Norinco 982 870 Copy VS. Remington 870 Express HD

[MAX100]

tankerman and CalNRA's Have teamed up. I am starting to feel like I have a price on my head for writing a review. You guys have really taken this review personal. What is your point. It shows my statements are consistent. It shows I know both gun very well because I work on them. It also shows that I agree with GUNS & AMMO magazine that the Norinco is an excellent tactical shotgun and a deal to be had.

Do you want me to give you another link you can read. It is a review I did on a excellent low cost Ceramic paint to refinish firearms.

You guys are tripping over your feet with lack of knowledge. Stay with the issues. You haven't done a very good job so far.


GC

[Paradiddle]

if you have to ask, you don't understand.

Do you shop at Walmart? Big 5? Sports Chalet? Cabellas? Turners?

[CalNRA]

Do you shop at Walmart? Big 5? Sports Chalet? Cabellas? Turners?

Hey, if you guys want to keep coming up with excuses for not buying perfectly fine American guns, there is no need to try so hard.

Step one: be cheap and start buying guns from seedy unfriendly foreign-government-owned arms makers.

step two: drive American producers to outsource products.

step three: when there are enough gun-related products everywhere from country that doesn't give a rat's behind about your rights, start making fun of those who try to buy American guns as much as possible by trying to prove that they are somehow hypocritical because the stores they shop in has huge amounts of foreign products. Guilty by association, right?

I get it. You guys like to save money regardless of principles. If you can live with them it's your freedom. It does however say much about your character. Leave me alone.

For the record, I bought ammo from walmart once or twice and never bought anything else there, got my 870 and 500 from Big 5, never bought anything from Cabelas or Turners, don't know what the fudge Sports Chalet is.

[vinny_land]

Since when does Sport Chalet carry guns in stock???

[CalNRA]

It shows you as being a dealer pushing his products in various forums posing as a private reviewer, while claiming to not be a dealer or having a vested interest in pushing positive reviews of the Norinco guns, which are just shameless copies of an otherwise proven American design, and try to taint its image with comments designed to denigrate the 870's proven reputation. You are a FFL in South Carolina that (at least up to recently) sold the Norincos, and now you are pushing the product you sell on GLock Talk, SHotgun NEws, High Road, and now Calguns, while claiming to be just someone who "knows it".

You claimed to not be a dealer, and after Tankerman called you on that with your own posts, you are again claiming to be a victim by saying you are "just giving a review".

Did I miss anything?

You like the Norinco that much? Move to China and enjoy it there.

tankerman and CalNRA's Have teamed up. I am starting to feel like I have a price on my head for writing a review. You guys have really taken this review personal. What is your point. It shows my statements are consistent. It shows I know both gun very well because I work on them. It also shows that I agree with GUNS & AMMO magazine that the Norinco is an excellent tactical shotgun and a deal to be had.

Do you want me to give you another link you can read. It is a review I did on a excellent low cost Ceramic paint to refinish firearms.

You guys are tripping over your feet with lack of knowledge. Stay with the issues. You haven't done a very good job so far.


GC

Sigh, I'm done with this "thread", you guys can keep discussing how much you all love Norinco guns, it's seems to be all America is headed these days, where gun owners don't take pride in their country's products anymore.

[tankerman]

Do you want me to give you another link you can read. It is a review I did on a excellent low cost Ceramic paint to refinish firearms.



GC

I saw that review already no need to post.
My Google translator would not work proerly on the Japanese websites where your "handle" showed up

[MAX100]

CalNRA Go back and read my posts #32 and #70. Post #32 states that I am a FFL dealer and Post #70 I say that I use to sale these guns in the past and I haven't had any in stock in a while. I don't have any in stock right now but I would like to get my hands on more of them. I want another one to keep for myself. On Glock talk people were asking me were to get one and I referred them to Big 5 and Buds Gun Shop. I don't have any for sale.



GC

[Paradiddle]

Hey, if you guys want to keep coming up with excuses for not buying perfectly fine American guns, there is no need to try so hard.

Step one: be cheap and start buying guns from seedy unfriendly foreign-government-owned arms makers.

step two: drive American producers to outsource products.

step three: when there are enough gun-related products everywhere from country that doesn't give a rat's behind about your rights, start making fun of those who try to buy American guns as much as possible by trying to prove that they are somehow hypocritical because the stores they shop in has huge amounts of foreign products. Guilty by association, right?

I get it. You guys like to save money regardless of principles. If you can live with them it's your freedom. It does however say much about your character. Leave me alone.

For the record, I bought ammo from walmart once or twice and never bought anything else there, got my 870 and 500 from Big 5, never bought anything from Cabelas or Turners, don't know what the fudge Sports Chalet is.

So with your long winded post you are telling us honestly that you don't shop ANYWHERE that imports products? guns, camp chairs, propane, batteries, food, clothes, etc. IT ALMOST ALL COMES FROM OUTSIDE OF THE US.

I'm not defending non-us guns - however my CZ75 is, IMO better then any domestic made 9mm. I'm saying that it is an ignorant position to say "buy American or you aren't a true American".

Our government sold us out years ago - you can try to live in this country on only domestic made products, but two things will happen - 1 you won't have any money left over after buying a pair of pants, and 2 you won't have many options to shop.

Grow up and move on. Lets talk about the comparison between these two shotguns (neither of which I own by the way - I have a Ithaca and a High Standard - doesn't get much more "Merican" then that!)

[dadoody]

GC

I would totally buy that if I wasn't already into my mossberg 590.

[MAX100]

The Mossberg 590 an excellent shotgun for a very good price. Stay with it.


GC

[Stormfeather]

well, lets stir the pot a little bit shall we? My experience is as follows. . . .

I own the Rem 870, 1100, 11-87
I own the Mossy 500, 590a1
I own Winchester Defender
I own the Nornico 97 Trench Gun

.Mil went with the Mossberg 590a1 due to durability, as per. . . Before there was light-kicking "tactical" buckshot, the U.S. Armed Services established Mil-Spec shotgun requirements, a brutal and unforgiving torture test with 3,000 rounds of full power buckshot. Only one pump action shotgun was heavy duty enough to pass. . . ." USMC went with the benelli, because they wanted semi-auto with durability. Benelli is not american made, btw, just in case you didnt know. They got rid of the 870 because of lack of durability over time with extreme use. Go to any LEO range and watch what happens with the 870's that are in use with that agency. Pieces of junk. I personally watched a 870 barrel launch out of a 870 when a SD cadet took a shot with it. Not comforting to see.
I love all of my shotguns, and put them all to use. Does it make me any less of an american because I shoot a non-american shotgun? Think again. If by going by that mindset, then we need to condemn the US military for using a FN m249, made in Belguim, Benelli shotgun made in Italy, etc etc. If you say you only buy american, then you are either blind, or a fool. Who do you think makes the packaging for those foods you eat, the ink that goes into printing the labels, the steel that is used for the basis of those "american made guns", the computer you are currently reading this thread about. The US as a whole has very little manufacturing in comparison to China.
Overall, I enjoy my Norincos, Ive got the Norinco Dragunov, Norinco m14, the Mak90, Norinco Uzi, a few 1911's, and the trench gun. All are great guns and I have had no issues with them whatsoever. All of them purchased pretty cheaply as far as that goes, and yet look at their values now. I got my Dragunov for $600, want to guess what it will sell for now? Around $3500. Go figure. Now that being said, Ive got Remys, and Winchesters, that have held their value and appreciated in value as well.
The OP is stating his opinion on the value and dependability of a certain firearm. Its ok to disagree with him, but disagree on the topic, not on some tangent that you choose to go off on. Because of the hotly debated subject of this gun, you can pretty much guarantee next time I see one of them, I may very well buy it. If I do, I will give a no****ter opinion of it and how well it works.

[MAX100]

Stormfeather-- So well said.


GC

[tankerman]

Stormfeather-- So well said.


GC

I must have missed the part where he said your Norincos were any better than the Remingtons.

[elSquid]

well, lets stir the pot a little bit shall we?

.Mil went with the Mossberg 590a1 due to durability, as per. . . Before there was light-kicking "tactical" buckshot, the U.S. Armed Services established Mil-Spec shotgun requirements, a brutal and unforgiving torture test with 3,000 rounds of full power buckshot. Only one pump action shotgun was heavy duty enough to pass. . . ."

My understanding is that the 870 was never submitted for testing.

They got rid of the 870 because of lack of durability over time with extreme use. Go to any LEO range and watch what happens with the 870's that are in use with that agency. Pieces of junk. I personally watched a 870 barrel launch out of a 870 when a SD cadet took a shot with it. Not comforting to see.

What failed on the cadet's 870?

My turn to stir the pot:

http://www.forcerecon.com/strongmenarmed3.htm

"The Remington 870 is preferred, mainly for its durability. The Mossbergs, while possessing a more accessible safety, are also equipped with a weak trigger group, and this has reportedly caused it to be replaced Marine Corps wide twice."



-- Michael

[tankerman]

http://www.forcerecon.com/strongmenarmed3.htm

-- Michael

Interesting read, thanks