AFG considered a vertical grip?

[groundshark]

This might be a stupid question, but I'm asking it anyway. Got to thinking the other day... would this be illegal to add to a featureless build? My initial thought is no, but maybe I'm wrong...

[Darthbauer]

Long story short, no it is not a vfg. There is an ATF letter stating this somewhere, good luck finding it.

[goodlookin1]

Well, the AFG is not vertical, is it?

Just kidding. But I think I read somewhere a while ago that it not considered a VFG, but verify it with the ATF letter just in case.

[rareair]

Long story short, no it is not a vfg. There is an ATF letter stating this somewhere, good luck finding it.

The Force is strong with this one Darth

Check this thread for a PDF copy of the letter-

http://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/showthread.php?t=110703&page=23

Post #897

[Fate]

Ok on a AR pistol. BIG potential problems on a California Featureless build.

Search is your friend.

[bigthaiboy]

Although the ATF has given a decision on the Magpul AFG, CA DoJ hasn't, so they could still come after you for AW violations under PC 12276.1, if the DoJ decides to interpret the AFG differently to the ATF.

This applies for both semi-automatic pistols and long guns:

(a) Notwithstanding Section 12276, "assault weapon" shall
also mean any of the following:
(1) A semiautomatic, centerfire rifle that has the capacity to
accept a detachable magazine and any one of the following:
(A) A pistol grip that protrudes conspicuously beneath the action
of the weapon.
(B) A thumbhole stock.
(C) A folding or telescoping stock.
(D) A grenade launcher or flare launcher.
(E) A flash suppressor.
(F) A forward pistol grip.

Pistols
(4) A semiautomatic pistol that has the capacity to accept a
detachable magazine and any one of the following:
(A) A threaded barrel, capable of accepting a flash suppressor, forward
handgrip, or silencer.
(B) A second handgrip.
(C) A shroud that is attached to, or partially or completely encircles, the
barrel that allows the bearer to fire the weapon without burning his or
her hand, except a slide that encloses the barrel.
(D) The capacity to accept a detachable magazine at some location
outside of the pistol grip.

[NapaCountyShooter]

Listen to Fate and Bigthaiboy. Not worth the risk on a featureless build in Ca. Just use good thumb over bore teqnique as Magpul says you should.

[GettoPhilosopher]

Yeah, that's the problem. US BATFE/DOJ says "not a vert grip!" for the purpose of Pistols (i.e. not an AOW if you put it on an AR pistol, etc).

Problem is, CA DOJ hasn't ruled, so it's basically up to you whether or not you'd like to be the test case. Logic dictates that if it's not a vert grip for purposes of the NFA, CA should follow suit, but we all know "logic" and "CA AW Laws" have never gone together after that one drunk night in Vegas.

So...you confident enough to risk a felony?

[Rekrab]

Although the ATF has given a decision on the Magpul AFG, CA DoJ hasn't, so they could still come after you for AW violations under PC 12276.1, if the DoJ decides to interpret the AFG differently to the ATF.

This applies for both semi-automatic pistols and long guns:

In the case of an AR pistol, the magazine would be locked so a forward grip isn't an issue. In the case of a featureless build, we have clearly defined characteristics of what is considered a pistol grip and the AFG cannot be defined as a pistol grip.

[rattlesnake_nm]

So this only applies in cali? I can have an afg on a pistol in New Mexico? Do I have to pin the flash hider?

[EvoXRiley]

Kinda thread jacking but on my normal evil feature ar I have a afg and vfg with BB this legal?

[Rekrab]

You have an AFG and a VFG? o.O

But yes, on a fixed magazine rifle that is legal.

[ke6guj]

So this only applies in cali? I can have an afg on a pistol in New Mexico? Do I have to pin the flash hider?

On a CA-legal AR-pistol, you can have an AFG and an unpinned flash hider, so I don't know why you would need to pin it in NM.

[pyro3k2]

The infamous letter every one is referring to, my disclaimer is that no where in this letter is california or it's laws even mentioned and it is being written from the the east coast. If this letter had asked about the AFG pertaining to CA law then it would be golden but it does not. Also as stated above just because the ATF said it wasn't doesn't mean the DOJ doesn't, so until both can agreed that it is not a VFG than I would not put it on a featureless rifle or an AK/AR pistol.

https://docs.google.com/fileview?id=0B0qyloA48O3XZWFjYjMwYTMtYTg1MC00NzVhLWI3NmMtZDRiNTMzNzdhMzUx&hl=en

[thetaxman]

Kinda thread jacking but on my normal evil feature ar I have a afg and vfg with BB this legal?