Need help evaluating and analyzing some really old guns

[caliguy93]

Is there any demand for these rifles? Dude is willing to part with them rather quickly

[mrvkamp]

There absolutely is demand for them regardless of exactly what they turn out to be.

My best advice advice would be that you get them into the hands of someone that truly knows what it is they're looking for and at. It's often something that you might think is an insignificant detail which turns out to substantially affect the value.

If you have a local gun shop that deals in antiques, or one which caters to the Cowboy Action Shooting crowd, I'm sure they could either help you out, or would know who could.

[pitfighter]

I'm in there once a week pit if you want me to look for something in particular. PAX

Thank you - Love 'em - but, I'm on the wrong side of the world for a little while longer.

[saki302]

Trapdoor carbine pricing is all over the place. I'm not enough of an expert to tell you which ones are more valuable.

I have a cheapie I got for next to nothing, but it needed restoration with some new parts. Ex MGM studio gun which looked like it led a pretty hard life as far as the lock parts go- barrel is nice It had a replacement lock plate which looked like someone made it, plus a bridle with metal plates. I sold the made-up parts for cheap, but should have kept it for laughs. It was good from 10 feet- movie good, I guess.

[IrishJoe3]

Caliguy, the breach door is easily removed and interchanged, so the date stamped on the door is not necessarily the model date.

Look at the end of the stock under the barrel, can you tell if there's been any modifications done? You're specifically looking for a wood plug. A tell-tale sign of a cutdown rifle stock is where a dowel is inserted into the ramrod hole, then cut/sanded flush to make a carbine stock. A true carbine stock is solid and will not be drilled for a ramrod.

As mentioned, is there a saddle ring on the left side?

How's the bore? Trapdoors are blackpowder, and odds are good it will be very pitted due to someone not cleaning it properly over the last 130 years. Mine had major pitting just beyond the chamber.

PM me the serial and I'll look up the date /model in my reference material.

I'm local to you and have an 03 and COE, I'm curious what your friend is looking to get for the carbine.

[DRoberts12345]

I just put 2 kids through collage. That might pay the books for the first year.

[caliguy93]

Finnaly got the serial for the Springfield..looks like June 1883

[caliguy93]

Got the 2 rifles in my possession.

The Springfield has a “C” marked on the rear sight. The barrel is 22” and is .73 at the muzzle. There is no wood plug on the forearm. No cleaning kit in the butt. There is a “US” stamping on the butt plate top side. It is stamped model 1873. There is a saddle ring on the left side.

Any idea what this gun may be worth?

[mrvkamp]

Well, it sounds like you're off to a good start. Those are all good indicators that you most likely have a genuine carbine.

I think you'll find that $1200 - $1500 (+/- ) covers the majority of genuine carbines in serviceable condition.

Now, that being said, additional factors would include condition of the bore, condition of remaining original finish (blue and case colors), condition of the Master Armorer's cartouche and firing proof cartouche (or lack thereof). Does the cartouche date match the serial number date? Has the stock been cleaned / sanded / had additional finish been applied? Overall mechanical condition (how tightly does it lock up?) to name a few.

As you get closer to the 2K mark (and especially over), you're usually looking at guns that have an increasingly high percentage of remaining finish, a spectacular bore, and more and more "correct" parts. Every single part on that trapdoor had multiple types and variations produced, and most of these guns were subjected to many trips to the armory over the years. They weren't concerned about keeping anything original. They only wanted to get the weapon back in service. And once you get to the higher grades, every nuance is nitpicked.

If you're able to provide any provenance as to where it's been (especially going back to it's government days) that can definitely affect the value.

I realize this is a long answer to a seemingly simple question, but there's a reason that entire books have been written about these.

[caliguy93]

Some more photos