Really interested in Enfields

[Pthfndr]

thanks for all the input guys, how much does one of these no.4 rifles w/ micrometer sight run for let's say good-> mint condition in terms of barrel and crown?

These 2 places will generally have the highest quality rifles. Simpson is an importer and his prices are at the top end of what you can expect to pay. Bdl ltd. specializes in British rifles. His prices are in the mid to upper end, but you get what you pay for based on my experience with him. Good to do business with also. So use those as the upper end for pricing. Look at what they have so you can compare to other stuff you look at.

http://www.simpsonltd.com/index.php?cPath=350_351_360&osCsid=0ea58e8ae2642ddc70bd182ca6241f05

http://www.bdlltd.com/mil_sale.htm

and how hard is it to bed the rifle? DIY or smith work?

i really liked how smooth the bolt was and the 10 round magazine

Enfields and SMLEs don't bed like "normal" rifles. Look at my first pic. Behind the bolt handle you can see a large steel ring around the wrist of the stock. That's part of the receiver. Fine tuning of the accuracy of an Enfield is done by playing around with shimming under the end of the barrel to pre load it.

The No4 Mk2 was the last generation of the Enfield. They are generally considered to have the best trigger. The way it was mounted was changed from the Mk1.

There's a reason the Enfield is called "the best battle rifle" against the Mauser action rifles. It's reasonably accurate (a good one can be very accurate), very fast to operate the bolt, and incredibly reliable, with good sights.

[Milsurp Collector]

There's a reason the Enfield is called "the best battle rifle" against the Mauser action rifles. It's reasonably accurate (a good one can be very accurate), very fast to operate the bolt, and incredibly reliable, with good sights.

I have two Savage No. 4s, one with the flip rear sight and one with a micrometer sight. One of the reasons they kind of leave me cold is that one of them consistently jams and has failures to feed, both rim-over jams and just plain failure to feed. It probably has a bad magazine but I just can't get it to work right. None of my other rifles has problems like that, the Mosins, USGI rifles, Mausers, and Arisakas feed reliably. The Enfields seem very fussy about being loaded just right to avoid a rim-over jam (and I use the proper technique of keeping my thumb to the rear) while the Mosins that also use a rimmed cartridge don't have that problem. If I had to go into battle with any of my current rifles that Enfield would be my last choice. The other No. 4 is better but not flawless and my Mk I*** feeds reliably, but that one Savage No. 4 is just fussy and unreliable. I want to like it (I have an affinity for British cars) but I don't have confidence in it. Any suggestions?

[Eddie1965]

If you load it with stripper clips you have to stagger the rims in the clip, round #2 sits on #1 and #3's rim and $4 sits on #3 and #5's rim. I used to have this problem until I started to load my clips in this fashion.

[Milsurp Collector]

If you load it with stripper clips you have to stagger the rims in the clip, round #2 sits on #1 and #3's rim and $4 sits on #3 and #5's rim. I used to have this problem until I started to load my clips in this fashion.

Yeah, I tried that _--_--_ still get rim-over jams.

[Pthfndr]

I have two Savage No. 4s, one with the flip rear sight and one with a micrometer sight. One of the reasons they kind of leave me cold is that one of them consistently jams and has failures to feed, both rim-over jams and just plain failure to feed. It probably has a bad magazine but I just can't get it to work right. None of my other rifles has problems like that, the Mosins, USGI rifles, Mausers, and Arisakas feed reliably. The Enfields seem very fussy about being loaded just right to avoid a rim-over jam (and I use the proper technique of keeping my thumb to the rear) while the Mosins that also use a rimmed cartridge don't have that problem. If I had to go into battle with any of my current rifles that Enfield would be my last choice. The other No. 4 is better but not flawless and my Mk I*** feeds reliably, but that one Savage No. 4 is just fussy and unreliable. I want to like it (I have an affinity for British cars) but I don't have confidence in it. Any suggestions?

It definitely sounds like a magazine problem.

First I would make sure your magazines are fully seated in the bottom metal. Take it out and put it back in and make sure you give it a hard whack so you hear the magazine release click into place. If it is not locking in there are 2 things to check. 1) The feed lips might be bent "up" preventing the magazine from locking into place, and 2) The cut outs in the bottom of the receiver for the rear magazine lips (these can be seen through the mag well with the mag removed) might have some hardened cosmoline in them that preventing the magazine from seating fully.

If the magazine is in fact seating completely, load one round and see if it feeds ok. If it does, then load 2 rounds and check feeding.

If it feeds one of the rounds but not the other it could be the rear feed lip on the malfunctioning side is bent down too far and the bolt is not stripping it properly (you can see if the bolt is catching the back of the case if you look when you go to chamber a round).

It could also be a weak mag spring or damaged follower. Numrich lists them for $11.15

http://www.gunpartscorp.com/catalog/Products.aspx?catid=11954

Have you tried swapping mags with your other Enfields?

[motojosh]

Enfield Magazine Tuning

This site may help you with your magazine problems http://towhichireplied.blogspot.com/...feed-lips.html

-Josh

[Pthfndr]

This site may help your with your magazine problems http://towhichireplied.blogspot.com/...feed-lips.html

-Josh

Great info. That's worth book marking.

[campperrykid]

This ring true:

5 round group with a fouling shot (intentionally low) with a #4mk2 and S&B ball; 100 yds from a bench. A #4 in good shape, properly bedded with quality ammo is a very accurate rifle.

Also:

the 1917 and the P14 cock on closing not on opening unless a Numrich conversion was installed in the bolt. The standard sight for the #4 series is the Mk1 click adjustable sight. The two position peep was a WW2 expedient. The stamped adjustable sight was another WW2 expedient retained by Long Branch for post war production.

The very first pre-ban rifle that I ever ownered was a #4 , still in the grease from rebuild . It would shoot similar groups with Canadian N/C milsurp ball.
GCA-68 banned the importing of all military surplus guns , including bolt actions from Canada.
It took Congress almost 20 years to repeal some of the most useless provisions of GCA-68. Better late than never.

Fight smart and keep winning.

[Springfield45]

The M1917 ( Enfield) is superior to the Lee Enfields. It cocks on the opening, 1s 30-06 caliber and has vastly superior sights. There is a 303 British version called the P14. These guns were built on stolen patents from Mauser and are the basis for the modern Remington 700 rifles. I have several, one sporterized to 458 Win Mag. The 1917 was the most common rifle with the US troops in the WW1 battlefields.

The U.S. rifle caliber .30 Model of 1917 (or wrongly called the American Enfield) cocks on closing just like British Enfields unless you put a after-market kit in it. This was a hold over feature of the P14 rifles made for the British. The only difference between the P14 and the M1917 was mainly caliber. Most WW1 American soldiers did not like this because it was not like the 1903s and 1898 Krags that cocked on opening that they were familiar with.

To be Completely technical ALL bolt action rifles Half cock on opening.

Mauser's patents were copied but at the out break of WW1 they were no longer binding between waring nations. The British were free to use it as they wished. The US government did pay royalties to Mauser for the Springfield 1903 until WW1 started for the same reason.

M1917's were made by the thousands (over 2 million) by Remington, Eddystone (owned by Remington), and Winchester from 1917 to 1918.

[The Custard Pirate]

A couple of points: SMLE-mans Enfield is not typical. I've owned four or five and none of them would group 3 in. at 100 yards The wartime No.4s usually have chambers so oversized that cases only last for a couple of reloads. The P14 is the most accurate of all so if you are determined to shoot .303 get one of them. The also come with the micrometer sight and are a little heavier making them more comfortable to shoot. After that my preference would be for a No.1 Mk III. At least their chambers are normal.

[smle-man]

I have a #4 LB 2 groove barrel that shoots almost as well. Condition is everything.

[smle-man]

A couple of points: SMLE-mans Enfield is not typical. I've owned four or five and none of them would group 3 in. at 100 yards The wartime No.4s usually have chambers so oversized that cases only last for a couple of reloads. The P14 is the most accurate of all so if you are determined to shoot .303 get one of them. The also come with the micrometer sight and are a little heavier making them more comfortable to shoot. After that my preference would be for a No.1 Mk III. At least their chambers are normal.

The #4s made in wartime in the UK had hasty manufacturing going against fine accuracy. The wood was frequently uncured and the barrel rifling spud started out oversize and then wore down to sometimes past minimum standards in the desire to maximize production and minimize costs. After all the thought was the rifles wouldn't last a year in combat before they were lost, damaged, or had to be withdrawn and rebuilt. Who cared if they shot 1" or 3"? Keep in mind the standard cleaning equipment for the Brits was a piece of window screen mesh attached to a length of twine so barrel condition wasn't a prime wartime concern! #4s made at Long Branch and Savage/Stevens exhibited fine accuracy and #4s rebuilt or produced post WW2 are capable of the accuracy that my #4mk2 shoots. A lot of the #4s floating around the U.S. now came from third world nations where weapons care wasn't a well learned soldier skill. A #4 has greater accuracy potential than a #1; the #4 has a stiffer receiver, heavier barrel and fewer bedding issues. The #1 has the reverse. I won't argue about the P14 though. Even a worn example with a tight muzzle will be a 1" shooter @ 100 yds all day long. I think I'll take the P14 to the range on my next go!

[Springfield45]

I have a No. 4 Mk 1 POF made in 6/1943. It exhibits most of the war time crudeness of manufacture. I bought it from SOG. I think this batch of Enfields came from somewhere in the middle east. It had a peace of rope still tide to it for a make shift sling. I have replaced some of its parts to restore it to a condition the British would have issued it in. I guess I am lucky because it is one of the most accurate surplus rifles I own.

[jcaoloveshine]

hmmm now the p14 is looking really interesting, how much can one of these in good condition run for?

[steelrain82]

IMO the enfield is one of the best rifles around. I love my no4