Model 1 sales

[MrLogan]

This is an informal personal scoring but I generally agree.

Well, Tier 1s do full testing - including things like proof load/MPI testing of all barrels (not just a statistical sample) and peening/MPI of bolts.

Bushmaster - while generally pretty good - has some shortcuts. For example: - Bushmaster barrels are not parkerized under the front sight base.
- Bushy bbls are apparently not all proofed/MPI tested, just random samples
- Bushy uses A2 front sight base instead of the "F"-marked front sight base
used for flattops.
- Bolts are apparently not peened, and may only be sample-MPI'd.

From what I hear of BravoCompanyUSA, they'd have to be Tier1 grade, but they're small/"boutique" and not high volume so that may be why xeno put it Tier2. CMMG, I think, is similar - and their barrels are known for accuracy.
Armalite is top-notch on quality, but they have their own way of doing things sometimes (perhaps rational) - and many of their barrels are 4140, not 4150.

If you have true FN parts it's unlikely they came thru normal channels, and there's a chance they could be seconds. FN does not sell into the 'commercial' channel.

Many vendors say they use "FN parts". They're really stretching things: they're buying some stuff from the same vendors FN uses, but the finish & testing FN does hasn't happened. And Colt and Armalite etc buy from the same forges too.. These are usu the same companies that really tout their 'chrome moly' barrels like it's something special (it's just regular barrel steel) in an attempt to confuse newbies with 'chrome lined'.

Ahh. Interesting. I didn't know that. Learn something new everyday. Thank you, bweise.

[bwiese]

Ahh. Interesting. I didn't know that. Learn something new everyday. Thank you, bweise.

Most people will be well-served by Tier1 or Tier2 guns. They're QC'd and use decent springs in the lower parts kit, and most often (except for 'match' guns) have chrome-lined barrels with milspec chambers.

If you get one of these guns and properly lube it w/decent ammo (not someone's crappy reloads) and use a quality magazine, your rifle should be just fine.

[Veritas_223]

Guys,

Where you do you rate RRA? Tier 1 or 2?

[bwiese]

Guys,

Where you do you rate RRA? Tier 1 or 2?

Hmm. They're OK.

I do hear some of their parts are different than milspec dimensions - in particular, the buffer tube on the CAR stocks.

Their barrels seem to be OK - that is they offer chrome -lined. Dunno about details.

However I hear from multiple sources that their upper receiver fit to their and other lowers is really tight.

[MrLogan]

Are there accuracy concers with a Bushy, since they do not use the F marked FSB for their flatop receivers?

[PIRATE14]

Guys,

Where you do you rate RRA? Tier 1 or 2?

Tier 2......ie most companies fit here

RRA buys most of thier parts from other sources and assembles them.

Wilson barrels....etc.

Very good product.....lifetime warranty

[Lateralus]

ive also head that M1S makes terrible stainless barrels. any feedack on a M1S 16" with stainless fluted barrel?

[bwiese]

Are there accuracy concers with a Bushy, since they do not use the F marked FSB for their flatop receivers?

Probably not. Colt did the math and picked a different sight hight for the carbine flattop (0.040" different, IIRC...).

For all practical purposes, it's not a big thing. But that means you have to watch whose carry handles go on whose rifles. A Colt carry handle may have issues w/a Bushy upper (front sight) and may need a taller front sight post.

If you're getting ARMS 70 flip up sights, or other similar aftermarket sights, many of these are tuned up for true Colt flattop front sight height. However, my Bushy upper seems to work OK and the front post is not too high (near or beyond the 'ears' of the FSB).

[MrLogan]

Probably not. Colt did the math and picked a different sight hight for the carbine flattop (0.040" different, IIRC...).

For all practical purposes, it's not a big thing. But that means you have to watch whose carry handles go on whose rifles. A Colt carry handle may have issues w/a Bushy upper (front sight) and may need a taller front sight post.

If you're getting ARMS 70 flip up sights, or other similar aftermarket sights, many of these are tuned up for true Colt flattop front sight height. However, my Bushy upper seems to work OK and the front post is not too high (near or beyond the 'ears' of the FSB).

Bwiese, don't mean to badger you with questions here. But what would you consider be a good Tier 1 company that makes a complete upper receiver assembly with standard 20" gov't profile barrel with a 1/7 twist (that sells to civvies)? LMT doesn't appear to make a 20" barrel, at least not for civillian sales. Any suggestions?

[blkA4alb]

Bwiese, don't mean to badger you with questions here. But what would you consider be a good Tier 1 company that makes a complete upper receiver assembly with standard 20" gov't profile barrel with a 1/7 twist (that sells to civvies)? LMT doesn't appear to make a 20" barrel, at least not for civillian sales. Any suggestions?

http://www.bravocompanyusa.com/BCM-M16-Government-20-Upper-Receiver-Group-p/bcm-urg-gov-20.htm

Its not quite complete, it needs handguards, a complete carrier, and a charging handle. And its out of stock.. .

[bwiese]

Bwiese, don't mean to badger you with questions here. But what would you consider be a good Tier 1 company that makes a complete upper receiver assembly with standard 20" gov't profile barrel with a 1/7 twist (that sells to civvies)? LMT doesn't appear to make a 20" barrel, at least not for civillian sales. Any suggestions?

Frankly I consider CMMG a near Tier-1 company that I'm sure will do you well.

They're a smaller vendor w/great service.

You'll get a top-notch upper + bbl, chrome-lined & tested, with the right frong sight/gas block on it.

[MrLogan]

Thank you so much blkA4alb and bweise for your answers. I have to admit, I'm kind of new to all this. Other than the rifle I was issued in the service, my experience with the AR platform is pretty limited so far. Your help and answers are greatly appreciated.

I was looking at the CMMG site, and was wondering what it means if they upper receiver is "T" marked? And what is the advantage/disadvantage of having the standard anodized feedramp vs. the extended/polished? And also, what's so special about the LMT enhanced bolt carrier group?

[C.G.]

Just saw this an ARF.com:
Lakeguy
Team Member
reel professional



Shot 240 rounds this weekend out of a 16" RRA. Only had 1 minor issue with the Wolf M193. One FTF, must have been a dud. Then I had this happen around the 3rd or 4th mag


Definitely not the ammos fault though. Another high quality Model 1sales POS bolt. I threw my Sabre Defence bolt in and shot the rest of the M193. Very good ammo. I'm planning on buying more soon.

[Joe]

so he put a model1sales bolt in his RRA upper... why?

[bwiese]

I was looking at the CMMG site, and was wondering what it means if they upper receiver is "T" marked?

That just means the grooves in the top Picatinny rail are marked with numbers representing position. That way an organization can say something like "mount widget XXX with its rear at position Tnn", and everyone's on the same page. For most folks, it's just "tacti-cool" and not really relevant.

And what is the advantage/disadvantage of having the standard anodized feedramp vs. the extended/polished?

M4 carbines use different feedramps around the barrel extension than those of regular M16s/AR15s. This was for easier feeding in full-auto operation. It's much less significant for regular day to day semiauto shooters, even those shooting a lot.

Nevertheless, you should match your upper receiver to the barrel. If your barrel has "M4 feedramps" you should get a matching upper receiver that is compatible; if your barrel just has regular ramps, get a regular upper receiver.


[qupte] And also, what's so special about the LMT enhanced bolt carrier group?

Dunno much about the carrier, the bolt is 'improved' for supposed better extraction/reliability. It's priced like that, too

You should have no problem with a regular bolt & carrier. Don't get sold on all the frills, plenty of folks shoot regular ARs without all the doodads.