URSA 2000 Yard May Match Results

[MongooseV8]

Also curious Lynn you have posted many times in the past about using Billy Goat. Is that where I can get a barrel block done up? I have built a lot of stuff but not setup for something like that.

[LynnJr]

I already had the stock with the barrel block.
There are a large number of different designs for a barrel block setup and I'm sure BillyGoat Machine can make you one.
You want 1/8 of material on the barrel itself so if you use a 1.200 or 1.250 barrel figure on a 1.5 inch or larger block.
You can use a split block a clamping block or a glue in block they all work.

Split blocks are generally larger so you need a big enough stock to house the block.
Clamping blocks and glue in blocks are generally much smaller.

In the old days we used a Shilen DGA type action or a Davidson or Jon Loh sleeve when hanging large barrels on repeater actions.
Barrel blocks are more commonplace in 600/1000 yard Benchrest matches were accuracy is the only concern.

[LynnJr]

Orange gun is a Remington 600 that's been all trued up with a Davidson sleeve.
The flag gun is a Shehane Maxi-Trakker with a split type block.

[MongooseV8]

Interesting thanks again for the tips

[LynnJr]

For your typical tactical or hunting type rifle the barrels are generally very lightweight or less than 10 pounds.
If you look at a Mauser 98 type action they are about 1/4 X 1/4 inch thick through the loading port and magazine cutout.
If you compare that to a BAT EX action there is no cutout at all and the outside diameter is 2.5 inches and the action walls are 0.750 at the thinnest point. Basically a 2.5 inch pipe 3/4 inch thick verses a 1.4 inch pipe 0.200 thick with 85% + cutaway.
If you can see it in my crummy picture that's a 30 inch barrel on a 98 Mauser action but it's in an aluminum barrel block so there is zero stress on the action which would otherwise tear up the bedding frequently.

This is all 20+ year old technology and most modern actions are thicker with less cutaway area to maintain strength.
With the latest trend to shoot farther than 1000 yards longer heavier barrels are in vogue now with the tactical guys and you have two ways to get there.
You can go big with a custom BAT type action starting at $1700 and going upwards of $3500 or you can use a more traditional action and a barrel block.
One other thing most shooters overlook with a barrel block is rigidity.
If you hang a 32 inch barrel off of a standard action you have 3/4 inch of tenon and recoil lug then 31-1/4 inches of barrel whipping around.
If you use the exact same set-up in a barrel blocked gun you leave a half inch gap between the action and the barrel block and the block can be 4-9 inches long.
If we go with a 0.750 tenon 1/2 inch gap and 9 inch block the barrel sticking out past the end of the block that is free floating is essentially 21-3/4 inches long.

Edit: I used the 98 Mauser because with the thumb cutout near the rear bridge you can really see how little metal there is for controlling a whipping barrel

[MongooseV8]

Right now Im planning either a 300 PRC or my soft spot is a 7STW. Going with a 28" MTU or HV contour. Action will be a built 700 or the single shot Savage. I dont have a lot of options with this build as money is tight. My goal is to hit your target, not planning to be competitive with you big boys.

[LynnJr]

The 300 prc is very competitive as it won the 3K last year with Mark Liu shooting it.

The advantage the 300 prc has is that you don't need to spec out your own reamer for best accuracy.

Generally what happens is someone develops a good platform but they then compromise it when selling it to the general public. The prc was designed by Joe Thielen a 1000 yard Benchrest competitor to eliminate all the steps necessary for a 300 Ackley.

[ShaunBrady]

We may even bend Shaun's arm enough to get him up the mountain as well. Last time he showed up he brought heavy fog and drizzle with him.

The way I tell that story is I didn't even get to shoot but I still spent $200 on new reloading equipment when I got home. Talking shooting, guns, and reloading for 4 hours with serious people stirred the pot a bit and brought a couple positive changes to my reloading process.

I'm ranch sitting and shooting long a couple times a week. The mirage sets in pretty heavy by 9:30 and it'll likely be even hotter by the time your match rolls around. We'll see what the weather is like, but it'll probably be the fall before you see me again.

[ShaunBrady]

Right now Im planning either a 300 PRC or my soft spot is a 7STW. Going with a 28" MTU or HV contour. Action will be a built 700 or the single shot Savage. I dont have a lot of options with this build as money is tight. My goal is to hit your target, not planning to be competitive with you big boys.

That's a good plan. Raise your goals though. Think shooting with the grownups and qualifying for the match. That means 3/10 on a 1.8 moa target at 2050 yards after 10 sighters. If you can load ammo that has an ES under 30-35 fps for 10 shots and select a decent bullet, it'll be pretty straight forward if the conditions are reasonable. You might see a couple strings with half that spread from the experienced people. You'll be off the internet and into the real world.

[ShaunBrady]

The 300 prc is very competitive as it won the 3K last year with Mark Liu shooting it.

Amen

The advantage the 300 prc has is that you don't need to spec out your own reamer for best accuracy.

Yes, no, and maybe. It's a solid reamer design for factory Hornady ammo using the 225 ELDm bullet, but the freebore puts the 230 ATip outside of a CIP magazine. The ATip will also only have ~1/4" of bearing surface in the neck when new with the bullet just touching the lands. I'm thinking about buying a 300 PRC reamer, but will have to call it something else because I want to shorten the freebore and it wouldn't chamber factory ammo anymore.

This is how it's going with a RPR chamber anyway. The ELDm touch the lands at 3.705" and the ATip is 3.810". I'd be interested in hearing how it's going from someone with a match chamber.

Generally what happens is someone develops a good platform but they then compromise it when selling it to the general public. The prc was designed by Joe Thielen a 1000 yard Benchrest competitor to eliminate all the steps necessary for a 300 Ackley.

I think the back story depends on who's telling it. Tooley claims it's a knock off of his 30 BooBoo cartridge. It has less case taper than the BooBoo, but the same 30 degree shoulder. The BooBoo was based on RWS 8x68 brass.

It only has a couple grains of water more capacity than Norma 300WM brass, but it has the Hornady marketing engine behind it. I already have ADG and Lapua brass for it. I've been using it to make 7/300 PRC, but am also experimenting with the factory 300 PRC barrel on a Magnum RPR before I switch it.

[LynnJr]

The back story is exactly correct in your post.
The 300 Ackley at the time accounted for 63% of all 1000 yard Benchrest match wins. Back then you could make 300 Ackley brass out of 300 Weatherby 300 H-H 340 Weatherby 375 H-H 8mm Remington magnum or just about any belted magnum case long enough to be used. Today most reloaders wouldn't think about turning 30-06 brass into 243 brass but in the old days you used whatever you had around.
The big problem with the 300 Ackley was primer pocket life was extremely short in those days at the velocity were the guns shot best so they where expensive to shoot. Norma brass lasted 3 rounds maybe 4 tops before a primer wouldn't work at all and you needed 1 shot to fireform the case. RWS 375 brass was much better but getting it meant ordering it from Huntington's or dangerous Dave at Old Western Scrounger and from Bill Krazinski(sp). Back then it only loaded ammo at $50 a box so you pulled the bullet necked down the brass to 30 caliber seated your cull bullets and used the factory primer and powder as your fireforming load.
Dave Tooley back then was building alotof 1000 yard Benchrest rifles and was a very active competitor as well.
He didn't like dealing with customer complaints about the belted cases and short brass life so he developed his 30 booboo for one of his shooting buddies and set a at that time world record with it at the nationals in Colorado.
The big 30's seem to like a case capacity of around 100+/- grains of water and with a tight throat they shoot extremely well.
I just received a text from Focus that he ordered up a Uni-throater for his 338 to keep his bullets away from the donut that forms at the neck/shoulder junction.
On my 338's I throat them 0.175 - 0.190 longer than a standard throat so it further compounds the cartridge overall length issue with a repeater action and lathe turned solids.
Gives you and extra 100 FPS and I shoot single shot so it's not a problem for my way of shooting.

Mongoose
I spoke with Alexis at Pacific Tool and Die on Thursday to order up 8 of those $349 338 Lapua Magnums they have on there memorial day sales AD.
They are all short chambered but that doesn't matter to me as I can do those myself. I can also Ackley Improve them at the same time and use them as a fireform rifle.
I didn't order them up because she couldn't tell me if they came with a bolt or not.
If they came with a factory bolt for $349 it would be a tough combination to beat.
You can upgrade the bolt to top of the line for $300 or just use the factory bolt as is.
You can sell the bolt on E-Bay for roughly $200 which means you get a barrel and a receiver for $149 plus some shipping and DRO fees which you have to pay for on any gun.
A 338 short chambered barrel on E-Bay sells for $70-150 depending so using the factory barrel until you shoot it out would be my choice.
Hopefully they get those guns from the custom shop and don't gouge on the price.
I wouldn't step into a 338 Savage until Pacific Tool posts up final pricing.

[MongooseV8]

I am considering a single shot Savage because I can potentially run any cartridge I wanted down the road, and they are very cheap. I have really enjoyed my Savages and playing around with different barrels. But the extractors arent my favorite. They work fine but I like the ping fling feeling my other builds give me. I can finish a Savage for about $2k and a 700 is going to be more like $3k.


I have a stock 700 receiver I can build too. Also got drawers full of everything else needed to finish including a new PTG bolt. I just need to figure out my chamber and order a barrel blank.

[LynnJr]

I have built long action magnums on a short action receiver and while not ideal it's not as bad as it sounds. If you gave a long action 700 available here is how I would go about it.

Add a Davidson or score high single shot follower to the action. They run $10-$20 and you put a few drops of epoxy or JB Weld on them and let them dry.
Next I would order up a PT&G bolt with a 0.701 bolt body M16 extractor large diamond fluting Lapua boltface and 0.062 firing pin.
I would order up and extra long straight handle threaded for another $20.
I would order up a firing pin assembly that has the 0.062 firing and make sure it has the Lawton bolt shroud which is tighter.
The entire assembly will run $300 making it a big investment. Once you get it as they take around 2 months I would send it to Dan Armstrong at Accu-Tig in Alaska. Put it all in some paper towels and he will tig weld the handle on. It runs $40 plus $8 for shipping and takes about one week.
I would then go to the Grizzly Industries website and order up a Bartlein 9 or 9.34 twist barrel in max heavy varmint contour 28 or 30 inches long.
I would have BillyGoat Machine or Randall thread and chamber it and add a Harrell Bros Muzzlebrake set up for a large bore. That just means it has bigger port holes than your typical 22 centerfire would use and they run $30.

Next would be a trigger so Jewell works for me but everybody likes what they like so pick whatever you prefer.

For a stock I like the Tooley MBR sold by McMillan or the Shehane MBR sold by Bill Shehane.
If you like chassis get a chassis they all work.

[ELR Researcher]

Oscar keeps a list of all the guns that have scored Shooter Points on the URSA website. There is a complete breakdown of cartridges, bullets, actions, and barrels. It's worth noting that there might be easier ways to do things now than were available in the past. The Receiver Matrix is a separate document that lists key features and dimensions for every aftermarket action I've ever heard of.

The equipment list is the second line from the top here - https://www.unlimitedrange.org/stats.html

The receivers matrix is on my ELR Resources site, first link (in the "body" of the material) from the top at https://www.elr-resources.com/page3.html

Shaun - thanks for the plug.