problems with 1897 and snap caps

[SDgarrick]

Picked up some snap caps, the clear variety made by "traditions". I loaded them in my 1897 and they'll load alright, but when I bring the slide forward the hammer won't drop. I assume there is a dimensional problem with the snap cap, and that the bolt won't go into full battery.

anyone experience this problem? should I exchange the snap caps for others.?
suggestions?

[bjl333]

Have you fired the gun before ??? Assuming you have fire the weapon before then I would say something is wrong with the snap caps. If you haven't fire it before then there might be something off on your gun.

PS. Is the safety off ??

[wyattearp]

How far out of battery is the bolt? Most likely your 1897 has a 2 5/8" chamber and the snap caps may be too long.

1897's do not have a safety.

[SDgarrick]

Well, here is what I have gathered:

1.I know it will handle 2 3/4 shells, as I have shot many with no problems and no deformity to the shell and further the snap cap is a bit shorter than 2 3/4

2. when I load a snap cap, the slide cannot be pushed fully forward and as an 1897 feature, the trigger will not set and the hammer won't drop...though I'm sure there is a more precise explanation.

It seems that there might be a dimensional problem with the snap cap, as it won't allow me to push the forend to the position it needs to be in order to fire. I'm fairly certain its not the firearm as it runs like a top. I suppose I'll try and pick up some new snap caps, or make some of my own.

Anyone else ever experience this with this model?

thanks all

[ke6guj]

Well, here is what I have gathered:

1.I know it will handle 2 3/4 shells, as I have shot many with no problems and no deformity to the shell and further the snap cap is a bit shorter than 2 3/4

a 2.75" shotgun shell is around 2.25" long unfired, not 2.75". A 2.75"
shell will probably fit in a 2 5/8" chamber and fire, but it is not designed to do so and will cause excessive pressure. I've heard that 3" shells will sometimes fit in 2.75" chambers, but look out

You say it is a bit shorter than 2.75", how much shorter?

It seems that there might be a dimensional problem with the snap cap, as it won't allow me to push the forend to the position it needs to be in order to fire. I'm fairly certain its not the firearm as it runs like a top. I suppose I'll try and pick up some new snap caps, or make some of my own.

have you compared it against a standard 2.75" unfired shell?

[wyattearp]

Try dropping the snap cap directly into the chamber of a modern shotgun with a known 2 3/4" chamber. Then do the same with your 97. If it seats fully in the modern gun but not your 97, then your 97 chamber is short. Like was said above, 2 3/4" shells will usually chamber in an older short-chambered gun, but can cause a high pressure situation to develop because the crimp will be restricted from opening fully, forcing the shot and wad out through a smaller opening. Again, 2 3/4" is the length of a fired shell, not a new, crimped one.

[tonelar]

what's your 97 serial number start with? of my three; only 1 had a 2 3/4 chamber the other two had to have their short chambers taken out to 2 3/4. also is yours a take down model or solid frame?

[SDgarrick]

a 2.75" shotgun shell is around 2.25" long unfired, not 2.75". A 2.75"
shell will probably fit in a 2 5/8" chamber and fire, but it is not designed to do so and will cause excessive pressure. I've heard that 3" shells will sometimes fit in 2.75" chambers, but look out

You say it is a bit shorter than 2.75", how much shorter?


have you compared it against a standard 2.75" unfired shell?

well I busted out the trusty protractor, and wouldn't you know it, my 2 3/4 buckshot rounds are indeed not 2 3/4, more like 2 3/8. The snap cap is just under 2", but i don't care to count hash marks. all my measurements were from just before the rim.

I loaded a snap cap in a single shot 12 gauge, and it functioned well, it wasn't as smooth on lockup as a real shell, but it closed, fired and ejected well. also, I single loaded snap caps into the 1897 and the forend wouldn't come all the way forward, though it ejected fiercely. this leads me to believe that my shotgun ( solid frame, manufacture 1904) is at fault.

I find this conclusion odd, it won't load a nearly 2" shell, but it will easily load standard 2 3/4 shells. I suppose stranger things have happened.

as for the 2 5/8 chamber, I've read at length about these and about some people having the forcing cone lengthened, can anyone direct me toward a competent smith that operates in the Bay Area? I'd love to reduce recoil while increasing the longevity of this firearm. cheers.

[tonelar]

bring it to Frank at Tabor's (in San Bruno).
He's backlogged, but makes exceptions for cowboy guns like the 97.

[Utha Schleigle]

I made a camber measuring caliper. Some shotgun manufactueres in the early days made their shotguns to only shoot their shell. So the chamber lipp recess may have to be measured. Get a already fired empty shell and see if it will chamber. If not cut it down to 2.5, then 2.25, then 2inches, then just the base.

http://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/showthread.php?t=90691&highlight=caliper+chamber+length

[Utha Schleigle]

On the force-cone or chamber length - 2 and 5/8 going 2 and 3/4 probably OK with a short chamber forcing cone. Then only standard pressure rounds.

The shorter chamber force-ing cone if well shaped and smothly lapped will work. Lengthen-ing both chamber and chamber force-ing cone may get into a thinner part of the chamber-wall AND no good. The narrel force-ing cone take that shot and wadding at a higher speed than the chamber force-ing cone.

Get a very seasoned SHOT GUN gunsmith for this. Discuss pros and cons with gunsmith. Look at his/her work get refferences. You may have to shipped the gun to Kentucky to get reworked.

I say this as a HACKSAW garage gunhacker.