Mauser 98 identification help

[portegee]

I just picked up a couple of good looking 98 and would like a little help ID'ing them. I'm bran spanking new to the C&R craze and starting to really appreciate the older rifles. Here's some pics I appreciate any help sorry about the size of them I'm still a little new to the posting pics thing

[Mssr. Eleganté]

It looks like a German Kar.98a that has been sporterized, rebarreled, reblued. The date of manufacture and factory are probably marked on the receiver under the scope base. Is the new barrel in .270 Winchester?

[Milsurp Collector]

It is a sporterized and refinished Kar98a. Here is what it looked like originally.




The Kar98a was produced during World War I to provide a shorter, handier rifle for cavalry, artillerymen, etc. However, its handiness compared to the standard Gewehr 98 battle rifle made it popular with front line troops in the trenches. By the end of World War I the Kar98a accounted for approximately 40% of German rifle production.

Unlike the Gewehr 98 and later K98k the Kar98a uses a "small ring" receiver that is narrower than the Gew98 and K98k.

Top to bottom: 1916 DWM Gewehr 98, 1918 Danzig Kar98a, 1935 ERMA K98k.

[portegee]

thanks for the replies it is a 270 win. That brings up another question, being that it is a small ring would it be okay to use factory ammo in this or not. I hear that the small ring is supposed to be weaker?

[Mssr. Eleganté]

thanks for the replies it is a 270 win. That brings up another question, being that it is a small ring would it be okay to use factory ammo in this or not. I hear that the small ring is supposed to be weaker?

When you hear about small ring Mauser actions being weaker, people are probably referring to the pre-1898 small ring actions. A small ring 98 action like that of the Kar98a is easily strong enough for .270 Winchester.

[glennsche]

It is a sporterized and refinished Kar98a. Here is what it looked like originally.




The Kar98a was produced during World War I to provide a shorter, handier rifle for cavalry, artillerymen, etc. However, its handiness compared to the standard Gewehr 98 battle rifle made it popular with front line troops in the trenches. By the end of World War I the Kar98a accounted for approximately 40% of German rifle production.

Unlike the Gewehr 98 and later K98k the Kar98a uses a "small ring" receiver that is narrower than the Gew98 and K98k.

Top to bottom: 1916 DWM Gewehr 98, 1918 Danzig Kar98a, 1935 ERMA K98k.

i love that pic of the k98a, how cool is that! the stacking hook is great.

its not quite as aesthetically pleasing as the k98 of later years, but that is super cool.

crap now i have to get 2 more german rifles... .sigh...

[Milsurp Collector]

thanks for the replies it is a 270 win. That brings up another question, being that it is a small ring would it be okay to use factory ammo in this or not. I hear that the small ring is supposed to be weaker?

The Kar98a was designed to use the 8x57mm IS cartridge. The maximum European standard pressure for that round is 56,564 psi (SAAMI spec is 35,000 psi for safety in pre-98 rifles). The SAAMI spec for 270 Winchester is 65,000 psi, so I would not use maximum power 270 Winchester rounds in that rifle.

[Milsurp Collector]

http://www.flickr.com/photos/drakegoodman/3194638291/

[glennsche]

cool photo.

yeah, unlike in ww2, the eastern front was the place to be in ww1 if you were german. a war of movement instead of static trenches, acceptable losses instead of horrific attrition, and victory after victory.

no wonder they thought they could do it again in ww2 when they had tanks and were fighting a russian govt that seemed even weaker than the czar; they did it before, why not do it again?

[glennsche]

just checked GB...not a SINGLE K98a for sale??!?! wth? are they really that much rarer?

[Milsurp Collector]

just checked GB...not a SINGLE K98a for sale??!?! wth? are they really that much rarer?

The Treaty of Versailles limited Germany to only 84,000 Gew98 and 18,000 Kar98a http://en.wikisource.org/wiki/Treaty...cks_Authorized

"Within two months from the coming into force of the present Treaty German arms, munitions and war material, including anti-aircraft material, existing in Germany in excess of the quantities allowed, must be surrendered to the Governments of the Principal Allied and Associated Powers to be destroyed or rendered useless." http://en.wikisource.org/wiki/Treaty..._V#Article_169

So under the terms of the treaty millions of Gew98 and Kar98a were destroyed. That's why you don't see too many for sale.

By the way, when evaluating a Kar98a make sure it has the correct type bolt, even if the bolt doesn't match the rifle. The Kar98a bolt knob is flattened and knurled on the bottom.

[portegee]

Like this This gun also has a double set trigger I don't think this is original but does it make it more valuable or less, I would like to make this into a deer/pig hunting riffle but if I can't use factory ammo I might have to go a different route

[Milsurp Collector]

I would like to make this into a deer/pig hunting riffle but if I can't use factory ammo I might have to go a different route

If you handload you can make ammo that is under the pressure limit.

.270 WINCHESTER
REM. CASE; REM. 9 1/2 PR
NOSLER 130 GR. PARTITION
.277" DIA.; 24" BBL.; 3.250" C.O.L.
SR 4759 27.5 2260 51300
IMR 3031 45.5 2945 51700
IMR 4064 48.0 3030 51200
IMR 4895 46.0 2945 52000
IMR 4320 45.5 2880 51400
IMR 4350 55.0 3075 51100
IMR 4831 56.5 3080 51200
IMR 7828 60.0C 3140 52000

.270 WINCHESTER
REM. CASE; REM. 9 1/2 PR
REM. 150 GR. SPCL
.277" DIA.; 24" BBL.; 3.250" C.O.L.
SR 4759 26.0 2045 51600
IMR 3031 42.0 2690 51800
IMR 4064 47.0 2770 51800
IMR 4895 44.0 2715 52000
IMR 4320 44.5 2700 51000
IMR 4350 53.5 2920 51800
IMR 4831 55.0 2920 51400
IMR 7828 59.0C 2985 51000

[portegee]

Thank you for the load data, if you don't mind telling me which book are you using to get those loads, I have another mauser in 7mm rem mag that I will be reloading for as well. I will try to get some pics of it I believe it is a large ring 98 but not sure on the manufacture

[Milsurp Collector]

Thank you for the load data, if you don't mind telling me which book are you using to get those loads, I have another mauser in 7mm rem mag that I will be reloading for as well. I will try to get some pics of it I believe it is a large ring 98 but not sure on the manufacture

http://www.imrpowder.com/pdf/IMR_rifle.pdf