Stag Arms 2HT upper problem: UPDATED

[Heiko]

Hello! I'm a brand new member here. I'm a long time CA gun owner but never knew about this forum until I started researching an AR build. I'm lucky to have beaten the AW ban but it was time for another AR so I'm embarking upon my first AR build. This place is a great resource and it's nice to have a site specifically for us here in the worst gun law state in the country.

Here is my problem:

I just bought a Stag 2HT upper assembly from CWS. It is actually the second one. I bought one and after getting it home, noticed that the barrel or front sight was canted to the right. I also noticed that the included Samson handguard was a little lower than the rail on the top of the receiver. I returned that example and got a replacement. All looked okay in the store but I was pressed for time so I had to leave. They were very nice and I want to avoid having to return the thing. The store happens to be an hour each way drive away from home too.

This second 2HT had the same issue with the Samson rail being lower than the rail on the receiver. The result is pictured below. The rails do not sit flush. The first picture shows it pretty clearly. The second picture shows the gap under a straight edge. The problem that causes is that my EOTech will not mount properly. I would like, and should be able to mount it so that the front sits at or just over where the delta ring would be. The height difference with the rails prevents that from being possible. The EOTech rails do not sit properly due to the height difference. I can mount it all the way on the handguard but I do not like that position. I cannot mount it all the way to the rear because the ARMS BUIS doesn't give enough room for the EOTech to be locked in the rail. If the EOTech is all the way forward, it cannot slide back farther than where the receiver begins. It butts up against the height difference. Likewise for aft to front. The slight difference in height is too much for the tolerance of the EOTech.

Bottom line is that I am really unhappy and frustrated. I was really expecting more from Stag after reading so many good things about their products. What's the use of having a continuous rail if I can't mount my optic of choice in the position I want? Is this typical of Stag? Has anyone else seen this? I have now seen it on two 2HT's. Is there a simple fix for this? If I can't get this squared away, I'm returning it and starting over.

Any help is appreciated.

[tenpercentfirearms]

I really don't see much of a difference.

You appear to be the anal type of customer (no flame intended and I completely respect your position). I would step it up if I were you to something else. I personally like LMT MRPs and then you wouldn't have that issue. I was never really that impressed with the Stag 2HT. I sell them and guys seem to like them, but I am not a huge fan of that rail. It just doesn't seem right to me.

You can also try buying your own upper and getting Daniel Defense rails for it. Those are the only type of high end rails I have handled, so I know there are other good ones out there. If I was going to spend my money on something nice, Daniel Defense would work for me.

It just sounds like you are the type of customer who demands exact and precise products, so you really ought to spend the money on something more. If that is the way the rail is on two units, the I suspect it isn't a problem, but the way it was designed. A customer with less exacting standards wouldn't probably mind it and shoot it just fine. CWS should have plenty of other higher end goodies for you to trade out with, so you will be happy.

Again no flame intended and I say you are anal with respect. Your type of customer exists and that is why a retail location like mine or CWS in Highland is where you should do your business instead of mail order. That way you can come in and spend a bunch of time looking at the difference in products and choosing exactly what you need, want, and expect then walk out the door with it.

[ar15barrels]

You can't bridge the gap with optical sights.
The continous top rail is just for looks or to mount a flip-up front sight.
Get a shorter eotech.

[sb_pete]

You can't bridge the gap with optical sights...
Get a shorter eotech.

+1. Bridging that gap is a recipe for a wandering zero anyways. You need either a smaller Eotech or something like this (or cheaper here).

[Heiko]

Thanks for the replies guys. Yes, I am a little conscientious about these things and I can accept that I'm not spending top dollar for top quality but this little thing just struck me as a major design/build flaw. I can live with certain things considering the relatively low price but something that causes a decrease in functionality is unacceptable. Stag ought to have anticipated a situation like this. The height difference might seem almost imperceptible but it's there and is the root of the problem.

I will have to make another drive out to CWS and start over. They're going to think I'm nuts. My first preference is to keep it if it worked and save myself the hassle of driving a couple of hours. Do you think that they would consider allowing me to swap out a DD 7.0 tube and pay any difference? Perhaps that rail will line up better. Either that I get a Stag without the Samson and sub in a DD rail handguard.

Thanks again guys!

[domokun]

Thanks for the replies guys. Yes, I am a little conscientious about these things and I can accept that I'm not spending top dollar for top quality but this little thing just struck me as a major design/build flaw. I can live with certain things considering the relatively low price but something that causes a decrease in functionality is unacceptable. Stag ought to have anticipated a situation like this. The height difference might seem almost imperceptible but it's there and is the root of the problem.

I will have to make another drive out to CWS and start over. They're going to think I'm nuts. My first preference is to keep it if it worked and save myself the hassle of driving a couple of hours. Do you think that they would consider allowing me to swap out a DD 7.0 tube and pay any difference? Perhaps that rail will line up better. Either that I get a Stag without the Samson and sub in a DD rail handguard.

Thanks again guys!

Bring your EOTech and the mount(s) for it with you to the store so you can test mount it on the uppers they have in stock to find one that works for you.

[ar15barrels]

this little thing just struck me as a major design/build flaw. I can live with certain things considering the relatively low price but something that causes a decrease in functionality is unacceptable. Stag ought to have anticipated a situation like this. The height difference might seem almost imperceptible but it's there and is the root of the problem.

You still have not accepted that you are not supposed to bridge the optic on to the handguard.
Once you accept that, you will realize that the step you see does not matter in reality.

This is much like complaining that your Corvette ZR-1 gets stuck in the mud.
Guess what, it does not have mud tires so it's no suprise that it gets stuck in the mud...

[Heiko]

Bring your EOTech and the mount(s) for it with you to the store so you can test mount it on the uppers they have in stock to find one that works for you.

That is what I will have to do.

You still have not accepted that you are not supposed to bridge the optic on to the handguard.
Once you accept that, you will realize that the step you see does not matter in reality.

This is much like complaining that your Corvette ZR-1 gets stuck in the mud.
Guess what, it does not have mud tires so it's no suprise that it gets stuck in the mud...

I get it. I'm just bummed that my EOTech doesn't fit. I already had it so I can't switch directions on that. The only way it will fit is if I mount it all the way to the rear and that would mean removing the ARMS BUIS, or all the way to the front where I don't really like it. (I know, I sound like Goldilocks and her damn porridge being too hot or cold.)

It's a learning process and I'm learning the hard way.

[ar15barrels]

I get it. I'm just bummed that my EOTech doesn't fit. I already had it so I can't switch directions on that. The only way it will fit is if I mount it all the way to the rear and that would mean removing the ARMS BUIS, or all the way to the front where I don't really like it. (I know, I sound like Goldilocks and her damn porridge being too hot or cold.)

It's a learning process and I'm learning the hard way.

Have no fear.
There is still an easy solution...

Look into YHM, GG&G or PRI scout mounts.
They will clamp only to the receiver and they will raise the Eotech about 1/2" or so.
They reach forward of the receiver a few inches.
This will also make it so that your irons sit lower in the eotech's window, giving you a less obstructed view through the eotech.

[jandmtv]

Another happy customer for Stag, LOL

[ar15barrels]

Another happy customer for Stag, LOL

Actually, he's mad that his Samson rail is out of spec.
If any other rail were put on there, they would probably align better.

[jandmtv]

I was talking about the front sight being canted. As for the rail, its DD or nothing!

[Addax]

Exactly what Randall said!

Keep your optics mounted to the upper receiver, that is the most solid part of your upper receiver.

Do not mount it on the bridge (between the upper and the free float rail).

This is a flex point when you shoot, and you will not be able to maintain proper zero.

You still have not accepted that you are not supposed to bridge the optic on to the handguard.
Once you accept that, you will realize that the step you see does not matter in reality.

This is much like complaining that your Corvette ZR-1 gets stuck in the mud.
Guess what, it does not have mud tires so it's no suprise that it gets stuck in the mud...

[Addax]

DD is the way to go with rails, I have yet to have one misalign like the Samson one pictured on the Stag.

I was talking about the front sight being canted. As for the rail, its DD or nothing!

[Heiko]

Thanks again to everyone. You all know what it's like to get a new toy and be all giddy and then have a let down. It sucks.

Thanks Randall for the recommendation. I will go that route if all else fails. My other option is to see if CWS might give me credit for the Samson towards a DD. Somehow I think they won't do that. In that case I'll either get something with regular M4 handguards and buy a DD seperately.

As another option, would you recommend Del-Ton or steer clear of their uppers?