Upgrading bases and rings

[Jarhead]

How expensive is your Rifle? Scope? Hunt?

Buy accordingly, doesn't mean you need a Military Sniper Set Up.

[Tacit Blue]

I have a Howa Targetmaster, a package intended for shooting target. I have a cheap Nikko Sterling 4x16 mildot scope that came with it.


More or less, trying to find a better setup for rings and a base. But maybe I should be looking at a new scope in all reality.

[postal]

All the above.... actually.

So, since I'm banned from the optics forum..... and this thread should go there.....

Depending on the distance you plan on shooting, a 4-16 might be fine, or go up to a higher power.

Personally I recommend nikon buckmaster, SWFA super sniper, sightron SIII series, vortex viper PST/razor, bushnell DMR, and hear good things about the higher end redfields but no experience with them.

All these recommend above can fit a budget as low as $300ish to over $1,300 and well beyond that for the razor.

I like steel bases/rings.

[Tacit Blue]

Good to hear. In your opinion do you think a mixture of aluminium and steel is ok? or should be matched to pair with the combo.

[postal]

Steel base for sure is my recommendation.

With a steel base, you can use steel or alu rings.

Do NOT PUT steel rings on an alu base....

You *can* use alu base and rings.... but with with a steel base, you can use whatever....

[Shakey]

Do NOT PUT steel rings on an alu base....

Why not? I'm asking because I've used that combination and not noticed any issues.

[postal]

The pressure of the steel ring cross bolts can damage or warp an alu base.

So, the generally accepted rule is....

steel base - steel rings are fine

steel base - alu rings are fine

alu base -alu rings are fine.

Do not put steel rings on alu base. You might jack up the base. Depends on the suggested torque settings of the cross bolts.

[Shakey]

The pressure of the steel ring cross bolts can damage or warp an alu base.

The clamping force from steel is exactly the same as the clamping force from aluminum. 65 in/lbs is the highest torque spec I know of for crossbolts, that's like 5.5 ft/lbs. You really think you can hurt an aluminum rail in compression with that little force? Sounds like an OWT to me.

[postal]

Sounds like me parroting what people I know and trust have been saying for YEARS. People that I compete with, people that run training seminars and such...

Hm... last I checked, alu was softer than most steels. Even the anodized ones... which alu is it? 6061 or 7075? is it type 3 hard anodize?

Now look at the contact area that gets 'clamped' (crushed) on when tightening the crossbolts.... pretty small area taking the bulk of the pressure..... ya know that narrow angled edge....

And thats not even getting into the action being flat, and the deflection of the base when it gets bolted down if it isnt flat... hence why I bed all my bases with JB weld....

[JMP]

Postal, it's kind of a moot point. I have no idea why folks would use steel mounts or rings (I do like steel bases, though). The best scopes are made with aluminum tubes. You really ought to use the same aluminum rings/mount as your scope since it'll expand and contract at the same rate, putting less stress on the tube. Plus, it's lighter and tends to provide better grip (less torque needed to hold it steady). I'd never get steel rings unless I had a VERY compelling reason.

[Jarhead]

http://precisionrifleblog.com/2014/10/28/scope-mounts-what-the-pros-use/

[Shakey]

Postal, it's kind of a moot point. I have no idea why folks would use steel mounts or rings (I do like steel bases, though). The best scopes are made with aluminum tubes. You really ought to use the same aluminum rings/mount as your scope since it'll expand and contract at the same rate, putting less stress on the tube.

That's an interesting point. You are dealing with a system that generally has an aluminum (scope) tube at the top and a steel (receiver) tube on the bottom, you can use material selection to put the expansion where you think it will do the least harm. From that perspective, I'd probably want to have my base and scope tube made out of the same material (to keep from bending the scope tube) and put the expansion stresses in the base/receiver interface.

It's all academic though because the amounts of relative expansion are tiny, on the order of 1 mil, unless you are installing your scope on hot summer day in Palm Springs and shooting in the middle of an Alaskan blizzard.

[Horrendo Revolver]

I've been mounting scopes for a long time. As part of my job at Cabela's I'm also one of my stores primary scope mounters.

I've mounted steel rings on Weaver aluminum bases for years with no issues on lever action and 10/22 rifles. I do prefer steel bases and rings though. They don't need to be high dollar. On my own firearms I use Warne unless the rifle is drilled and tapped off center and then I use Leupold Std for the coarse windage adjustment. I only have one rifle that I needed to do that with, a Marlin 336. There are other equally well or better methods for correcting misaligned holes, that is just the method I use. I recently decided to start using EGW bases because you can place the rings anywhere you want to. That is what I'll use in the future.

I always blue loctite the base screws but never the ring screws.

For leveling I use a Segway on the firearm in combination with the level that sits on the scope from the Wheeler Level Level - contingent upon having a flat surface on the scope and the firearm. But that isn't always possible. When levels won't work I use a "Reticle Tru". They are made by a guy in Montana and mine is a second, there is supposed to be a cosmetic flaw on but I cannot find one.

I cannot stand factory Tikka rings but have never known them to fail.

Under the category of cheap rings Redfield are the best IMO.

Last but not least, I always install gyro meters, tachometers, bump guards and some form of birth control on scope rings. It is low tech but it works.

This is my first post so go easy on a Texan with an 8th grade education.

Anyone know if Luau Larry's is still in business on Catalina Island?

[Tacit Blue]

Gents,

Thanks for the advice. I choose the following setup Night Force 20 MOA STD duty rail with TPS 30mm TSR rings.

[postal]

Good quality stuff there.

You wont be disappointed. A little tooth pic dab of blue locktite on everything. Base screws, cross bolts, and scope ring screws so nothing comes loose.