Mossberg AOW

[Capybara]

There's also the fact that MG was the same cost. Why do SBR when you can do MG, and not need an extra stamp for <16"?

That too! Boy was I short sighted, I should have been into guns more when I was a kid, I could have had so many more cool toys, even in Ca, like SBS and MGs. Things were a lot easier back then in a way.

[gunsmithcats]

Cr sbs are out there but youll be paying for them dearly.

[Capybara]

Cr sbs are out there but youll be paying for them dearly.

Yes, that's the catch 22. I want one, but I don't want one at stupid prices.

[Rogue187]

Was there a video somewhere in this tread that showed a lock box for a Serbu Shorty Shotgun?
It had a combination lock and it was made just for the Serbu.

[gunsmithcats]

In my worthless opinion capybaras aow witness protection style shotgun is the most practical of the aows. It holds 4+1 shells and with reduced recoil buck flight control is quite capable for defense. The serbu is fun but too short in capacity. The chopped size makes it hard to reload quickly. I also have a double barrel aow a la stagecoach gun and its fun for ****s and giggles but also useless. Another useful aow is a mp5k with the forward grip and a n eagle industries shoulder sling. You push out with the gun while the sling pulls back and it is quite stable and accurate to 75 yards.
Thats assuming you have a sp89 or clone to form 1.
Arent pump aows still exempt through sse? I thought they were fine because they're pump and not semi auto. I know the saiga 12aows no longer obtainable.

[gunsmithcats]

And don't forget this.

http://www.andrewsleather.com/firepower.htm

They are pistols so hopefully some rural county sheriff will let you put it on your ccw.

[Quiet]

Arent pump aows still exempt through sse? I thought they were fine because they're pump and not semi auto. I know the saiga 12aows no longer obtainable.

SSE allowed any type of action, but SSE was amended into SSE2 (which went into effect on 01-01-2015) and SSE2 requires it to be a bolt-action single-shot or break-top/open single-shot.

That said, a few CA FFL/SOT dealers/manufacturers will still transfer a slide-action or lever-action under SSE2 because "bolt-action" is not legally defined under CA laws/regulations and it can be argued that "slide/lever-action" is a type of "bolt-action".

[Capybara]

Good to know Quiet. Thanks!

[gunsmithcats]

Interesting point. I guess youhave to still manually operate the bolt to cycle the action.

[Junkie]

Yeah, not much difference between a pump and a straight pull bolt.

[RogueRat]

So I know I haven't posted a whole lot here but here is my two cents. BTW I AM NOT A LAWER, just a citizen who has read through the California penal code book trying to figure out how to legally purchase a serbu in Cali.

16530PC- Pistol/ Revolver/ Any firearm capable of being concealed upon a person. (AOW could fall under this, but AOW like the Serbu don't meet the firing requirements for handguns in Cali.)

17710PC- AOW Exemption (This PC exempts AOW from 16590PC which is generally prohibited weapons list. AOW cant fall under SBR or SBS law in California because of the shotgun definition/ rifle definition. This PC also exempts AOW from being an unconventional pistol which is 17270PC.)

17270PC- Unconventional pistol by definition must have both of these characteristics. Does not have a rifle bore and a barrel 18" or less in length or an OAL of 26" or less.

17170PC- SBR Law

17180PC- SBS Law (AOW like the Serbu doesn't meet SBS law because of how the term shotgun is defined in 17190PC.)

17190PC- Shotgun Definition (IT specificly states that "As used in sections 16530, 16640, 16870, and 17180, Sections 17720 to 17730, inclusive, section 17740, section 30215, and Article 1 (commencing with Section 33210) of Chapter 8 of Division 10 of title 4, "Shotgun" means a weapon design or redesigned, made or remade, and INTENDED TO BE FIRED FROM THE SHOULDER and design or redesigned and made or remade to use the energy of the explosive in a fixed shotgun shell to fire through a smooth bore either a number of projectiles (ball shot) or a single projectile for each pull of the trigger.) A Serbu was made from a shotgun that never had a shoulder stock on it in the first place.

31900PC- Drop Safety Requirements for Handguns (If you read through the drop safety requirements it only states revolvers or pistols. Now if you read pistols it says "For a pistol, the slide shall be release, allowing it to move forward under the impetus of the recoil spring, and an empty magazine shall be inserted." A Serbu doesn't have a recoil spring or a magazine that can be inserted so therefor the Serbu doesn't apply to this PC since it implies semi automatic pistols and revolvers.

31905PC- Firing requirements for handguns (It Specificly states that "The magazines of a tested pistol shall be identical to those that would be provided with the pistol to a retail customer.)Section e says (As used in this section, "malfunction means a failure to properly feed, fire, or eject a round, or failure of a pistol to accept or eject the magazine, or failure of a pistol's slide to remain open after the magazine has been expended.) Because of the wording, none of the Firing requirements apply to the Serbu since the PC describes semiautomatic pistols.

31910PC- Unsafe handgun (according to this PC an "unsafe pistol" means any pistol or revolver or firearm capable of being concealed upon the person, for which any of the following is true.) Revovlers don't apply to we go to section b. (1 It doesn't have a positive manual safety, 2 does not meet the firing requirements, 3 does not meet the drop safety requirements.) Well the Serbu does have a positive manual safety and neither the drop safety or the firing requirements can apply to the Serbu since it doesn't meet the Cali Penal Code descriptions.

So that leaves me to believe that they are in fact legal too own. I have spoken to some shops that do SSE2 them under handgun, but I don't know if they registuer them as a bolt action or pump since they don't meet handgun law or SBS law and are a true AOW.

[Quiet]

So I know I haven't posted a whole lot here but here is my two cents. BTW I AM NOT A LAWER, just a citizen who has read through the California penal code book trying to figure out how to legally purchase a serbu in Cali.

16530PC- Pistol/ Revolver/ Any firearm capable of being concealed upon a person. (AOW could fall under this, but AOW like the Serbu don't meet the firing requirements for handguns in Cali.)

31910PC- Unsafe handgun (according to this PC an "unsafe pistol" means any pistol or revolver or firearm capable of being concealed upon the person, for which any of the following is true.) Revovlers don't apply to we go to section b. (1 It doesn't have a positive manual safety, 2 does not meet the firing requirements, 3 does not meet the drop safety requirements.) Well the Serbu does have a positive manual safety and neither the drop safety or the firing requirements can apply to the Serbu since it doesn't meet the Cali Penal Code descriptions.

So that leaves me to believe that they are in fact legal too own. I have spoken to some shops that do SSE2 them under handgun, but I don't know if they registuer them as a bolt action or pump since they don't meet handgun law or SBS law and are a true AOW.

Any firearm that has a less than 16" barrel length is a "handgun" under CA laws. [PC 16530]

Since it's legally a "handgun", it must comply with all CA laws/regulations pertaining to handguns.

Because they are not listed on the Roster of Handguns Certified for Sale, they can only be transferred using an exemption (C&R, LEO sale, PPT, SSE2).

[RogueRat]

It does meet 16530PC but that would make it fall under 17270PC unconventional handgun which is exempted under 17710PC as an AOW. You never had to register it as a pistol but only an AOW with the old DROS system. When DOJ switched over to the new DROS system and made it all drop down menus for handgun or long gun that's when people started registering it as a SSE2 pistol. Also if it falls under the definition of a handgun, it should therefore need to have all the handgun firing requirements and safe handling requirements met too, but those don't pertain to it. BTW, is there a definitive definition if a pistol/ revolver must have a rifled bore or accept a detachable magazine somewhere in the vast penal codes?

[SOCALPIG]

Very interesting posts...maybe I'll go pick up a few judges after all!

[KING_PALM]

SSE allowed any type of action, but SSE was amended into SSE2 (which went into effect on 01-01-2015) and SSE2 requires it to be a bolt-action single-shot or break-top/open single-shot.



That said, a few CA FFL/SOT dealers/manufacturers will still transfer a slide-action or lever-action under SSE2 because "bolt-action" is not legally defined under CA laws/regulations and it can be argued that "slide/lever-action" is a type of "bolt-action".

Ding Ding Ding.


I've built
A few AOW's. They don't get any use and get sold fairly quick.... well quick enough for a form 4


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