Folding Stock, Pistol Grip Mini 14 @ the range today

[glockwise2000]

I saw something similar at a local range this past summer. The guy had a mini-14 and I could tell it was likely new due to the new type front sight post. He had it in a *fixed* folder with pistol grip stock. Him and his buddy started chatting to me about my ARs and AKs and I asked if he got his mini within the past couple of years or so

He replies, "Yes" and I tell him in a nice way that in the minis current configuration, it is considered an AW due to the pistol grip. (And i already explained how my ARs and AKs legally had features due to the Bullet Button btw). He then tells me that its legal because he ordered it online and that its ok because the stock cant fold. I then refresh him on the whole SB23 features stuff and suggest to him that he switches out the stock.

They were really cool with it, the guys clearly didnt know the law 100% and they knew they didnt. We continued to chat about other stuff. Its all about how you go about it. Perhaps if you see a situation like that again, make small talk with the person about it and ask if their gun is new or not. Its also wise to have a flowchart on you.

I would have invited those guys to browse to CALGUNS.NET for further information. That would be an additional 1 member.

[Cokebottle]

I'm with Jpach.

If the RO sees it, it's his responsibility to ensure the legality of the range operations... not the customers.

If involved in a friendly conversation with the owner, then I might bring it up, but only if I were 1000% certain that there was a violation. More than likely, I'd bring it up offhandedly, as mentioned before, about all the hoops that CA makes us jump through to have something as simple as a PG, pinning folders, etc....

But I would certainly not initiate contact. Not my job, not my business.
How hard is it to tell by looking at a gun on the rack that it's not a .22lr conversion?

[223Devil]

I'm one of those who has a RAW Mini14 with a factory folding stock. I get weird looks all the time at the range.

[Seesm]

If that Mini had a ceiner kit in it it would be fully legal...

[3GunFunShooter]

I would of used Jpach's approach. We as shooters don't want some stupid,uninformed shooter getting busted. It makes all shooters look bad. I do like the approach of "Nice RAW, I wish I would of done that". We don't want the cops trolling the ranges looking for people to bust, especially a range I am a member. As a NRA, IDPA and USPSA member, I should try to inform the ones who don't know the law, or steer them to Calguns, if they don't want to listen to me. Now if they say they don't care about the law then it is on them.

[PolishMike]

I mind my own business. That being said, I see unregistered AW's at ranges ALL the time.

[Vinz]

I would of used Jpach's approach. We as shooters don't want some stupid,uninformed shooter getting busted. It makes all shooters look bad. I do like the approach of "Nice RAW, I wish I would of done that". We don't want the cops trolling the ranges looking for people to bust, especially a range I am a member. As a NRA, IDPA and USPSA member, I should try to inform the ones who don't know the law, or steer them to Calguns, if they don't want to listen to me. Now if they say they don't care about the law then it is on them.

I agree. I guess I am just friendly or the ranges I go to are. I don't mind someone asking questions and I don't start one until I am approched or its initiated.

If someone doesn't want to be talked with you can tell.
Plus the ranges I go to, if the rifle made it past the gates, its good to go.
vinz

[joelukehart]

I'm one of those who has a RAW Mini14 with a factory folding stock. I get weird looks all the time at the range.

They are just jealous and I am as well . I have never seen a factory folder Mini in person, only in pictures and the web. I swear, some newbies are completely ignorant of the fact that there were AR, AK, G3, FAL type rifles in CA. before 2000 and bullet buttons and top loading AR's.

[wait_one]

I'd assume the AW type rifles I see at the range are registered....Some of the people I know who did register their ARs years ago carry a copy of the registration letter from the DOJ in the buttstock.

[Ravenslair]

Proper range protocol would be to mind your own business.

+1

There are so many gun owners in California and many that have RAW's. Make sure you are legal and let others do the same for themselves. Please do not walk up and try to help me by explaining that my RAW may be configured illegally. The politicians have won in my opinion when someone even has to think if they should point out that a firearm may be illegal. For those that have been to free states, that thought process is about as foreign as an alien from Mars. Just my opinion.

[Merc1138]

Is there an accepted range protocol regarding just wanting to be helpful? How do I avoid a range faux pas?

A faux pas is easily avoidable by keeping your mouth shut.

A: You are not the authorities
B: It's not your range
C: It has nothing to do with you

If you want to strike up a casual conversation and maybe mention calguns, fine. Nothing wrong with that, I've done it before. Don't start telling the man his rifle might be illegal or questioning him about it. It might be a .22lr, it might be a RAW, it could also be an unregistered assault weapon, maybe you didn't see the maglock he made for himself? In any of those instances, it's not particularly any of your business.

I've had people ask what I used to block my mags, had people ask about the ammo because they saw the box, been asked about the magpul bad on my OLL. I've never had any problem discussing any of that, but even though my configuration is legal I'd probably politely tell you to just get the hell out of my face if you wanted to attempt to start quoting PC and tell me what I can and can't do as it's none of your business really.

[mydogsmonkey]

its completely possible thats a personal registered AW from being a law enforcement officer or military, they could get newer AWs, not having to be postban, i know cops that can do that kinda stuff

honestly, just mind your own business unless you honestly just wanna talk

[3GunFunShooter]

I should of put in my post that it depends on the age of the guy with a gun in question. Under 30 probably not a RAW over 30 Good chance that it is a RAW. Most older shooters are better informed, being around for the CA 2000 ban and the 1994 Federal Ban. Don't get me wrong, I do not hang out at the public range looking for someone to question or even talk to. I usually sight in quickly at the 100 yard range and then move to the 300 yd range, or head to the action pistol bays, so I don't get much interaction with the general pubic shooters. My JP AR has a U-15 stock so I have people ask me about that since I have preban standard capacity mags, my Mini 14 is an ASI custom so I also get questions about that and I do enjoy talking about guns and do not mind sharing my knowledge to others. I worked at a gun store in high school in the late 1960's so I know a little about shooting.( just wish I had spent my money on guns instead of cars, women and booze, LOL) I have a lot of shooters ask me how to get into 3 gun, with a legal CA rifle, both in IDPA and USPSA, there are a lot of people who do not understand the laws. Just look at all the mag questions on Calguns.

[drclark]

I'm in the mind your own business camp. The ONLY time I'll worry about someone else at the range is if they are shooting at or messing with my target or conducting themselves in an unsafe manner or picking up my brass.

WHAT they are shooting is none of my business. It is their responsibility to know the laws and their choice as to their level of compliance.

[sytfu_RR]

IT depends, if I'm already talking to the guy, maybe I'll bring it up casually. However if it's some random person at another lane that I have no prior contact with, I'd mind my own business. It could be a raw, or maybe a 22lr convert, who knows, it's tough trying to tell someone that something they did is illegal when they believe they are right. I already have to deal with fud from friends who aren't calguns members and go off what they hear in the media regarding firearm laws.