of a crash-hawk about tossing your helmet into the blades in order to ask for a new one.

[MrSlippyFist]

The PASGT Helmet will stop any rifle round, most commonly 7.62x39mm

I don't know who wrote up that wiki page on the PASGT helmet, because I know i've seen DOD documentation that it is only guaranteed for 9mm and below/moderate shrapnel. I guess that's why it says [citation needed] after the statement. I've got one of these that is too small for me.... perhaps a field test is in order.

[Fate]

It may not penetrate but a 308 round at 50 yds could easily kill by the impact alone.

Probably right on that point! At least you'll have a purdy corpse.

[nick]

I don't know who wrote up that wiki page on the PASGT helmet, because I know i've seen DOD documentation that it is only guaranteed for 9mm and below/moderate shrapnel. I guess that's why it says [citation needed] after the statement. I've got one of these that is too small for me.... perhaps a field test is in order.

Don't bother, I know that it doesn't stop it. Don't ask me how I know it

[MrSlippyFist]

I've been wanting to debunk the 9mm vs 5.7 myth or .223 vs 5.7, and this may help. My only concern is testing both with one helmet. I wonder if I can cut it in half down the middle and test the side, without compromising structural integrity.

[nick]

It being shot through will compromise it anyway.

[nick]

maybe, putting a sandbag in it would help?

[MrSlippyFist]

It being shot through will compromise it anyway.

I want to turn one helmet into 2 test subjects is what I meant.

[nick]

I want to turn one helmet into 2 test subjects is what I meant.

I realize that. It's just that, as I understand, they plan the stress points, etc., and so if you cut it in half, the halves are likely to have different properties than those same spots on the complete helmet.

EDIT: I'm just curious if putting a sandbag in it, which would conform to the helmet's inner shape, would provide enough support for it that it could retain similar enough properties after having been shot through.

[1lostinspace]

So you can t buy 5.7mm AP rounds as they defeat Level IIIa body armor and as a result are considered cop killer rounds.
Fair enough,

BUT what about 7.62x25mm? these round seem really hot and according to this they defeat kevlar helmets:

http://www.theboxotruth.com/docs/bot29.htm

how is it they were never made illegal? are they considered a rifle round as they fit in ppshs?

what about a 300 win Mag?
Or any other high powered rifle round?

[Sampachi]

I don't think the 5.7 AP round is actually illegal, FN just chooses not to sale it to civilians, based on the bad press it gets, it pops up from time to time for sale, but be prepared to spend about $500+ for a box of 50 rounds.

This is correct. It's a self-imposed ban. The box will say "For Law Enforcement Only" but there are no Federal laws governing it's purchase.

[MrSlippyFist]

This is correct. It's a self-imposed ban. The box will say "For Law Enforcement Only" but there are no Federal laws governing it's purchase.

I think that only the SS198LF says that on the box, but you are right - FNH has made it (SS190 and SS198LF) hard to come by simply by restricting sales.

[Max-the-Silent]

Cop killer rounds are any rounds that kill police officers. Period. Could be .22lr, could be a BB gun, could be 9mm. Sad that the term even exists, though.

Turby

Sadder still that the KTW round was invented by two cops and a prosecuter (or some other official, I'm having a senior moment) and the stuff was never readily available outside of mil/LE.

The A-hole that went public with it was Mario Biaggi, who eventually went to prison on corruption charges. It couldn't have happened to a nicer guy: