Speaking up against the Covid Shutdown is Verboten!

[sd_shooter]

ER doctors who dared to speak up were muzzled

https://www.powerlineblog.com/archives/2020/04/was-it-something-he-said-4.php

23ABC News verified on our YouTube page that the first part of the press briefing is no longer available. We have submitted an appeal to YouTube, but have not heard back yet.

23ABC News is investigating the matter and will update as more information becomes available.

The video went viral, reaching over 5.46 million views, and sparked debate over recommendations to lift the shelter-in-place order.

[musick]

https://www.bit chute.com/video/oGVRqleTzzMi/

[FatCity67]

Same reason Facebook shut down accounts and pages related to Open Society Protests.

Dissent shall not be tolerated.

Funny how liberals become fascists when their world view is challenged.

[The War Wagon]

WHY are you SO opposed to "safety?!?!"







Ohhhhhh yeahhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh... Cos', 'MURICA!!!

[OlderThanDirt]

The tech industry can’t be trusted. Like the CNN 'Larry King' episode featuring Biden accuser's mother disappearing from the Google Play catalog. They went as far as to renumber the episodes hoping nobody would notice the missing day.

Paul Joseph Goebbels Is alive and well in the tech industry, deep state and Democratic Party. Add in a flood of H1B visa tech workers that couldn’t care less about the Constitution, and you have the perfect state propaganda tool.

Google is Evil.

[Doheny]

https://r.tapatalk.com/shareLink/topic?share_fid=17954&share_tid=1607995&share_pid=24189811&url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww%2Ecalguns%2Enet%2Fcalgunforum%2Fshowthread%2Ephp%3Fp%3D24189811&share_type=t&link_source=app

Sent from free America

[as_rocketman]

Just so there's no confusion -- while those ER doctors were presenting clear misinformation, with potential risk involved, I do not support purging their presentation. Even for a private channel with no right to access such as YouTube.

However, I would ask the group: Suppose instead of (presumably) well-meaning but incorrect health care workers, the presentation was a product of the Chinese government? How would you feel about it in that case?

[skirunman]

FB, YT, Twitter, Google and others are deleting posts that spread misinformation about the virus, whether it be cures, protocols, etc. As Rocketman points out in the below thread,

Sorry, but Rocketman's opinion is worth less than these emergency room Docs. Complete BS that Youtube would pull these videos.

[as_rocketman]

Sorry, but Rocketman's opinion is worth less than these emergency room Docs. Complete BS that Youtube would pull these videos.

On what grounds do you make the above assessment?

[stonefly-2]

On what grounds do you make the above assessment?

On the grounds that he's with Doheny on this one.

[skirunman]

On what grounds do you make the above assessment?

Your first statement in the other thread is incorrect.

"As you know, the initial models were woefully inaccurate. They predicted millions of cases of death, not of prevalence or incidence, but death; that is not materializing."

Nope. That prediction was dependent on maintaining business-as-usual. Instead what we witnessed was the most dramatic upheaval in social behavior since the Beatles. I expect everyone is familiar with this important difference by now.

There were models that predicted millions of deaths world wide even with policies in place to slow the spread, such as social distancing.

In addition, these doctors have first hand knowledge of what is going on by seeing real patients. I assume you don't, nor do I.

The bottom line is there is still a lot we don't know about this virus. What we do know is that our hospitals, especially outside of a few hospitals in NYC, have come nowhere close to being overwhelmed and will not likely in the future. Therefore, there is no rational reason to keep with the blanket shelter in place policies, especially as they are likely to cause more harm to both our public health and the economy. It is frankly ridiculous that the Bay Area is not planning to open right now with the current trends in new cases and deaths. I just spoke again to my friend Dr. Kathleen Jordan, Chief Medical Officer of St. Francis hospital group, and she is in "private" agreement with me.

[as_rocketman]

Your first statement in the other thread is incorrect.

There were models that predicted millions of deaths world wide even with policies in place to slow the spread, such as social distancing.

Oh, world-wide.

That's called "moving the goalposts," and it's a typical logical fallacy. That's not what they were referring to in the video -- and it's also not testable, since much of the world cannot lock down to the extent that we have.

No, you're wrong about that. They didn't make that statement, and the whole video is based on their extrapolation of fatality rates in the United States.

In addition, these doctors have first hand knowledge of what is going on by seeing real patients. I assume you don't, nor do I.

They work a doc-in-the-box in Fresno, and their whole spiel is based on the relative nonexistence of the panic. There's no reason to think they've seen even a single COVID-19 patient. More to the point, they are not epidemiologists, and clearly they are not data scientists.

I am a data scientist, though.

This is an ad hominem logical fallacy. My complaint about their presentation is their sub-high-school level grasp of population statistics, not about their professional credentials. That complaint is verifiable.

The bottom line is there is still a lot we don't know about this virus. What we do know is that our hospitals, especially outside of a few hospitals in NYC, have come nowhere close to being overwhelmed and will not likely in the future. Therefore, there is no rational reason to keep with the blanket shelter in place policies, especially as they are likely to cause more harm to both our public health and the economy. It is frankly ridiculous that the Bay Area is not planning to open right now with the current trends in new cases and deaths. I just spoke again to my friend Dr. Kathleen Jordan, Chief Medical Officer of St. Francis hospital group, and she is in "private" agreement with me.

Yes, most of our hospitals are holding up so far. This is in part due to a maximum effort to prevent it from happening that has cost us trillions of dollars.

There is a rational reason for shelter-in-place policies -- but here it becomes more of an opinion than a logical consequence. I've stated here since the beginning that I don't think blanket lockdowns are the answer either, but there's room for disagreement on tolerable personal and community risk.

But if you mean to argue from a balance of risks, it is vitally important to assess those risks accurately. The ER docs, in their pitch, blew it badly in that respect, and that is easily verified.

[ibanezfoo]

Just so there's no confusion -- while those ER doctors were presenting clear misinformation, with potential risk involved, I do not support purging their presentation. Even for a private channel with no right to access such as YouTube.

However, I would ask the group: Suppose instead of (presumably) well-meaning but incorrect health care workers, the presentation was a product of the Chinese government? How would you feel about it in that case?

Clever little slight there...

[as_rocketman]

Not a slight, statement of fact. See above.

[skirunman]

Yes, most of our hospitals are holding up so far. This is in part due to a maximum effort to prevent it from happening that has cost us trillions of dollars.

I'm only going to respond with two comments as I don't have time to respond in more detail and it would likely be a waste of both our time.

Your statement above is just your opinion as at this time as there is no real data to prove your claim. The shelter in place polices may have contributed 0% or 100% in the reduction in hospitalization rates, but it is all guesswork right now.

Secondly, I don't like to get in to p*ssing contents with others on this forum with regards to one's credentials nor do I like to point out other's logical fallacies as I find it takes away from the actual communication. With that said I was state champion in debate in HS, am the founder (MS Math/Comp Sci) of a data science focused startup in SF, and once stayed at a Holiday Inn.