Help me with long range rifle decisions please!

[weaverftw]

So, I'd like to get into long range shooting (600m for now but hopefully up to 1000+m asI progress), and after watching some of the "Sniper 101" series on YouTube, I still have some reservations about cartridge/rifle selection.

Part of me wants to get a .270 because there are fairly high BC bullets available (.500+), and there is a Ruger American and Remington 700 SPS Tactical available at my local shop. I'm leaning toward the 700 because it has a heavier contour barrel.

However, the problem with .270 is there aren't that many long range/match quality projectiles, and I'd have to buy a reloading press abd equipment to load my cartridges, adding tothe cost and complexity of the endeavor.

For this reason, I'm more leading towards a .308 simply due to ammo availability. The ballistic charts I've seen all show .270 to have more potential for long range shooting (over 600m), but I know .308 is used by many long range shooters so I'm sure it would be adequate. I want to stay away from smaller cartridges (like .243) because I'd like to use the rifle for pig hunting in the future.

Is the Remington 700 in .308 a good choice? Which models (other than the SPS Tactical) have a heavy contour barrel? What other rifle would you recommend over the 700 (ie, savage model 10, etc)?

I'm getting antsy, I want to go shoot! Lol.

[acourvil]

260 Rem or 6.5 Creedmore. Better BCs than 308, good factory ammo choices available, and still plenty of punch for hunting.

But if you want to do long range shooting, you are going to want to reload, might as well get started.

[weaverftw]

260 Rem or 6.5 Creedmore. Better BCs than 308, good factory ammo choices available, and still plenty of punch for hunting.

But if you want to do long range shooting, you are going to want to reload, might as well get started.

What about rifle platforms for those cartridges? How do you feel about .270 as a long range cartridge (assuming I reload it)?

[Grunt81]

I was in a similar situation as yourself, recently. I originally wanted a 7mm 08 due to the slightly flatter trajectory and lower recoil (according to the internet). I too wanted a rifle that could pull double duty as a hunting rifle and some fun at the range. Remember, a true target rifle will have a long, heavy contour barrel, to allow more rounds to be fired before heat drastically affects barrel harmonics. That same rifle would slow you down in the field by weighing almost twic as much or more, than a true hunting rifle.

I walked into a few stores and realized no one was stocking 7mm 08 rifles. They needed to be special ordered and there was usually a hefty fee for that. I already reload 9mm and .223 and had full intention of reloading for my new rifle. I found that it was difficult to get new brass unless it was the super expensive Nosler, Lapua, or Norma brass. There's also no real cost savings in .284 bullets vs .308 bullets.

So I decided not to fight the issue and got a Savage 11 Trophy Hunter XP chambered in .308. I'm glad I did. I put a limb saver recoil pad on it from wal mart and I don't doubt I can shoot .308 all day. So far, I've taken it out twice and have shot around 70 rounds each time and my shoulder pretty much felt the same as it did when I got to the range. Granted, I was letting the barrel cool as much as I could, and shot two different AR-15s in the mean time.

A .308 will open up the door for you to hunt game with a little more authority than other common bench rest calibers. According to Hornady ballistics calculator and Hodgon reloading data (realistic bullet weights and realistic velocities), the .308 carries more ft.-lbs. of energy then the 7-08 out to about 800 yards, maybe even further in some loads. Brass is easy to come by, especially once-fired Lake City brass just to get me started (around $20/100). There's so much load data and real world experience for the .308 Win, that I have plenty to steer me in the right direction.

At the end of the day, jump through the hoops you need to jump through if it means feeling warm and fuzzy about the caliber you choose. I chose to not have to fight to find reloading components. 30 cal components are highly available and affordable. I recommend starting to reload as you'll be able to tailor ammo to your rifle for half the price as factory ammo. Yes, there is an initial investment. Many say you won't save any money after you've paid your equipment off because you'll shoot more often. Then that just means, for the same amount of money, you are better trained at employing your rifle. Sounds like a win win to me. But I will say, it is something you must enjoy. If you like paying attention to detail and being meticulous, while creating ammo that is more accurate out of your rifle than anything you can buy on a shelf, for half the cost, then you should get on the reloading wagon. Understand the risks before getting started, practice safety techniques religiously, and you'll enjoy the hobby without worrying about blowing your rifle up, or your hands.

[junior40er]

338LM

[smokeyfs]

I have a turn key never been fired 1000 yard set up for sale. Remington 700 .308 Varmint in a Bells and Carlson stock with a
Bushnell dmr scope

[russ69]

A couple of things come to mind. First if you want to hit anything at long range, you'll want to handload. That is going to be true regardless of the caliber. Next is caliber selection. If given the choice for long range (1000 yards) you do not want a 30 or a 7mm, you'll want a 6 or 6.5mm. Although many people enjoy the bigger bores it is not the best selection.

[bsumoba]

Here is my take:

You can go 308 or 6.5 creedmoor if you DO NOT want to handload. FGMM for 308 and Hornady 140gr A-Max factory ammo is actually decent...but you will pay for it of course at over $1.20+ per round.

I watched the sniper101 vids as well and they are very informative.

308 - limits yourself to probably 1K max with the heavy grain bullets like the 175gr SMK. In this caliber, you will have to handload to get the most out of the 308 caliber. You got to keep in mind that this round will get bucked by the wind A LOT and at $1.20+ per round if you buy match ammo, it gets old fast trying to hit a target at distance and you keep missing.

6.5 creedmoor/260 rem - will get you to just beyond 1K and bucks the wind better than the 308. I use this caliber for my tac matches and have shot it out to 1K+ multiple times with no problem at all. Would I hunt with it past 400 yards?...I wouldn't feel comfortable doing it humanely 100% of the time....plus I dont hunt

7mm - there is very little factory ammo out there and you will have to handload. This is a good caliber to compromise of high BC bullets and recoil. This is the caliber I chose for 1K f-class shooting.

Other 30 cal like the 300 Win Mag and 300 WSM - Expensive, harder recoiling, and you almost have to handload.

30-06 - might be a good choice for you. Lots of ammo choices.


So...to answer your question....you can go with a 308 for now and I would say go with the 700P versions or the 5R stainless barrel versions, shoot the snot out of it, then buy a new barrel in the caliber of your choice that fits in a short action like the 6.5 creedmoor, 6.5x47 Lapua, 260 rem, etc and go to a smith and have him chamber you a new barrel.

If you want something bigger than this, then maybe go 300 Win Mag in a 700 long action or go 30-06.

Last but not least....bite the bullet and start learning to handload...its the only way to go because you can tune the loads to your rifle.

[foxtrotuniformlima]

Paging Randall..............

[highpower790]

If palma competition floats your boat then 308

[CobraRed]

So, I'd like to get into long range shooting (600m for now but hopefully up to 1000+m asI progress)

This alone negates the .308 as a choice. Anyone suggesting you shoot beyond 1,100 yards with a .308 and hit anything small is asking a lot from you.

6.5 SAUM
284 Shehane
6.5x55AI Modern

Are some of the over 1,100 cartridges that do a good job with varying degree of reloading requirements and barrel life.

Agreed that 260 Rem and 6.5Creed are great cartridges compared to .308 out to and beyond 1k yards, but not exactly well beyond 1k yards. You need to decide what 1000m+ means to you first.

For a 1100/1200 yard rifle the those two cartridges are a no brainier.
You should really reload either way.

[postal]

243 should be considered as well. It's 1k yd capable... factory ammo available- and I dont see how it wouldnt be effective hunting most things in N America....

Someone correct me puh leese if I'm wrong.... but wouldnt 243 be suitable for almost any game in N America besides bear and maybe elk?

Yes, to play at long range you REALLY need to reload... no matter what cartridge you choose.

[Thorax]

off the shelf
long range capable
easily reloadable
easy to find factory rifle chambered in it
can do hunting if required
why does no one ever mention it ?

25-06

<edit>

Did I mean to say 25-06 AI (Ackley improved) ? I dunno, but I should have

[russ69]

243 should be considered as well...Someone correct me puh leese if I'm wrong.... but wouldnt 243 be suitable for almost any game in N America besides bear and maybe elk?...

The 243 is great but available rife twist puts some limits on it. A good 243 with the right bullet will take all game in North America.

[Grunt81]

I'm gathering a few things from yall's posts.

#1) You all are a wealth of knowledge and have valuable first hand experience in long range shooting competitions (Randall included, though he hasn't chimed in yet).

#2) In order to be competitive you need to reload.

#3) In order to be competitive, you need to have a dedicated bench rest rifle, not a rifle that can pull double duty. A true hunting rifle has a thin contour pencil barrel and is meant for first shot, cold-bore accuracy. Barrel harmonics will be coming in to play after your first 5-shot group of the day out of a pencil barrel and it will need to cool down, no less than 20 minutes on a cold day, if the accuracy potential of the rifle is to truly be tested.

However, the OP never said anything about competing. He said he wants a rifle in a caliber he can hunt hogs with and still enjoy just shooting at 600m, and he'd eventually like to try his hand at 1000m+.

I am absolutely addicted to the pursuit of printing tiny little groups on paper. But you also need to make sure your rifle carries enough foot pounds of energy on an animal, at the range you'd like to hunt, for a clean, ethical kill with good shot placement. Humane shots trump sub MOA accuracy from a hunting rifle. However, several dedicated hunting rifles are capable of consistent sub MOA accuracy from a cold bore.

I think you have plenty of good suggestions from our fellow CalGunners for calibers that will suit you up to and beyond 1,000 yards. Do some research on how the calibers you are considering will behave when they strike a thick-boned animal like a hog. Ballistics calculators help predict foot pounds of energy. The great State of California recommends at least 1,200 ft.-lbs of energy remaining at 100 yards for adult hogs that can weigh over 200 pounds.

Here's a link for approved calibers. Anything not listed is not recommended.

Lets make sure the solution fits the problem.

Caliber Bullet Recommended for wild pigs of:
Weight
(grains) under 90 lbs over 90 lbs
Rifles

250 Savage 100 yes yes
257 Roberts + P 100 yes yes
25-06 Remington 120 yes yes
264 Winchester Magnum 140 yes yes
270 Winchester 130 yes yes
7x30 Waters 120 yes yes
7mm-08 140 yes yes
7x57 Mauser 145 yes yes
280 Remington 140 yes yes
284 Winchester 150 yes yes
7mm Remington Magnum 150 yes yes
30 M1 Carbine 110 no no

30-30 Winchester 150 yes yes
300 Savage 150 yes yes
30-40 Krag 150 yes yes
307 Winchester 180 yes yes
308 Winchester 150 yes yes
30-06 Springfield 150 yes yes
300 Winchester Magnum 150 yes yes
300 H&H Magnum 180 yes yes
303 Savage 190 yes no
303 British 180 yes yes
32-20 Winchester 100 no no
32 Winchester Special 170 yes yes
8mm Mauser 170 yes yes
8mm Remington Magnum 185 yes yes
338 Winchester Magnum 200 yes yes
348 Winchester 200 yes yes

35 Remington 200 yes yes
356 Winchester 200 yes yes
358 Winchester 200 yes yes
35 Whelan 200 yes yes
350 Remington Magnum 200 yes yes
375 Winchester 200 yes yes
375 H&H Magnum 270 yes yes

416 Remington Magnum 300 yes yes

444 Marlin 240 yes yes
45-70 Government 300 yes yes
458 Winchester 500 yes yes