Garand Abuse

[GM4spd]

Another reason not to shoot reloads thru a "gas" gun. Makes you wonder
who is beside you at the range with reloads and his homemade semi/auto
rifle where he has tuned the trigger with a 3lb pull. Pete

[tankerman]

95% of people working in gunshops are retards.

It's the gunowners responsibility to know what it is safe and what's not safe to do with his firearm. It's irresposonsible to defer to a guy behind the gun counter........How do you know his qualifications and expertise? Because he works in a gunshop? That's poor judgement.

This man went to the gun shop and asked for ammo for his Garand. The "expert" behind the counter sold him the rounds assuring him they were good to shoot in the rifle. His added assurance was that he shot some of the same re-loads he was selling in his own Garand. The owner of the Garand bought the gun 2nd hand with no manual. When we have a question or a problem with a gun where do we go? The gun shop. They wouldn't steer us wrong, right? This is a guy with a new rifle looking for help answers and ammo, he went to the gun shop and was sold ammo he should not have used. We all learned from this one, instead of beating up on this guy, give him some slack, the fact that he spilled his gutts about his mis-fortune on-line, maybe saving some else's limbs or life is a tribute to him. And the guy that sold him the ammo telling him it was good to go?

[Paratus et Vigilans]

This man went to the gun shop and asked for ammo for his Garand. The "expert" behind the counter sold him the rounds assuring him they were good to shoot in the rifle. His added assurance was that he shot some of the same re-loads he was selling in his own Garand. The owner of the Garand bought the gun 2nd hand with no manual. When we have a question or a problem with a gun where do we go? The gun shop. They wouldn't steer us wrong, right? This is a guy with a new rifle looking for help answers and ammo, he went to the gun shop and was sold ammo he should not have used. We all learned from this one, instead of beating up on this guy, give him some slack, the fact that he spilled his gutts about his mis-fortune on-line, maybe saving some else's limbs or life is a tribute to him. And the guy that sold him the ammo telling him it was good to go?

Sorry, but not knowing any better is no excuse. M1 Garand manuals are plentiful, ubiquitous, and available for nothing on line. The first thing the manual tells you, and something every Garand owner must learn, preferably before firing it, is what kind of ammo you can safely run through it. Slam fires and bent op rods are risks that everyone even considering a Garand must know before firing their "new" weapon. Asking the guy behind the counter in a gun shop is no substitute for doing your own due diligence. It's just poor judgment. Not getting a manual with the rifle means he needed to get one somewhere else, not go forward in blissful ignorance. He's lucky he wasn't badly injured, and NO ONE OWES HIM A NEW RIFLE!

[TMC]

Outside of the gun failure the problem I see is that there was an ACCIDENT and now this guys think he's entitled to money from somebody, rather than thanking God he's not injured and learned a lesson. This is a big problem in society today, when something bad happens everybody thinks they are owed money from someone else. Lawyers love it and the rest of us wonder why things are so expensive or why there are so many stupid laws or warning labels on everything or why we cannot buy the thing we used to.

[tierod]

hope he doesnt sue, chalk it up to a life lession dont use other peoples reloads. if he thinks he is pissed about rifle ,wait until he deals with a lawyer hahaha

[NeoWeird]

The way I READ it was he bought the RIFLE off Auction Arms from an out of state dealer and picked up the ammo in state from a "dealer" at the gun show. Neither person told him the ammo was safe to shoot in the M1, nor did he ask.

Also, the receiver is fine, so whether it was made in America or on the moon, made of forged steel or bologna, it doesn't matter - what you have is a catastrophic failure that destroyed the stock and bolt and possible other parts as well - the ammo and enbloc clip are cheap anyways so it doesn't matter.

One EXCELLENT point was made by one on their forums:




Anyone notice a disparity?

There is also the issue with the bolt being sheared in half. That's excessive pressure. What happened was the gas pressure hit so high that before the action unlocked the bolt sheared, the case failed (likely melted and/or vaporized to vent) and the insane pressure coming out the side blasted the stock to pieces but left the action, barrel, and other parts relatively undamaged. The owner already said he checked for obstructions but didn't say if he cleaned it. That doesn't matter though because had it been a problem with the barrel the barrel would have buldged. The way I see it one of a two things happened:

1. A SEVERELY overloaded case was fired. More than likely MORE than a double charge. Had it just been dangerously high he would have had primer deformation, perhaps even a rupture to the point where pressure blew through and could have damaged his trigger housing, enbloc, etc. This is WAY up there pressure wise. For a bolt to fail like THAT....he's lucky to be breathing. Seriously.

2. Improper powder, particularly too fast of burning powder. The pressure curves spikes long before the bullet exits, or hits the gas port, and the bolt is either never unlocked or the pressure is too great and it's already bound closed, and the pressure continues to rise until SOMETHING gives. The bullet is moving as fast as it can already and it's either the bolt or the barrel and this time it was the bolt.

If anything, he owes Springfield Armory Inc a thank you for making the rifle so well that it saved his life. NOTHING on the rifle failed. The bolt was pushed WAY beond it's functioning level and the stock had internal pressures put on it that it should never experience. Even if the whole thing fragmented and killed him they wouldn't be at fault.

It's between him and the reloader, and all the realoder would have to say is that his reloads are not made for the M1 and had he asked he would have told him otherwise. It's the owners responsability to know what his equipment is and how to use it properly - including what to feed it.

It's like someone pouring nitro-glycern in their gas tank because it too is combustable like gasoline and then blamming the nitro-glycern seller and the car manufacturer when his car blows up. Springfield did nothing wrong, and it's possible (though not likely) that the ammo reloader did nothing wrong, and all the blame is on the owner.

[gunboat]

I noticed several posters saying they would "never shoot reloads" - How about muzzle loaders??

[NeoWeird]

Well a muzzle loader doesn't have a case. So you are not reloading, you are simply loading. Shooting loads is perfectly ok.

Also, shooting reloads is fine. You shouldn't shoot someone ELSES reloads. If you reload, you're fine.

[TRAP55]

Any powder, suitable for any 30-06 load, can not be crammed into a case in sufficient quantity to provide that much over pressure. Worse case is a bent op rod.
If indeed it was the ammo, it had to have been packed with a pistol powder or.....severely undercharged. A bore obstruction would have bulged the barrel, ringed the bore at the very least.
I don't fault the shooter for using reloads, he was going on the information the dealer gave him. If you question that, question yourself on where you got your information, and how did you know the source was reliable?
This is precisely the reason anyone selling reloads commercially, has to be bonded and insured. I've shot a whole lot of reloads in my time, and have never found any that were loaded anywhere near maximum capacity.
This also could have been caused by the rifle somehow firing out of battery. Notice the bolt is shattered, but both lugs are intact. I can't tell from the pics, but the op rod looks unbent. And the brunt of the explosion was directed down through the magazine well. That tells me the round went off before it was fully chambered.

[proudamerican831]

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[30Cal]

...

Anyone notice a disparity?

There is also the issue with the bolt being sheared in half. That's excessive pressure. What happened was the gas pressure hit so high that before the action unlocked the bolt sheared, the case failed (likely melted and/or vaporized to vent) and the insane pressure coming out the side blasted the stock to pieces but left the action, barrel, and other parts relatively undamaged...

The Kuhnhausen's The U.S. .30Caliber Gas Operated Service Rifles: A Shop Manual has photos of a known out-of-battery firing, pg 181. The bolt looks identical.

[CrippledPidgeon]

I know that a lot of guys don't like to read manuals, but guns are some of those things that I'll actually take the time out to read.

Of course, guns of similar type are going to have largely similar information, but every maker has their own esoteric warnings and/or bits of advice.

[proudamerican831]

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